Anti-Piracy Group Sues Torrent Site Webhost for Damages

Ernesto
August 2, 2012
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Hollywood-backed anti-piracy outfit BREIN is going after a former hosting provider of SumoTorrent and demanding compensation for the damages caused by the torrent site. Hosting provider XS Networks previously refused to take the site offline or reveal the identity of the owners unless it was presented with a court order. XS Networks’ lawyer Steven Kroesbergen accuses BREIN of deliberately destroying the company to intimidate other hosting providers.

Every year Dutch anti-piracy group BREIN claims to shut down a few hundred torrent sites, but SumoTorrent has never been among them.

Back in 2007 BREIN managed to kick the torrent site out of the Netherlands where it was hosted by Leaseweb, but it continued to operate from Canada. Later, SumoTorrent returned to the Netherlands at XS Networks, again attracting the attention of BREIN.

Hoping to take the site quickly offline, the anti-piracy group asked XS Networks to shut it down and hand over the personal details of the owner. XS Networks refused and said it would only respond to a court order.

The provider and SumoTorrent eventually agreed to voluntarily hand over some personal details, but not before the torrent site had moved to a new host in the Ukraine. To make matters worse for BREIN, the personal details on record at the hosting provider turned out to be false. So SumoTorrent escaped again, and according to BREIN the Dutch hosting provider is to blame.

The anti-piracy group has taken the matter to court and is demanding damages from XS Networks. BREIN argues that the provider acted negligently when it refused to take the site down when asked to do so. Aside from thousands of euros in legal costs, BREIN also wants the provider to pay for the infringing content that was downloaded via SumoTorrent.

During a hearing at a The Hague court yesterday the group demanded 20,000 euros to compensate for the legal expenses incurred to date, plus added damages for yet-to-be-calculated copyright infringements.

BREIN further said that it suspects XS Networks of holding back information that could identify the SumoTorrent owner, a claim the hosting company denies. XS Networks did say during the hearing that it would hand over a relevant bank statement to the anti-piracy group.

BREIN’s lawyer noted that their purpose is to deal with sites such as SumoTorrent, but XS Networks’ lawyer Steven Kroesbergen sees things differently. He thinks BREIN’s plan was to deliberately destroy XS Networks through expensive legal proceedings, so they can intimidate other hosting companies in the same manner.

The Court now has to decide whether the provider can indeed be held liable for infringements that occurred through a torrent site they hosted. This will be an important verdict – a loss for XS Networks means that other Dutch hosting providers will face serious liability issues.

For XS Networks it is already too late. The company pulled the plug earlier this year and left the following statement:

“In our opinion there is nothing illegal about the websites that were hosted with XS Networks and we are thankful for the warm messages from other webhosters and appreciation of our clients.”

“The web is all about innovation and changing the rules. Change which some industries are fighting for years, by throwing money out of the window on law-suits instead of a new business model.”

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Anyone

the MAFIAA killing innovation once more

it’s about time those criminal organizations get outlawed and dealt with
- Vincent Giannell
  
  Doubt it. Those organizations will try to deny the fact that their criminals and blame their activities on file-sharing.
- http://tehparadox.com/ tehPARADOX
  
  Nothing is ever going to happen unless someone with pockets as deep, takes them head on.
  - Guest
    
    Or until we put a bullet in the head of each of these corporate parasites after we are done with the bankers.
    - kurgan2001
      
      Amen to that
IvorBigun

brien is a bunch of gareth hunts
DaveyBoySmithe

Brien = Bunch of C**ts.
- Davey Boy Smithe
  
  *Brein* = Bunch of C**ts
- Alfred Nonymous
  
  The group’s name is “BREIN”, which stands for “Bescherming Rechten Entertainment Industrie Nederland” (Protection of the Rights of the Dutch Entertainment Industry, own translation). Though the word “brein” also means “brain” in Dutch.
  - Scytale
    
    There is a Dutch entertainment industry?!?
http://torrentfreak.com/ Rob8urcakes

I’m getting really fed-up with these bullying tactics that have no basis in law whatsoever, yet our Courts always appear eager to hear their shit.

We now need strong laws protecting us from these vicious animals who simply threaten law suits and cost our friendly hosts a fortune in legal fees – cash that would otherwise be used to improve the networks and facilities.

Let’s start putting pressure on our own politicians, Country by Country.
- guest
  
  The problem is that hardly any judge or lawyer is up-to-speed on current day tech.
  
  All those morons do at BREIN is run up a wild story that takes several hours making it all sound technical so the judge loses track, then the defenders say a few things in the time thats left (if theres any) and the judge just takes the side that sounded the most impressive.
  
  What every country need are lawyers and judges that specialize in these cases alone. And only they should be allowed to take on these cases.
  Problem solved (for atleast in the netherlands with current day laws).
  - http://torrentfreak.com/ Rob8urcakes
    
    Given the various and very different technical and personal issues concerned in these cases by ALL parties involved in this shit, I tend to agree that it well be time for Countries worldwide to start creating specialised Courts or at least Tribunals to hear and decide upon these cases.
    
    And given the nature of the apparent problem – which of course is rooted in the lack of political will to deal with CopyWrong law – these CopyWrong charlatans will continue to con, harass and fool ordinary people out of what little cash they have.
    
    In fact, I’m now going to write to my local MP (ie Member of Parliament), my MSPs (Members of the Scottish Parliament) and my MEPs (Members of the European Parliament) to bring such Tribunals into being ASAP.
    
    Good one guest = a megaThumbsUp.
Pingback: Torrent News » Anti-Piracy Group Sues Torrent Site Webhost for Damages
http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater

Hosting providers not acting on piracy will eventually end up in court and/or having to pull the plug.
- Guest
  
  But it will NEVER reduce piracy, I know lots of people lend CD’s and DVD’s to people and they are copied. How do you propose to stop people from lending CD’s and DVD’s to each other. You can’t
  - http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
    
    Lending CD’s for copying is perfectly legal in Sweden at least, provided that they’re originals and not pirate copies. This is compensated using a tax connected to empty CDs.
    
