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Pornhub & YouPorn Owner Funds Fight Against Cyberlockers

The company behind YouPorn and PornHub has agreed to fund an anti-piracy outfit dedicated to bringing down ‘rogue’ cyberlockers and illicit file-sharing forums. Speaking with TorrentFreak, the Adult Content Industry United Foundation says they will be using the money to cut off funding to cyberlockers in the hope that hitting them in the pocket brings them to their knees. But are cyberlockers and so-called ‘tube’ sites facing the same issues?

Ever since the Internet touched the average home, adult industry entrepreneurs have been raking in the money from their pay-sites. Conveniently secured behind the tightest of walls, these sites were a dream come true for businesses previously tied up in expensive print and cumbersome DVDs.

Then along came P2P file-sharing, particularly BitTorrent, which in the final half of the last decade turned the whole thing on its head to become porn enemy number one. But something much more threateningly accessible was on the horizon.

‘Tube’ sites, so named due to their similarities with YouTube, appeared thick and fast offering huge libraries of content previously uploaded by their users. Some of it was amateur material but much of it was pirated content owned by existing porn companies. Paysites had their sign-up processes and credit cards while Tube sites offered everything for free, and often just one click away.

While some studios initially chose to fight these ‘Tube’ sites, these days its common to see studios advertising on them, promoting content via short clips and longer offerings via partner programs. For example, YouPorn’s program claims to have 400 partners including big companies like Vivid.

YouPornPartner

But having partnered with the Tube sites, the studios had another problem to deal with – file-sharing forums that rely on cyberlocker sites to serve up illicit content to their users.
While these are often dealt with by companies such as Takedown Piracy who remove millions of links on behalf of the industry, earlier this year another anti-piracy outfit appeared with more aggressive aims.

According to XBIZ, the Adult Content Industry United Foundation (ACIUF) was formed by paysite-owning companies with the aim of cutting off piracy higher up the branch.

“We build a program which allows us to analyze a pirate,” said Siep R. Kuppens, president of International Media Company, the paysite owner leading the ACIUF.

“With this, we can see where they take the content, say to at least 60 smaller pirate sites. Kill the big ones and the little ones go as well. For example, if we prove that file hosting companies have stolen content, we can take proper action. The hosting company will have no other option than to block the site. If they pop up somewhere else, we will repeat the action. One by one we will go after them.”

Just this week, we learned that ACIUF has a familiar name in its sights – a cyberlocker called Oron. Among its other users, this file-hosting service is a favorite among uploaders of pornographic material and is used extensively by members of several adult-orientated file-sharing sites.

ACIUF’s Madalina Manolache told TorrentFreak that they intend to put Oron out of business by cutting off the site’s revenue by restricting its ability to sell premium accounts. To this end ACIUF applied pressure to the CCBill payment processor. It worked, and then some.

“[CCBill] can no longer provide transaction services to businesses operating a file locker model,” said Gary Jackson, CCBill’s managing vice president.

This week ACIUF stepped up the battle by going after Acquiro, Oron’s latest payment processor. ACIUF say that with support of Mastercard, Acquiro has now also withdrawn its services from Oron. Oron have reportedly already moved to a new company, but ACIUF say they will keep following them. Oron did not respond to a request for comment.

ACIUF say they have big ambitions which of course will cost money to realize, but according to the anti-piracy group, funding is not a problem. That is because – and this will certainly raise eyebrows – the cost of their operations has been covered by an interesting donor.

The cash has come from a company called Manwin, the owners of YouPorn, PornHub, XTube, Tube8, ExtremeTube and SpankWire. According to ACIUF, Manwin wanted to keep their involvement quiet, but ACIUF “decided to give Manwin the credit it deserves.”

“The Adult Content Industry United Foundation (ACIUF) is happy to announce Manwin’s support in the ACIUF fight against piracy, and illegal filehosting. With no other expectation than achieving the objectives, Manwin has made a standing donation that will help cover the operational cost,” ACIUF said in a statement.

What provokes discussion here is that Oron and ‘Tube’ sites face similar issues – both are at the mercy of their users when it comes to uploaded content. There can be little doubt that both Oron and sites like PornHub and YouPorn (and indeed YouTube) contain large amounts of infringing content. But what they have in common is that they all respond to DMCA takedowns in order to operate within the law.

ACIUF

Not surprisingly, ACIUF’s Madalina Manolache sees a difference between Tube sites and cyberlockers like Oron.

“Oron indeed uses the excuse the (stolen) content is uploaded by their users and they have no control over what is uploaded,” she told TorrentFreak. “But the truth well-known by everyone is that they are paying those users (at least the big uploaders) for uploading the infringed content and asking money from others to download it; they are operating using a criminal business model. They are instigating users into uploading new and desired materials and they are doing it well – because they are paying good money.”

