BitTornado Bans All BitComet Users
Written by Ernesto on January 07, 2007BitTornado developer John Hoffman, better known as Shad0w, decided to ban BitComet users from accessing his client. Shad0w says that BitComet is gaming the system and stealing precious bandwidth, which results in slower speeds for all non-Bitcomet users.
BitComet is known to be a BitTorrent bully, similar to the recently introduced BitThief and BitTyrant. What makes this problem serious is the fact that BitComet is far more popular than the other two clients, so its effect on other peers is more serious.
Recently, BitComet started to exploit the super-seeding procedure, an invention by Shad0w that is also implemented in other popular clients like uTorrent. A super-seed detects peers that efficiently distribute data to other peers, and rewards them by sending them more data. This technique speeds up the overall speed of the swarm, and all other users benefit from it. However, not if it was up to the BitComet developers.
Shad0w explains, “When BitComet games super-seed, it induces the seed into thinking that the BitComet peer is very efficient at spreading data. As a result, the peer downloads faster than the rest of the peers, and typically doesn’t share that data as efficiently, costing the rest of the peers a lot of download time.”
The continuous efforts of the BitComet developers to cheat the system made Shad0w decide to ban all BitComet users. “Since BitComet has proven itself to be a harmful codebase, and since they have forced me to take steps I’d rather not have, I will also be banning connections from that client to my own client and tracker codebases. Should the BitComet developers decide to remove the exploitation code from their client, I will reconsider this decision.”
People may question whether it is a good decision to ban all BitComet users, but I think it is a wise one. In general, BitComet users are not the sharing type, so my prediction would be that it is more likely to speed up downloads, than to slow them down.
I’m with Shad0w on this, and I seriously hope that BitComet stops cheating, and will become more BitTorrent friendly in the future. I’ve used Shadow’s BitTorrent client for quite a while myself, and Shad0w is one of the most dedicated BitTorrent client developers around.
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113 Responses
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you guys are LaME.
BitComet RULES!
[quote comment="37045"]you guys are LaME.
BitComet RULES![/quote]
XD
Wow another BitVomit Fan. Why is it so much better? Oh yeah the way it over works the hell out of Tracker sis so cool.
Here’s my dilema…I’m behind a nat which I don’t control (it’s a college campus). I can’t just go up to my IT guy and ask him to forward my port or open up any ports. I use BC because it allows me to download faster…I’d love to seed if I could. Don’t get me wrong I think it’s shitty that leechers like me damage the torrent system. However not all of us have a choice in that matter and regardless as to what anyone says not all leechers wanna be leechers. If it was up to me I’d be seeding several torrents on another machine (gotta keep my main one open for gaming ;-).
IMO it’s Shad0w’s program and he can do with it what he wants…but assuming it’s not already he should’ve just made it an option instead of hardcoding it in. Fairness works both ways.
[quote comment="37050"]I use BC because it allows me to download faster…I’d love to seed if I could. Don’t get me wrong I think it’s shitty that leechers like me damage the torrent system. However not all of us have a choice in that matter and regardless as to what anyone says not all leechers wanna be leechers.[/quote]
you made a choice, and it’s to download as fast as possible. you chose your personal speeds over the interests of the bittorrent community.
anyway, as has been stated, most private trackers ban BitComet already, so shad0w’s just taking it one step further. anyone who is really disappointed by it should ask for your money back … oh wait
Good to see Shadow still kicking… As for BitComet… This has been coming for awhile has it not?
Granted, Bitcomet games the system … but not all bitcomet users are “evil leechers who want to destroy the system.” I run WinXP 64bit … bitcomet is the only client I’ve been able to use that won’t blue-screen my machine within 5 minutes. It sucks that it doesn’t play nice, but don’t assume people are trying to cheat everyone out of a few kb/mb/gb of bandwidth just because they’re using that client.
so basicly BitComet is being banned cuz of some retarded users r abuseing it?
i been useing Bitcomey for year and i have no prob with it i seed my torrents
unlike the other clients i used i get better DL speeds from Bitcomet
bittorrent: i didit like download speeds sucked even if i dl from a torrent with over 2000 seeders i shouldnt get anything under 100
azures:
Nice step!