    You cant’ stop all shoplifting either. But it’s important to reduce both shoplifting and piracy.
    - Guest
      
      Like I said you will NEVER reduce piracy. More piracy occurs offline then it does through the internet. If you wish to spend your time and money in reducing piracy then that is your time and money to waste and believe me it is your time and money to waste.
    - Anyone
      
      that levy should be illegal and be removed
      none of it goes to the artist, it’s all just the MAFIAA keeping it, as usual
      
      and despite paying the levy on media I am still not legally allowed to copy media
      
      FUCK YOU!
    - Blackbeard
      
      So they assume everyone buying blank CDs is going to make copies of originals on them? In other words, they assume everyone buying blank CDs is a criminal? Say I make a few songs and want to physically release them. Until I can press my own CDs, I’ll be buying blanks and making my own labels to put on them. This tax I pay.. it’s paid despite me having no intention of putting the CD anywhere near someone elses copyrighted works. Part of my manufacturing costs is paying other people to appease them over my assumed infringement of their copyrights, even though that infringement never happens. Does this tax money even go to the copyrights holders?
    - Jillstein
      
      False equivalency as no one is “shoplifting”, rather as you stated in your paragraph “copying” or the duplication of information or an artifac. Also, you assume these people copy their cds and dvds on blank disks, but I bet the large majority copy them on to hard drives and usb’s and the media they are copying never sees that tax unless they compensate this with a tax on hard drives as well…
    - Anonymous
      
      So your answer is to keep on with the embezzlement and the industrial theft of assets that the MAFIAA have as a business model? yeah, they only exist thanks to all the bribery oh sorry I mean lobbying.
    - http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
      
      @f05af58b8c10e93b3595bb996aad4e5d:disqus
      
      “that levy should be illegal and be removed
      none of it goes to the artist”
      
      Actually it does, based on top charts but that doesn’t match the actual downloading. The only way to pay all artists fair is to spy on all downloaders.
    - http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
      
      @1eebf0f8d2307eda3853b34c32ea570f:disqus
      
      “So they assume everyone buying blank CDs is going to make copies of originals on them? In other words, they assume everyone buying blank CDs is a criminal? Say I make a few songs and want to physically release them. Until I can press my own CDs, I’ll be buying blanks and making my own labels to put on them. This tax I pay..”
      
      In this case you don’t have to pay the tax, but you must apply for an exception.
    - http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
      
      @68a679a16cca078c6fd50f8c73301a74:disqus
      
      “Also, you assume these people copy their cds and dvds on blank disks, but I bet the large majority copy them on to hard drives and usb’s and the media they are copying never sees that tax unless they compensate this with a tax on hard drives as well…”
      
      No the tax is not on hard drives in PCs but also on removable media and hard drives in fixed set top boxes and similar.
    - DannyUfonek
      
      All of this tax (which is also on HDDs, DVDs, USBs, etc.) goes to private companies (OSA in the Czech Republic, other countries have the same thing, but under a different name) which keep the lion’s share and divide the rest amongst the most popular artists. Of course, nobody really knows how much who gets. Nothing is transparent. And at least that needs to change, if not outlaw it altogether.
      
      Is it fair for a private company, serving private interests, to get law-guaranteed taxes from the state solely for themselves, without anyone knowing where the money really goes?
    - Anyone
      
      @nejtillpirater:disqus
      “No the tax is not on hard drives in PCs”
      
      it is in my country
      as such I feel like I have paid for all the media from the MAFIAA I download when I bought my NAS and paid this extortionist tax.
      now, it is sad that none of this goes to the artist and all of it goes to the MAFIAA, and that should be changed, but the MAFIAA will not see another dime from me besides this “tax”
    - Elyssa
      
      re “blackbeard”
      
      under this presumption, we have already paid for copying data, so it ok to do so as we have paid the tax, then mafiaa and friends sue, and intimidate, and say they are for music rights, then pocket the money to give to anti piracy orgs. If thats not recognized in court, then nothing should ever be.
    - Elyssa
      
      “npirate”
      In this case you don’t have to pay the tax, but you must apply for an exception.
      
      Can you document the proper procedure to do this. Also this would send up red flags to mafiaa and freinds to say “independent, must shut down, does not comply”
    - http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
      
      @4aa36dcd239f0fc10249081157518935:disqus
      
      “Can you document the proper procedure to do this. Also this would send up red flags to mafiaa and freinds to say “independent, must shut down, does not comply”"
      
      Yes I can (in Swedish):
      
      http://www.copyswede.se/privatkopieringsersattning/undantag/
    - http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
      
      @4aa36dcd239f0fc10249081157518935:disqus
      
      “under this presumption, we have already paid for copying data, so it ok to do so as we have paid the tax, then mafiaa and friends sue, and intimidate, and say they are for music rights, then pocket the money to give to anti piracy orgs. If thats not recognized in court, then nothing should ever be.”
      
      No, the tax is only compensation for legal copying of originals, to a few friends and family. It’s not compensation for piracy.
    - Anyone
      
      @nejtillpirater:disqus
      everyone is my friend, I am just that social!
    - Guest
      
      “The only way to pay all artists fair is to spy on all downloaders.”
      
      Too bad the MAFIAA doesn’t pay artists any of the money it steals through its anti-piracy efforts.
      
      In reality, the only way for all artists to get paid fairly is for them to leave the MAFIAA and look back.
    - Guest
      
      *never look back
      
      Although I guess they could look back if only to laugh =D
    - http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
      
      @f05af58b8c10e93b3595bb996aad4e5d:disqus
      
      “everyone is my friend, I am just that social!”
      
      Good luck trying that in court.
    - http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
      
      @ac772b48d6728242138b1df18c9716e5:disqus
      
      “In reality, the only way for all artists to get paid fairly is for them to leave the MAFIAA and look back.”
      