Of course, similar arguments have been made by other content owners against sites such as Megaupload, in which they insist that the mere existence of a user upload rewards program necessarily points to a business model hell-bent on infringement. Lawyers representing Megaupload bitterly dispute that assertion.

So that brings us back to the business models of sites like YouPorn and PornHub, that at least in their early days survived almost exclusively on content uploaded by users, much of it copyright infringing. As noted earlier though, the atmosphere has changed since Manwin started sucking up Tube sites in 2010 and 2011, with the company now encouraging other tube site owners to help the adult industry through mechanisms such as partner programs, rather than “simply aiming to make content freely available to all.”

But even now, with Manwin apparently striving for tube-site legitimacy and seeming to make a decent job of it, sites such as PornHub still carry infringing content, content potentially belonging to ACIUF anti-piracy initiative members. So is there a conflict of interest on the cards?

ACIUF say that despite the cash donation from Manwin, apparently the company “did not require immunity” from ACIUF actions, although biting the hand that feeds may not be in the anti-piracy group’s interests.

“All we can say about this is when [Manwin] donates money to ACIUF to bring down major pirate sites and major cyberlockers, we will gladly use it to bring Oron down,” ACIUF conclude.

But when it comes to Oron, the hawks are already circling. On Wednesday, adult studio Corbin Fisher filed a $34.8 million copyright infringement against the site and its operators, XBIZ reports.

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  • Kjb

    No comment

    • yello

      finally, a use for porn?….

      • WilkersonJesse

        Unless you’re a freegan and have found a way to live entirely off the grid, you probably need some sort of steady income in order to survive. The traditional way to earn money, of course, is by having a job. But now a days you can earn money over Internet>>>>[300$ in a day or even more] ?????? Open The Link From my name to read the details

    • Guest

      Just don’t use YouPorn or PornHub. Use XNXX, Xvideos, or Xhamster instead. They have more and better videos anyway.

      • woot

         I use ur mom

      • Guest

        I use ur mom..

        • Big Mama

          You mean 8 hrs for warm up?

        • Guest

           ur hard

  • 123

    Blasphemy!!!

    I mean, porn sites suing sites that help me get my free open source software ?!!?!?

    Am I in hell ?!

    P.S. Porn is cool

    • Sick

       They’re not suing SourceForge…

      • Guest

        …yet.

  • Guest

    “Just this week, we learned that ACIUF has a familiar name in its sights – a cyberlocker called Oron.
    Among its other users, this file-hosting service is a favorite among
    uploaders of pornographic material and is used extensively by members of
    several adult-orientated file-sharing sites.”

    “ACIUF’s Madalina Manolache told TorrentFreak that they intend to put
    Oron out of business by cutting off the site’s revenue by restricting
    its ability to sell premium accounts. To this end ACIUF applied pressure
    to the CCBill payment processor. It worked, and then some.2

    “[CCBill]
    can no longer provide transaction services to businesses operating a
    file locker model,” said Gary Jackson, CCBill’s managing vice president.

    This week ACIUF stepped up the battle by going after Acquiro, Oron’s
    latest payment processor. ACIUF say that with support of Mastercard,
    Acquiro has now also withdrawn its services from Oron. Oron have
    reportedly already moved to a new company, but ACIUF say they will keep
    following them. Oron did not respond to a request for comment.”

    So now these people are applying pressure (more like threats) etc. to get the accounts closed of these companies just because they use better ways than what they do. They really are acting like spoil brats because everything is not all about the me me me.

    • Sick

       Oron is a completely shit host, I hope they shut down or are sued out of business. Greediest host on the market.

      • HerculesXPT

        Are you crazy?! First Megaupload, now oron… Is this what you want?

        • Guest

          Yes Oron’s death would be a thing of rejoice if you are a true file sharer.

        • HerculesXPT

          Rejoice?! What?! Oron’s death would be the beginning of the end..

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  • The Muss

    What the ****,  I think brazzers does good job securing their videos.   I don’t see their full hd videos on other websites. 

    • Braz

       http://www.addfunny.com/funnypictures/challenge/56/brazzers.jpg

    • Guest

      … to tell you the truth I know a website with 720p videos streamable for free. Including but not limited to brazzer videos O_O

      Jealous?

      • woot

        R u kidding?  I’m not jealous.  I’m … uh uh. uh…. about to cum!

      • Sick

        … to tell you the truth I know a site giving away free $500 gift cards to anyone with an address. Now I’ll be a dick and not share it with you and ask if you’re jealous.