[quote comment="37069"]so basicly BitComet is being banned cuz of some retarded users r abuseing it?
i been useing Bitcomey for year and i have no prob with it i seed my torrents
unlike the other clients i used i get better DL speeds from Bitcomet
bittorrent: i didit like download speeds sucked even if i dl from a torrent with over 2000 seeders i shouldnt get anything under 100
azures:[/quote]
No, BitComet is not being banned because of retarded users abusing it. It’s being banned because the client itself is written to be abusive out of the box.
Yes, you are getting better speeds with BitComet __because__ BitComet abuses the system, but everyone else is paying the price because BitComet the client is being selfish.
O well i called a noob o well dont matter because I aint but really come on bitcomet is a class client but shadows client has gone and doesnt have basic torrent features now like DHT if he updated his client nice GUI and more now basic cleint feature i could possibleably understand but he has gone for ages and first thing he doesn o yeah lets ban bitcomet
all the words is crap. Everybody make their own decetion. You can ban it. They lose nothing. Maybe you will get better maybe not. If you want to have a finnal way to getoff all the XXX, please ban Chinese IP. After do that, your world is clearing, but too clearing.
So if you get faster downloads with Bitcomet, why don’t we all use it? I thought that was the whole f***** point with this protocol. I have been following this case for a while and the only ones that cries about it is the “private tracker” people. Weeeell, guess what, you’re no good for the torrent community anyway are you? Because you want to invite all the good seeders with your registration and invite bullcrap, away from the public trackers. So when Bitcomet doesnt help you in dividing the community, you use all you creativity to come up with the very clever “bitvomet”, and spam the good piece of software that Bitcomet is? Mommy ruined you little boysclub? We all agree that bitcomet downloads faster, so all logic tells use to use it! And this discussion has nothing to do with the seeder issue.
Thats another thing. It’s ok to stop seeding if there is 200 other seeders, it’s a bigger problem that people dont keep torrents alive. The popular torrent are gonna survive anyway…..
The BitTorrent protocol is designed to inherently limit damage from peers which don’t contribute, so up until now I didn’t bother with trying to police the protocol. The problem is that BitComet’s new theft methods don’t just take bandwidth from a point where it’s bottlenecked, and they aren’t just slowing everyone else down, they’re actually slowing THEMSELVES down too. It’s a truly asinine thing to do.
ZeroCool: Of course I’ve had complaints, otherwise I wouldn’t've known about the problem.
jonston: I’ll write more about it later.
CryCryCry wrote: “We all agree that bitcomet downloads faster, so all logic tells use to use it! And this discussion has nothing to do with the seeder issue”
oviously you have absolutely no idea about logic!
there isn’t one magic fast 10GE seeder somewhere that feeds us all with stuff. Its the whole of a swarm that makes the speed.
And BitComet downloads faster because it gives a shit about the health of the overall swarm. 1 seeder has UL capacity X. This X is devided among his leeching peers. so you can only download fast if there are more people in the swarm that GIVE to it in a decent speed. Of everyone would use BC then the speed with which the content is sucked from the swarm would run the cloud of available pieces dry.
Picture a water tank where you with your BitComet take the water from faster then the RainGod can fill it up. (But i’m afraid your logical abilities aren’t developed enough to even imagine such a simple comparison between how a BTswarm works and some real life example!)
P.S.
CryCryCry also wrote:
“I thought that was the whole f***** point with this protocol.”
maybe you should not try to think! either you are unable to do that, or you haven’t understand what BT is all about. It was not intended to get something the fastest possible way, it was invented and its intention was to take the stress off of a server when huge amounts of clients asking him for the same content to serve to them!
Fastest possible speed to get content was never a design goal if I understand the specifications of BT correctly.
maybe you should read them too!
well i’m a bitcomer user. and not for the non sharing reasons suggested in the article. for the simple reason i tried loads and liked the way it workd and the interface. i’ve bbeen using it for many versions. though this information surpriused me. can anyone recommend a client thats like it, but isnt trying the cheat the swarm?