      More silly talk about the MAFIAA.
      
      1. It’s completely voluntarily to sign a record contract. Do you want a law against that?
      2. Artist that run their own record company are subject to piracy in the same way as those who sign a record contract
    - Guest
      
      @Nejtillfail:twitter
      
      “More silly talk about the MAFIAA.”
      
      Rights group fined for not paying artists for anti-piracy ad
      
      Record labels to pay 45 million for pirating artists’ music
      
      Copyright group prosecuted for failing to pay artists
      
      RIAA accounting: how to sell 1 million albums and still owe 500,000
      
      The RIAA saw sales increase this year!
      
      “1. It’s completely voluntarily to sign a record contract.
      
      And once you sign a contract with the MAFIAA, they own you and proceed to mercilessly exploit you while stealing over 90% of the money you earn. Good luck leaving.
      
      “Artist that run their own record company are subject to piracy in the same way as those who sign a record contract”
      
      The artists who sign a record contract with the MAFIAA get perpetually robbed by the MAFIAA. Advantage? Indies.
    - Haha
      
      Spot on-Well said.
    - IDIOCRACY
      
      I just took my 2TB drive to my brother and he made a ghost image of it on a drive of his own, for you to guess what was on it…hehe (no no… there was no porn).
  - http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
    
    @3981438dbd30b9a24e79ba8f457ff732:disqus
    
    “So your answer is to keep on with the embezzlement and the industrial theft of assets that the MAFIAA have as a business model?”
    
    No I think that the model must be revised in some way.
    - Anyone
      
      the MAFIAA simply has to step aside and release the artists from their crippling contracts
      
      that way everyone is helped, the artists get more than just 10% of their earnings, there are no more greedy cunts bribing the politicians to take away our freedoms, no more interference with new technology
      
      that would be a perfect revision
    - ThumbsUpThumbsDown
      
      The “model” should be abolished……..More importantly……Look around you…..whether in the courts or out……that “model”….. is all too quickly…. becoming irrelevant..
- Anyone
  
  but they should not have to act
  they should be neutral relays of information
  
  what Brein is doing here is despicable, ruining a legal business just to try and hang on to their monopoly, because they cannot compete in the free market
  - http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
    
    Companies doing legal business have user agreements that require that the users follow the law. Companies supporting illegal business don´t care, hence they are willing to risk ending up in court. It’s their free choice to do that but then it’s also their free choice to have to face the consequences.
    - Anyone
      
      they did follow the law
      
      it is not part of the law to take every site BREIN disagrees with offline
      and again, it is despicable that BREIN even demands that
      
      those assholes should spend their time on improving their offerings so they can compete on the free market instead of wasting tax payer money trying to cling on to their failed business model
    - Guest
      
      And this company supported illegal business did they? Has the court in The Hague reached there verdict and passed sentence on this company yet? What constitutes as being against the law in your country may certainly well be lawful in other countries.
    - watfordjc
      
      Illegal business? All I see here is an “association of companies” suing a dead company. Illegal suggests criminality, this is a civil lawsuit and nowhere are the authorities (police and criminal courts) mentioned as being involved.
      
      Users follow the law? What law? XS Networks could have leased some servers to Twitter, Google, or Pirate Bay. Under Article 14 of the E-Commerce Directive XS Networks is exempt from liability of unlawful activities of customers. That means they can’t be successfully sued in any such civil lawsuit.
      
      XS Networks should file a counter claim for damage of business and the shareholder(s) should be awarded damages for loss of earnings, and artists should launch a lawsuit against BREIN for wasting money on an idiotic lawsuit (oh, wait, their contracts say they will stop getting royalties if they sue anyone even loosely affiliated with their label).
      
      Oh, the courts should throw in €10,000,000 each to the shareholders that made the decisions at XS Networks for defamation. Your post should be included in evidence as “views of someone that believes those running the company conducted illegal business despite no criminal prosecution or conviction. These views would not have existed without BREIN’s frivolous lawsuit and libel in press releases.”
      
      If XS Networks BV had to close shop because they had no money left, spending any money on a civil lawsuit against “them” (the shareholders are only liable up to the value of the shares, what assets does XS Solutions have?) sounds silly. Has the Enterprise Chamber got involved to investigate if mismanagement occurred? No mention in the article.
      
      You are OK with BREIN suing XS Networks BV for damages for copyright infringement? What percentage of each infringement is XS Networks liable for, and what percentage is SumoTorrent liable for, and what percentage is the initial seeder liable for, and what percentage is each seeder liable for, and what percentage is each non-uploading leacher liable for?
      
      If the groups you support are to be believed, annual copyright infringement would equate to several times the GDP of Earth. If the damages awarded equate to 100% of the value of “lost sales”, won’t BREIN have succeeded in making precedent that pirates and torrent sites are liable for 0% of infringements?
      
      IANAL, although I do wonder if you know more about Dutch and EU law than me, or if you’re more like the USA telling Martians it’s illegal for them to put a missile grid around their planet under “international” Space Law treaties.
- Nejtillfittungar
  
  äckliga lilla fittunge
  - http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
    
    You’ll grow up some day, I’m sure of that.
    - IDIOCRACY
      
      you too liking your own post
    - Idiot detected.
      
      Nejtillpirater, is that you?
      http://imgur.com/kZPxn
- Elyssa
  
  Every post you write is anti pirate where u have pirate in your username. You are a troll, well documented in every thing u write on this site. Fuck off
  - http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
    
    The name means “No to pirates” in Swedish. I’m not a troll.
    - Fredrika
      
      > “I’m not a troll.”
      
      Do trolls usually admit to being trolls?
      