      • dwpbike

        link or it didn’t happen

    • John

       ur not using the internet right, those vids are everywhere, learn to internet

  • http://twitter.com/bbgameruk BBgamer

    Hope they shut down Oron, that’ll be giving us all a favour! Extremely long unnecessary waiting times (Up to 20 minutes), slow download speeds and expensive premium.

    • http://profiles.google.com/zerianis10 Christopher Kidwell

      Excuse me, but Oron is one of the better sites out there. If you want them shut down, I have to question your motives.

      • Sick

         You clearly never compared hosts Kidwell, if you had, you’d know they are a rip off. Just because your favorite porn is there doesn’t make it a great host.

        • techanon

          That they are a rip off isnt an excuse to bully them into bankrupcy. Let the users decide their longevity in business, not the banks.

        • http://profiles.google.com/zerianis10 Christopher Kidwell

          Yes, I have compared Filehosts and they are one of the better sites for FREE downloads out there. Since I have never and will never buy a premium plan, well I cannot speak on that matter.

      • Anon1

        Orons premium is the definition of ripoff. You get a download “quota”: 20000MB every 3 days. Its utter bullshit.

        On the one hand I would LOVE to see Oron get shut down, on the other hand that would mean these pornmongers get their way, and I can’t decide which is worse.

      • ISeeYou

        I think you are a Oron paid troll. Oron is one of the better sites out there? They make life a living hell for both free and premium users. Oron is probably the worst file hosting site ever been created barring the survey cyberlocker sites. Uploading porn to Oron is like holding a gun to the downloaders’ head and asking them to beg for the files on their knees.

        • http://profile.yahoo.com/ZMZBHO6XDQEWLGUCC73KMFK3XE briand

           Your kidding right Oron sux so much ass it is slow as fu** 98% of free users can not download jack 20gb download limit for premium users get the hell out of here

  • bones11

    porn sites going after us maybe we should look at closing thier sites down do them good to remember payback is a bitch.

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  • YARIGHT

    i think the 100,000 pron pics i have is enough , me thinks i can imagine the rest

    brazzers fails you all fail i r has all your bases are belong to us
    and as to full hd its out there you just aint got access to it…..
    sides why do i want to see the hair on some chicks butt a divx/xvid/sd.x264 is just great to trade about
    hahahahaha HD i see your zits now baby

  • thedude321

    Its kinda ironic how such a dirty business like porn wants to do something so ‘clean’.
    The hipocricy sickens me.

    • dwpbike

      the hypocrisy of hipocricy

  • Andrew me

    The future looks bright , there are so many new businesses starting up each day to replace those that are taken down it is crazy.

    Personally I think Kim Dotcom or someone else will do something that the copyright monopolists will have no option but to start innovating and improve there business models.

    The internet is a big place and it is becoming easier and easier to get good entertainment at very little cost, entertainment that is not coming from Hollywood.

    I am waiting for an announcement of MEGAVIDEO or MEGAMOVIES, Or MEGATV. Or even all of them being developed in the very near future.

    • Shitgun

      Megavideo and Megaporn have already been and gone (but may return)

    • Lord of the Files

       I’ve been wondering how long it will be until big tech companies, such as Google, begin developing their own “TV” shows. Take Blood & Chrome for instance. Sci-Fy decided not to invest in it despite how awesome it looks. There are always lots of great shows getting canceled due to stupidity and low ratings (highly inaccurate ratings because they don’t take torrents into account). Just pick up the tab for these by purchasing the appropriate rights (I’m thinking Firefly and Stargate for example). Much like Youtube, it would make for fantastic advertising opportunities, drawing in the 18-35 crowd that traditional networks no longer seem to care about (and likely why there is so much reality crap these days). The internet is the perfect platform for this as anyone should be able to create and air shows provided they have the capital. Something like MegaTV may be the perfect means for showing others the way to what we all know is the future of broadcasting.

      As for this particular TorrentFreak story… “For the love of all that is moral and holy, please stop stealing our pornography!” /s :-)

      • Shitgun

        “The internet is the perfect platform for this as anyone should be able to create and air shows provided they have the capital.”

        The rise of VODO and Kickstarter shows the shape of things to come.

        People are tired of big content aiming for demographics rather than creating anything that is actually any good. Power to the people.

  • Hogspace

    First things first. Cyberlocker and Fileshare sites shouldn’t base themselves in the US or use US based servers. Second, they should use non US/EU payment processors. How about simply taking Standing Orders or one of the overseas remittance orders. 
    More importantly I’d like to see the commercial porn companies taking it in the neck. I don’t like seeing sex commercialised. All the best stuff is free or amateur anyway. So here is my clever idea, any major economy, lets say the UK, could decide paid for porn on the internet is no longer acceptable, while leaving people to create their own free and amateur content. Make it a criminal offence. Then make the Credit Card companies responsible if they aid and abet such a crime, anywhere in the world. The CC’s and Merchants make lots of cash out of porn but they can’t afford to give up an entire national market. How about promoting that idea and see how the cunts like being gang raped up the arse :o)

    • http://profiles.google.com/zerianis10 Christopher Kidwell

      Not necessarily. There is some commercial porn that is good, but it mainly involves real people in real situations doing real things and getting paid for recording themselves or being recorded beforehand, then told about it and given the option of being paid for it or having the video destroyed.