What gaming mode are you talking about?
Now where’s the proof to warrant this ban? BitComet has had a lot of versions, more so than any other client. So what versions of the client are doing this as well? And I’d like some real responses not crap like “everyone knows BitComet cheats” or “BitComet cheats deal with it.”
And since TheSHADOW seem to actually be reading this how about you help those of use who never got the confimation emails from your forums. You have a lot of members listed who never posted once because they did/could not finish regsitering.
Dark Shroud you want an example?
I just at this very moment hit the “log peer traffic” button, and one of the first things that almost instantly came up was:
[01:25:01] 85.166.206.x : [BitComet/0070 ]: Got Request while choked: 451:114688->16384
[01:25:01] 85.166.206.x : [BitComet/0070 ]: Got Cancel Unrequested: 451:49152->16384
[01:25:01] 85.166.206.x : [BitComet/0070 ]: Got Cancel Unrequested: 451:65536->16384
[01:25:01] 85.166.206.x : [BitComet/0070 ]: Got Cancel Unrequested: 451:81920->16384
[01:25:01] 85.166.206.x : [BitComet/0070 ]: Got Cancel Unrequested: 451:98304->16384
[01:25:01] 85.166.206.x : [BitComet/0070 ]: Got Cancel Unrequested: 451:114688->16384
[01:25:01] 85.166.206.x : [BitComet/0070 ]: Got Request while choked: 451:49152->16384
[01:25:01] 85.166.206.x : [BitComet/0070 ]: Got Request while choked: 451:65536->16384
[01:25:01] 85.166.206.x : [BitComet/0070 ]: Got Request while choked: 451:81920->16384
[01:25:01] 85.166.206.x : [BitComet/0070 ]: Got Request while choked: 451:98304->16384
[01:25:01] 85.166.206.x : [BitComet/0070 ]: Got Request while choked: 451:114688->16384
[01:25:01] 85.166.206.x : [BitComet/0070 ]: Got Cancel Unrequested: 451:49152->16384
[01:25:01] 85.166.206.x : [BitComet/0070 ]: Got Cancel Unrequested: 451:65536->16384
[01:25:01] 85.166.206.x : [BitComet/0070 ]: Got Cancel Unrequested: 451:81920->16384
[01:25:01] 85.166.206.x : [BitComet/0070 ]: Got Cancel Unrequested: 451:98304->16384
[01:25:01] 85.166.206.x : [BitComet/0070 ]: Got Cancel Unrequested: 451:114688->16384
Bit comet is not cheating the swarm.
I will keep an open mind till I see something more then wild accusations ranted in a blog, but every other “rumor” regarding Bit Comet has proved to be half truths, or complete fabrications.
Now, consider this, two BT clients. Bit comet that is being accused of acting hostile to other clients, but with NO proof of any kind, and Bit tornado, which IS hostile to other clients, and bans them without any proof.
I have always recommended Bit Tornado as one of the four best, along with Utorrent, Bit Comet, and Azureus, but now we have one that is Hostile (Bit Tornado), one that “could be”, but probably isn’t.
Bit comet has never banned any other clients. In fact, the only thing you can say bad about bit comet is regarding a very old version, and how some hackers were able to force it to enable DHT. However the record of FACTS is clear regarding this, as its developers mediately correct the issue.
In fact, DHT didn’t even have any set rules at the time, since it wasn’t even part of BT protocol, so there were no rules to break, but this didn’t stop people from spreading the rumors.
I am looking forward to hearing Bit Comets official response to this latest attack on it, but since no real facts are included with this accusation, it is impossible to defend. This attack reminds me of a little kid crying that another doesn’t play nice. So, do we ask Bit Comet to prove that is does “play nice”, or ask Shadow to prove it doesn’t???
The former could never be proven by any client, and I sure hope for shadows sake, that he can prove this, cause if he cannot, then his client has become what he accuses bit comet of becoming.
D
On the other hand, if a torrent is spreading slowly, this may be quite useful, as it will be available for a longer time.
[quote comment="37259"]Dark Shroud you want an example?