      In reality whether ot not someone actually is a troll or not is not deterined by the individuals admittance or denial, it’s determined by an eventual recurring use of logical fallacies. For some reason you do resort to logical fallacies a lot, as is evident by your astonishing large amount of straw-man arguments, and even more frequent use of guilt by association arguments. There’s even a logical fallacy present in your signature, if you weren’t aware of that fact. =)
    - JaPiratkopiering
      
      Here is what we think of you Nejtillpirater and the Swedish anti-pirate people.
      
      Is this a picture of you next to this good advice?
- Guest
  
  “Hosting providers not acting on piracy will eventually end up in court ”
  
  Did XS Networks end up in court? No, they did not. They did absolutely the right thing by refusing to comply with BREIN’s demands unless served with a court order. They followed due process and obeyed the law.
  
  BREIN was trying to break and subvert the law by ordering XS to take SumoTorrent offline and hand over user data, without having any legal authority to do so.
  
  As usual, the pro-copyright thugs act more like criminals than any of the supposed “badguys” do.
- Violated0
  
  Even if all BT sites shut down the BT network can be searched for media independently making file-sharing unstoppable.
  - http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
    
    And then there will be new actions to counter that. Nothing is ever completely unstoppable.
    - Anonymous
      
      Just like nothing is ever completely stoppable either. look at current drugs laws.
- Idiot detected.
  
  Nejtillpirater, is that you?
  http://imgur.com/kZPxn
Byte Master

As long as Chris Hensen is the Judge, BREIN has nothing to worry about;

http://falkvinge.net/2012/05/12/dutch-judge-who-ordered-pirate-bay-links-censored-found-to-be-corrupt/

because if BREIN “asks” you to take something down, then it carries the same weight as a court order, no? It’s not like it’s just some foundation… oh, wait.
- Guest
  
  and we all know how corrupt this judge is don’t we.
Vincent Giannell

I have a feeling BREIN will end up getting sued itself in the end.
- http://www.facebook.com/people/Don-Dilly/1624894683 Don Dilly
  
  The courts should slam BREIN for their xtrajudicial extortion tactics.
  
  XS is in the right as data held by them on their clients is not only commercially sensitive but also protected throughout the EU by privacy laws. XS did not say they would not cooperate with BREIN, it merely stated they should get a court order. This is as much for XS’s own protection as to hand over such data without a court order would leave them open to being sued by clients.
  
  Likewise if it takes down a business website by termination of contract without giving the client adequate notice they leave themselves open to court action by the client.
  
  Ultimately it is not for BREIN or the hosting company to determine if a website is infringing to the extent it warrants being shut down. That can only legally be determinedd and done in such a manner as to protect the host if done through the courts.
  
  Thisis yet another example of BREIN arrogance in acting as if it is above the law.
Vincent Giannell

“In our opinion there is nothing illegal about the websites that were
hosted with XS Networks and we are thankful for the warm messages from
other webhosters and appreciation of our clients.”

“The web is all about innovation and changing the rules. Change which
some industries are fighting for years, by throwing money out of the
window on law-suits instead of a new business model.”

Hearing this message, BREIN will think they’re lying about them.
- Guest
  
  BREIN will probably sue everyone who they accuse of lying. lol
  - Vincent Giannell
    
    Unless they get sued back for false accusations.
    - Guest
      
      Well i certainly hope so. It’s about time companies got a back bone and sue back.
jesuschrist

No reasonable court should even take this suit seriously. May as well hold liable the electric company that supplied power to sumotorrent.
Hell sue mozilla, google, M$ and opera for enabling users to browse and download copyrighted material, where does it end?
http://twitter.com/Anime4PSP Anime 4 PSP

How lame. I wonder how long they can go getting more and more idiotic ideas each time. Will their well of idiocy ever run dry?
- Cunty
  
  I’ve got an idiotic idea for them:
  
  How about taking all the money they were going to give to lawyers… and give it to the artists instead?
http://profiles.google.com/pianogamer Knut Harald

The site is no longer Dutch, which pretty much equals a takedown of the site (by the juriscation of BREINs demands). Yet they keep whining…
Anonymous

i am assuming that Brein has bribed whoever necessary so that Judge Chris Hensen, the corrupt arse hole member of the entertainment industry, will be trying the case! let’s face it, the only way they manage to win any copyright case in Holland is to get him on the bench!
- Guest
  
  Well I am sure we will all know who the judge was when an outcome has been made on this case.
- Guest
  
  If Chris Hensen is the judge and they rule in favour of BREIN I am sure the verdict could well be appealed.
Anon99

If this is successful, someone needs to follow the money trail for the corrupt Dutch judge(s) and expose them properly. The knock on effect could reverse many of the decisions they made recently.
- Anyone
  
  http://falkvinge.net/2012/05/12/dutch-judge-who-ordered-pirate-bay-links-censored-found-to-be-corrupt/
  
  it’s already been done, and nothing happened
Pingback: Anti-Piracy Group Sues Torrent Site Webhost for Damages | Best Seedbox
Rusty Shackelford

If online piracy is stopped, we’ll just find another way, while sales continue to plummet.

Pretty easy to rent a DVD or Blu-Ray then copy. Can even go to a library and check out CDs, DVDs, and book then copy them.
- http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
  
  “Pretty easy to rent a DVD or Blu-Ray then copy. Can even go to a library and check out CDs, DVDs, and book then copy them.”
  
  Pretty easy but not as easy as downloading online. If you “cut the cable to the Internet”, piracy will probably be reduced with a factor of 100 or similar. All that can be done theoretically will not be done if involves more steps and require use of external media, traveling etc. People are lazy. Illegal download is way too simple and cheap, that’s the main problem.
  - Anyone
    
    according to the MAFIAA’s own studies most of piracy is currently happening offline (don’t ask me how they know)
    as such even if you cut the internet piracy would continue
    
    and yes, people are lazy
    as such it should be easy for the MAFIAA to create a service that offers a better way of getting the media other than piracy. but they are much to preoccupied selling plastic discs and poisoning the files with DRM to do that
    
    in the last few decades no innovation has come from the MAFIAA, in fact they tried to destroy everything that could be perceived as a threat, including VHS which turned out to be their biggest cash cow
    
    they are simply assholes that rather sue everybody into oblivion instead of facing the fact that they are obsolete
    - http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
      
      “according to the MAFIAA’s own studies most of piracy is currently happening offline (don’t ask me how they know)as such even if you cut the internet piracy would continue”
      
      Based on one study? I don’t believe that. It’s probably also so that the offline piracy is based on the online piracy. Some pirates download a lot that they then share with others offline.
      
      “and yes, people are lazyas such it should be easy for the MAFIAA to create a service that offers a better way of getting the media other than piracy. but they are much to preoccupied selling plastic discs and poisoning the files with DRM to do that”
      
      Haven’t you heard? They don’t sell many plastic discs anymore. Heard of digital music? iTunes? Spotify?
      
      “in the last few decades no innovation has come from the MAFIAA, in fact they tried to destroy everything that could be perceived as a threat, including VHS which turned out to be their biggest cash cow”
      
      Can you please define who the members of the “MAFIAA” are? Use of this word is really silly, like fighting your own straw man.
      
      What are iTunes, App store, Spotify, Voddler….. No innovation? If it’s good it’s not the “MAFIAA”?
    - Anyone
      
      @nejtillpirater:disqus
      iTunes, Appstore, Spotify, Voddler are innovations by the tech industry that took YEARS of begging and pleading to get some deals available, the MAFIAA wanted those services eliminated, and they still do, they just haven’t found a way how.
      
      for example they try to ruin Netflix with higher licensing cost, longer delay windows etc., all just to screw them over as much as possible.
      
      they will fight everything that goes against their business model until progress cannot be stopped anymore
      it happened with the LP, it happened with VHS, it is happening with the internet
      
      it’s time the whole industry dies and we can move on to a better future without those assholes
    - Guest
      
      @nejtillpirater:disqus
      “according to the MAFIAA’s own studies most of piracy is currently
      happening offline (don’t ask me how they know)as such even if you cut
      the internet piracy would continue”
      
      Based on one study? I don’t believe that. It’s probably also so that
      the offline piracy is based on the online piracy. Some pirates download a
      lot that they then share with others offline.
      
      So Nejtillpiarter you DON’T believe the study conducted by the RIAA with regards to offline piracy being more than online piracy that was leaked and reported to TorrentFreak the other day? So you don’t believe the report of the very people who take a very dislike to piracy?
      
      Actually a lot of piracy is indeed conducted offline. Thousands and thousands of children around the world get CD’s and DVD’s for FREE as birthday and christmas presents and then they lend them to there school friends who in turn copy them to other CD’s and DVD’s and also onto their hard drives.
      
      Still if you DON’T want to believe the piracy report that was conducted by the RIAA who take a very dislike to piracy who state that offline piracy is more than online piracy then that is your loss not ours.
    - Guest
      
      “Based on one study? I don’t believe that. ”
      
      You don’t believe something if inly one study says it? Okay, then I guess you believe that pirates are the best customers because that’s what multiple studies have found.
      
      http://www.google DOT com/search?hl=en&source=hp&q=pirates+%22buy+more%22
      
      If you don’t believe it then you’ve violated your own logic of one study = not true, multiple studies = true.
      
      Are studies only true when you agree with them, Nejjy?
      
      “Can you please define who the members of the “MAFIAA” are?”
      
      This has been defined for you multiple times. Please stop playing dumb. “MAFIAA” is the collective term for organized copyright thugs like the RIAA, MPAA, IFPI, BPI, BREIN etc.
    - Guest
      
      @nejtillpirater:disqus
      C’mon, Nej, even you can’t be this dense. You regularly support whatever the RIAA and the relevant alphabet organisations present. This study was not only supported by the RIAA, but it was researched by the group that the RIAA gets all its (bogus) statistics from. It must be true! After all, it wasn’t researched by anyone else that might be sympathetic to pirates!
      
      Oh, by the way, I’m still waiting for you to answer the question of how artists benefit from anti-piracy lawsuits meant to recoup their losses which they won’t be seeing any money from…
    - http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
      
      @ac772b48d6728242138b1df18c9716e5:disqus
      
      “C’mon, Nej, even you can’t be this dense. You regularly support whatever the RIAA and the relevant alphabet organisations present.”That’s not true.”This study was not only supported by the RIAA, but it was researched by the group that the RIAA gets all its (bogus) statistics from. It must be true! After all, it wasn’t researched by anyone else that might be sympathetic to pirates!”Even so, it doesn’t answer the question – from where comes the files shared offline? It may be so that most of it comes from downloading.”Oh, by the way, I’m still waiting for you to answer the question of how artists benefit from anti-piracy law”
      
      They benefit by having and increased number of sold CDs, digital music on iTunes etc. Also note that the record companies take the economical risks, new artists can get help from them and start a career without putting in their own money. Same with authors and movie makers. It’s like getting employed in any business, the company that hires you takes all the risks and you can concentrate on what you’re good at, interested in etc. And it’s a free choice to sign a contract.
    - Fredrika
      
      > “They benefit by having and increased number of sold CDs, digital music on iTunes etc. Also note that the record companies take the economical risks, new artists can get help from them and start a career without putting in their own money. Same with authors and movie makers. It’s like getting employed in any business, the company that hires you takes all the risks and you can concentrate on what you’re good at, interested in etc. And it’s a free choice to sign a contract.”
      
      Is your partial reply an admission to being dense, as suggested by the person which you responded to, since you didn’t argue against that possible reason?
    - Guest
      
      @Nejjy:twitter
      
      As I pointed out in the comment you intentionally ignored, pirates are the best paying customers. And as I also pointed out in another comment(which you will also ignore), the RIAA just made more money than ever.
      How do artists benefit from the MAFIAA’s fight against piracy when piracy isn’t an actual problem, when the MAFIAA keeps all the money they win through litigation for themselves instead of giving ANY of it to artists, and when the MAFIAA keeps failing to fight piracy at all anyway?
      