I just at this very moment hit the “log peer traffic” button, and one of the first things that almost instantly came up was:[/quote]
How about a little more information. Like what client you were using, were you using Super-seed mode? Instead of 16 listed items in one second that are not the same client. Why you ask? Because BitComet only uses one port. For all of that to be the same person he’d have to be hitting the randomize button and then manuel connect all within the span of a second. And that’s not acounting firewall adjustment.
Here are 2 full seconds of peer traffic from a Naruto torrent in µTorrent:
[19:31:41] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Got Piece: 185:131072->16384
[19:31:41] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Requesting 185:212992->16384
[19:31:41] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Requesting 185:229376->16384
[19:31:41] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Got Request: 441:1097728->16384
[19:31:41] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Got Request: 441:1114112->16384
[19:31:41] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Sending Piece 441:1081344->16384
[19:31:41] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Got Piece: 185:147456->16384
[19:31:41] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Requesting 185:245760->16384
[19:31:41] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Requesting 662:0->16384
[19:31:41] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Requesting 662:16384->16384
[19:31:41] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Requesting 662:32768->16384
[19:31:41] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Requesting 662:49152->16384
[19:31:41] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Requesting 662:65536->16384
[19:31:41] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Requesting 662:81920->16384
[19:31:41] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Requesting 662:98304->16384
[19:31:41] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Requesting 662:114688->16384
[19:31:41] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Requesting 662:131072->16384
[19:31:41] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Requesting 662:147456->16384
[19:31:41] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Requesting 662:163840->16384
[19:31:41] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Requesting 662:180224->16384
[19:31:41] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Requesting 662:196608->16384
[19:31:41] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Requesting 662:212992->16384
[19:31:41] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Requesting 662:229376->16384
[19:31:41] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Requesting 662:245760->16384
[19:31:42] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Got Piece: 185:163840->16384
[19:31:42] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Sending Piece 441:1097728->16384
[19:31:42] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Got Piece: 185:180224->16384
[19:31:42] 195.39.129.88 : Disconnect: Peer error: offline (timed out)
[19:31:42] 218.212.223.23 : Connecting: port 22808
[19:31:42] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Got Request: 441:1130496->16384
[19:31:42] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Got Request: 441:1146880->16384
[19:31:42] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Got Request: 441:1163264->16384
[19:31:42] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Got Request: 441:1179648->16384
[19:31:42] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Got Request: 441:1196032->16384
[19:31:42] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Got Request: 441:1212416->16384
[19:31:42] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Got Request: 441:1228800->16384
[19:31:42] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Got Request: 441:1245184->16384
[19:31:42] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Got Request: 441:1261568->16384
[19:31:42] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Got Request: 441:1277952->16384
[19:31:42] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Got Request: 441:1294336->16384
[19:31:42] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Got Request: 441:1310720->16384
[19:31:42] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Got Request: 441:1327104->16384
[19:31:42] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Got Request: 441:1343488->16384
[19:31:42] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Got Request: 441:1359872->16384
[19:31:42] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Got Request: 441:1376256->16384
[19:31:42] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Got Request: 441:1392640->16384
[19:31:42] 84.204.194.100 : [µTorrent/1600 ]: Got Request: 441:1409024->16384
[19:31:42] 67.10.254.129 : [Mainline 5.0.4 ]: Got Piece: 185:196608->16384
[19:31:42] 24.86.115.21 : Disconnect: Connection closed
Now out of the 49 (1085) seeds & 20 (311) leeches I’m connected to only 15 are BitComet; 8 of the 15 are seeders.
But guess what, I can do like all newbs/noobs do and pound away on the Mannuel Announce button hammering peers, the tracker & DHT in both BitComet and BitTornado. Since they both have that same option.
Round One, to Dark Shrould
bitcomet is a cheat end of ,its not for me to prove its for you to prove it doesn’t.
i just hope clients like Azureus do the same thing and ban.it
this is not aimed at bitcomet users.
but at the end of the day non bitcomet users suffer and have done for some time now.
something needs to be done. and ive got to say this is a great start.
im looking forward to the new bit tornado release.im all for it ,saves me having to ban it myself.
good on ya shadow top man
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