      Answer: they don’t. Artists don’t benefit one fuckin’ bit.
  - Fredrika
    
    > “Illegal download is way too simple and cheap, that’s the main problem.”
    
    For someone who enjoys culture it’s not a problem that culture is simple and cheap to access. That’s actually something good.
  - http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
    
    “according to the MAFIAA’s own studies most of piracy is currently happening offline (don’t ask me how they know)
    as such even if you cut the internet piracy would continue”
    
    Based on one study? I don’t believe that. It’s probably also so that the offline piracy is based on the online piracy. Some pirates download a lot that they then share with others offline.
    
    “and yes, people are lazy
    as such it should be easy for the MAFIAA to create a service that offers a better way of getting the media other than piracy. but they are much to preoccupied selling plastic discs and poisoning the files with DRM to do that”
    
    Haven’t you heard? They don’t sell many plasitc discs anymore. Heard of digital music? iTunes? Spotify?
    
    “in the last few decades no innovation has come from the MAFIAA, in fact they tried to destroy everything that could be perceived as a threat, including VHS which turned out to be their biggest cash cow”
    
    Can you please define who the members of the “MAFIAA” are? Use of this word is really silly, like fighting your own straw man.
    - Anyone
      
      not in my region
      well, I could get music on iTunes, but most current music is utter crap, so I don’t bother and stick to my library
      Spotify is not available
      
      tv-series is not available on iTunes for me, neither is Netflix or Hulu
      besides, iTunes is a piece of crap software that I really don’t want to install, it’s nowhere near easier than piracy
      
      the MAFIAA is the MPAA and RIAA and their local derivates
      basically the people exploiting the artists and screwing over fans while creating nothing of value
      the name is just so appropriate, they run a protection scheme “for the artists”, all the while buying politicians, cops and judges, just like the real mafia does
    - http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
      
      @f05af58b8c10e93b3595bb996aad4e5d:disqus
      
      “the MAFIAA is the MPAA and RIAA and their local derivates
      basically the people exploiting the artists and screwing over fans while creating nothing of value
      the name is just so appropriate, they run a protection scheme “for the artists”, all the while buying politicians, cops and judges, just like the real mafia does”
      
      Bullshit. You can’t even list the companies in MAFIAA, MPAA or RIAA. It’s a straw man you’ve created in your fantasy.
      
      In the real world there are thousands or rather millions of companies involved in the music or movie industry. Some are innovative, some are not. Some are owned by the artists themselves.
    - Anyone
      
      @nejtillpirater:disqus
      sure I can
      the RIAA is the “big four” of music: Sony, UMG, WMG, EMI
      the MPAA is the big hollywood studios: Viacom, Time Warner, Sony, Walt Disney, GE, News Corp, MGM
      
      do you want me to list all the local variations like BREIN, GEMA, etc? that would take some googling but since you are clearly to lazy to do
      
      also, interesting that you didn’t say anything about the comparison to the actual mafia.
      I take this as acceptance that their practices resemble each other closely
    - http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
      
      @f05af58b8c10e93b3595bb996aad4e5d:disqus
      
      “the RIAA is the “big four” of music: Sony, UMG, WMG, EMI
      the MPAA is the big hollywood studios: Viacom, Time Warner, Sony, Walt Disney, GE, News Corp, MGM”
      
      Is that your personal definition?
      
      Even if not, you contradict yourself.
      
      “creating nothing of value”
      
      So the works that these companies have produced and that are downloaded by the pirates, are actually worthless?
      
      And the “big four” own one 6th of Spotify, using new technology of the 21th century instead of file sharing of the 20th century.
      
      “also, interesting that you didn’t say anything about the comparison to the actual mafia.I take this as acceptance that their practices resemble each other closely”
      
      No, it’s actually the pirates that resemble the mafia. The record and movie companies have to work according to the laws. The mafia as well as the pirates ignore the law.
    - Fredrika
      
      > “..of Spotify, using new technology of the 21th century instead of file sharing of the 20th century.”
      
      Spotify has several limitations, and consumes meaningless economical resources that adds additional cost. P2P filesharing has none of those limitations, and it functions for free, demanding no economical resources that aren’t already there. In what universe is a service which has several consumer hostile limitations, a service which requires meaningless economical resources, considered an invention belong to a later century than an invention which has no limitations, demands no economical resources and offer a better product?
      
      > “No, it’s actually the pirates that resemble the mafia. The record and movie companies has to work according to the laws. The mafia as well as the pirates ignore the law.”
      
      Aah, so all people that break the law resemble the mafia? People walking red lights and you yourself when you drive to fast, which you have admitted to doing regularly?
      
      Do you know what guilt by association is? Please read up on that, and stay away from it if possible, since it is a logical fallacy, and regular use of that actually does make you a troll, which you for some reason believe yourself not to be one..
    - Anyone
      
      @nejtillpirater:disqus
      those companies don’t create anything, the artists they exploit create whatever they are trying to sell copies of
      they want to close all other tools of promotion like TPB to keep those artists exploited and under their thumb.
      surely owning a 6th of Spotify was part of the deal to finally license the music to Spotify, it is in no way an innovation by the MAFIAA, they had to be dragged kicking and screaming to it, over many years of negotiations
      
      it’s easy to follow the “law” if you bribed the politicians to write it in your favour. it doesn’t make anything what the MAFIAA do moral in any way.
      the pirates on the other hand just want to share what they love with mankind, is there a nobler cause? we live in such culturally rich times despite the MAFIAA and because of the pirates, not the other way around.
    - Guest
      
      “You can’t even list the companies in MAFIAA, MPAA or RIAA. ”
      
      The MPAA and RIAA are companies in and of themselves, you sub-retard.
    - Guest
      
      “No, it’s actually the pirates that resemble the mafia.”
      
      BREIN tried to illegally order XS to shut down a website and hand over private information or else, and you’re saying pirates are the ones acting like the mafia? Is there an actual limit to your dishonesty or does it just stretch into the horizon for eternity?
      
      “The record and movie companies have to work according to the laws. ”
      
      Explain how they keep getting sued by artists, then.”MAFIAA ignores the law.”Fix’d.
    - http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
      
      @f05af58b8c10e93b3595bb996aad4e5d:disqus
      
      “those companies don’t create anything, the artists they exploit create whatever they are trying to sell copies of”
      
      Of course they create something, it’s a team effort that benefits both parts, in the same way as for any employee/employer relation. The artist decides, by free will, that a contract is beneficial to his/her career, income etc. In the same way as an engineer is employed to a company or decides to work completely on his own, start a new company etc.
      
      All this MAFIAA talk is just a bad excuse for continuing with the piracy.
    - Fredrika
      
      > “Of course they create something..”
      
      Of course, everyone produces something, at least once a day in the bathroom, but the discussion wasn’t about whatever waste that’s produced in whatever manner, it was about a specific creation, and that they they do not create. You do understand the difference between an actual creator and a non-creator?
      
      > “All this MAFIAA talk is just a bad excuse for continuing with the piracy.”
      
      You seem confused. People do not need an excuse for continuing with piracy, because they already own all the property involved. Ownership is one of the most fundamental excuses that exists, it’s universally accepted. If you own it, use it.
      
      And as you yourself involuntary pointed out yesterday, piracy is superior to any other service, so in what universe would anyone intelligent use an inferior service, when better services are available?.
    - http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
      
      @ac772b48d6728242138b1df18c9716e5:disqus
      
      “Explain how they keep getting sued by artists, then.”MAFIAA ignores the law.”Fix’d”
      
      All people make mistakes. If a record company e.g. breaks the law or the contract, they can of course be sued for it.
    - Fredrika
      
      > All people make mistakes. If a record company e.g. breaks the law or the contract, they can of course be sued for it.”
      
      The point wasn’t that mistakes are made, and the question wasn’t if they can be sued for it, so your entire reply is a straw-man argument. You seem hell-bent on using them whenever you can’t produce a relevant answer.
      
      But that’s an admittance from you then, that the Mafiaa, and other criminals such as yourself, are actually acting like the mafia?
    - Tom
      
      What are iTunes, App store, Spotify, Voddler….. No innovation? If it’s good it’s not the “MAFIAA”?
      
      None of those are available in my Country.
      
      All torrent sites are available in my Country.
      
      Can you see where there may be a problem?
  - Guest
    
    Piracy will NEVER be reduced by a factor of 100 or similar. More piracy occurs offline then it does offline according to the RIAA report regarding piracy that was leaked to TorrentFreak a few days ago. Thousands of school children are swapping there CD’s and DVD’s every day which they then copy. What you hope to be reduced online that you so called put it will only be replaced increasing offline so the reducement will never occur. You don’t have to have internet access to copy a CD or DVD and if you cut internet access to people they will only copy cd’s and dvd’s by other means so the piracy will never be reduced. Sure piracy may be reduced online if you prevent people from accessing the internet but in doing so will only increase piracy offline so piracy will never be reduced but will be more harder to reduce offline.
theonlyone

Might as well sue the webhosts mother for having a child that hosted a bit torrent sight. Fuckwads!
http://twitter.com/meekcritic Meek Critic

BREIN will lose this case. XS Networks isn’t obligated to hand over their customer’s personal details to anyone without a court order. If BREIN is able to successfully sue XS Networks then so can anyone else. This will be thrown out of court quickly.
FOrever

Fredrika keeps pwning Nejtillpirater
- Guest
  
  *Nejtillpirater reads comment as “Nejtillpirater keeps pwning Fredrika”, nods head in approval, snorts another line*
- Guest
  
  More like gullible people keep feeding him.
- http://nejtillpirater.wordpress.com/ Nejtillpirater
  
  Seen from a pirate’s perspective perhaps. But the police and the court make their decisions on facts and the law, fortunately.
  
  So in reality, based on the real world results of piracy trials, Nejtillpirater keeps pwning Fredrika and her Scary mate / partner in desinformation and Ad hominem.
  - Fredrika
    
    > “But the police and the court make their decisions on facts and the law, fortunately. So in reality, based on the real world results of piracy trials, Nejtillpirater keeps pwning Fredrika..”
    
    Please explain which particular verdict you believe it is that has any relevance for any of my claims, and why, and also please quote that specific sentence or paragraph from me. Then i will explain to you why that verdict has no relevance whatsoever for that paragraph as it actually was written. I’m not interested in a paraphrasing of what i wrote, according to your memory, i want an actual quote.
    
    You can do this, right? You can back your claim up? You’re not just spreading lies?
    
    Well, i’m waiting.
  - Idiot detected.
    
    Nejtillpirater, is that you?
    http://imgur.com/kZPxn
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ThumbsUpThumbsDown

So, you’re Brein’s Victim. You look around and sees that the Judge is bent in no good direction.

Moreover, a quick treasury check shows no funds for litigation.

Stll, Mother always said, “Do the Right thing!! Don’t let those Big Trolls Bullly you!!”

So, you stand firm. You tell Brein, “No! I will NOT give you my customer’s personal information without a court order!”

You see, this is Step Number One in something called The Two Step Rabbit Ears Defense.

It’s a last option Defense, but very effective……Against Big Rich Trolls……

Never heard of The Rabbit Ears Defense?……..However, you do know that there will come a time when Brein’s bought Judge WILL break out the Hammer and demand that you offer Brein your Bank Statements………

I mean, that’s the point of Bully Litigation…..That’s WHY Thugs sue…..

That’s the Time for Step Number Two in the Two Step Rabbit Ears Defense…..

So, you reach Deep into your Empty Pockets and pull both pockets ALL the way out; making sure to shake out any remaining trace of lint, and, making sure that Both Pockets remain extending upward………

They look like Perfect Rabbit Ears!!

The Moral Lesson for Brein is that when EVEN their most microscopic Competitors run more circles around you than you can see, it’s Time to admit that Evolution has left you with NO Heirs and NO Time.
Guest

From a purely legal point of view, applying the principle of bonus fummus iuris and all, BRIEN is crazy, as always.
Baseless accusations against the ISP’s, innocence is presumed, they did all required by law and have the standard innocent conduit, etc, etc.
But they could still drain them of resources, BRIEN is a strong terrorist group funded by dangerous and determined individuals and sadly the legal system can be abused to give them the power to hurt others, even if the case is eventually lost.

Personally, I think this kind of lawsuits hurt innovation, business, and people. They are an offense against democracy. When some private lobby group such as BRIEN sues a business, they should have good proof before even having a case.
In this case, they do not.
And they should pay damages to all the companies whose time they waste after a pointless procedure.
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Mwhahaha

So why didn’t they just get the court order in the first place? Seems odd.
- Anyone
  
  because that costs money
Mwhahaha

Also, Torrentfreak, with 11 tracking cookies detected by Do Not Track Plus, you win my ‘Most Invasive Website of the Week Award’. Kudos!

Is this an example of how creative people can make money online without direct sales in the future? By spamming everyone’s devices with tracking cookies?
Master13

Brein can go die. I mean really just because they demand something from a seperate company doesn’t mean they are going to get it. XS Networks were completely in their rights by denying BREIN information. Instead they bitch and put the blame on XS killing their business. Way to kill innovation BREIN.
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Rekrul

I think we should give BREIN and the other anti-piracy groups exactly what they want;

From now on, hosting companies should take down web sites upon request, no questions asked, and immediately turn over all the personal information they have on the people who run it, including names, addresses, banking information, etc.

I’ll go first; I want BREIN’s site taken down because it offends me. Further, I want all of BREIN’s information turned over to me.
Violated0

“BREIN also wants the provider to pay for the infringing content that was downloaded via SumoTorrent”

SumoTorrent hosted no infringing content when they only hosted .torrent files. That made it not unlike an address book to Torrent City including the odd address to crack houses, arms dealers and prostitute dens. Plenty of lawful addresses of course but we don’t arrest publishers for printing addresses even to CrackHouses4U Inc.BREIN only highlight their own technical incompetence and lies when no infringing content on SumoTorrent means no infringing content passed through the XS Networks.Also XS Networks is a line carrier and therefore not responsible for what 3rd party data flows through their network. They also did correctly to follow privacy laws when they are not allowed to pass user’s private data to other organizations without either a court order or user approval.BREIN like others are only the attack dogs of copyright. Bark, bark, bark. Attack, attack, attack. Bite, bite, bite. Except of course they attack anyone seen as the enemy leaving a vast list of destroyed innocent companies in their wake.
- Techanon
  
  “BREIN like others are only the attack dogs of copyright. Bark, bark, bark. Attack, attack, attack. Bite, bite, bite. Except of course they attack anyone seen as the enemy leaving a vast list of destroyed innocent companies in their wake.”
  Well that’s all you can expect from rabid dogs. They will atack anything on sight until they are put down or die by themselves.
chronoss chiron

just sue them back and get all the other isps to start suing them for any reason that sounds like it might last enough to bankrupt the buggers back….
forma coalition as most ISP’S do and really stick it to them. ONE at a time funded by the coalition of isps…..

then get some press so all of us know and maybe some new ways for people to sue hollywood……

like actors like sheen promoting drug and illegal sex acts should have them fined….
everytime an actor gets in trouble with drugs or alcohol FINE holywood and fine them big.

MAYB E even sue them on same grounds they use on isps next time your kids get in trouble in same way , as in if hollywood would not promote these people in movies then my kids never ever would get in any trouble …honest mister judge.

failing that hire hit men to kill off all the anti piracy people….
- Nxeyogxk
  
  What the hell do you mean by “illegal sex acts” you imbecile.
  Are you a time traveler from the Dark Ages?
  
  Welcome to 2012, adapt or fuck off.
  - http://profiles.google.com/orfetheo Orfeas Theofanis
    
    So pedophelia isn’t an illegal sex act? Do you do it a lot or?
    - Nxeyogxk
      
      He’s talking about Charlei Sheen and his “illegal sex acts”
      Learn to read touvlo, before you put words in people’s mouths.
Filino Rupro

Great ideia!
Guest

BREIN has no BRAIN
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jOHN rYDER

you openly have copyrighted material on your website to share and expect to be left alone, good luck with that, the time for public sharing sites is about over, the less the mass idiots know about such things the safer we are, who went to Sumo torrents anyways, a haven for viruses and junk material and uncertified torrents, who wants to deal with that garbage, go private and save file sharing, its the future even if you you like it or not !!!!!!!!!!!
- Anyone
  
  it should not be a crime to share information
  
  the MAFIAA has to die
RCV

Look, the solution to the judicial decisions in .nl is simple.
The decision is that torrents are illegal there because of piracy, and they ban them.
The whole Internet facilitates piracy.
If every ISP, every internet sever were to put .nl on their ban list, maybe the people of .nl would get off their butts and elect representatives that would look after THEIR interests, rather than the corporate shills that can not adapt to the realpolitik and realeconimik of the 21st century
If they decide that being cut off from the rest of Planet Earth is okay, it’s no big deal.
Almost all of the .nl torrents on demonoid had hard-coded dutch subs. Like they couldn’t figure out how to make soft subs.

-ekb-
- IDIOCRACY
  
  Indeed, switch Internet off in Holland, and then lean back and watch the riots hehe
qitian

tinyurl.com/cyk9xz2
haida732

tinyurl.com/ck9xz2
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