    • DannyBoy

      ALL domain names route through Virgina, USA.  It doesn’t matter where they hide, they can be cut off by the USA through their domain name.

      If you own a http://www.SOMETHING.anything, the USA can shut it off if they really want to.

      • Hogspace

        I don’t *think* that’s true any more as it happens.

      • Dev/Nul

        I smell BS

  • Master

    I can cut off Pornhub and YouPorn too, no problem.

    There are more sites out there.

    • Shitgun

      Notice how it’s ok for them to get fat off of re-packaging amateur porn… but as soon as someone borrows theirs it’s war.

      • Sick

         so true, I wonder if all those “content creators” got paid for sharing their wives

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  • http://twitter.com/Mathew30 Mathew Lisett

    with these people and megaupload, it kinda does tell up and coming kiddies that crime does pay. i mean come on, both have been able to FUND their business from advertising and illegal memberships, and becuase after a good few years they then did deals with the big ass companies, they are now going down the goodie goodie route and lookign all innoccent. but its funny becuase i see countless tweets from the big companies and pornstars HATING on these tube sites.

    • Andrew

      Like Ron Jeremy? lol The Pornstars who are tweet against these sites’ careers’ are failing

      • http://twitter.com/Mathew30 Mathew Lisett

         nope, im talking about the major stars of today and deffinately he major studeios within this industry, many have stated their hatered towards these sites stating like the old crap montra from music, games and movies that its killing their business.

    • Anyone

      how was MegaUpload criminal?

      • http://twitter.com/Mathew30 Mathew Lisett

         by allowing copyrightied content to be viable on their services and then accepting payment for premium faster services. come on you have to be dumb to think what they did was all above board. im all for them to fight their cuase considering the us gov are wankers and screwed up, but when it comes down to it. hkim only gained millions from MU becuase of the advertising and people paying for the premium service

        • Anyone

          they followed DMCA, so by definition they were protected under the safe harbor provision

    • Guest

      Some years ago you’d have said the same thing about CD sellers. Or VCR sellers. Or cassette sellers.

      • Dev/Nul

        The Boston Strangler all over again, unfortunate they simple can’t learn from history =X

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/LTQXNMUE64CKKCVMV6O2UERHPQ Alex

    like Bonnie replied I am taken by surprise that anyone able to earn $8409 in one month on the computer. have you read this site link  (Click on menu Home more information)   http://goo.gl/ANctZ    

  • Guest

    lol there are thousands of porn websites.

  • Andrew

    Kettle calling the Pot black

  • fantocone

    Sounds like a pretty rock solid plan to me dude. Wow.
    Fresh-Anon.tk

  • YARIGHT

    why are hackers and dolphins similar?
    like the hitchhikers guide to the galaxy says 

    dolphins on the way out of earth like leaving a website said “so long and thanks for the fish”

  • Mmpo16

    Is the final for the porn videos ???

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  • yes, it’s me

    First thought springs to mind: Divide and conquer. Not only does the industry save money when it attacks only half the sites out there, but lo and behold: one half of the market actually finances the war against the other half.

    After that, the surviving half will of course be nothing more than another shell for dropping lo quality promo videos on unsuspecting users.

    This leads to the inevitable conclusion that the porn industry – unlike their music- and movie counterparts – knows how to reel in money no matter what, but without f—ing their customers too obviously along the way. Pun indended.

    Thanks for this article though: Now I know why youporn’s quality has dropped the way it has during the past months. Any good recommendations for an actual amateur-sharing-site? I don’t really like commercial promos or ripped professional stuff.

    • http://twitter.com/meekcritic Meek Critic

       You might be right.  The porn industry might have twisted this guy’s arm and told him that if he didn’t pay up and make it appear like he’s against cyberlockers, they would sue him.  However, I don’t think this strategy will work.  Here’s what I think will happen:

      Everyone who agrees to “play by the rules” set forth by the porn industry will see their visitor count decrease.  Once they start to limit the time of their videos or limit the amount of videos on their sites, someone will seize the opportunity and create their own network of porn tube sites. 

      This will create an endless amount of lawsuits that will keep lawyers happy but it won’t accomplish anything.  Torrent trackers/Websites, cyberlockers, newsgroups & newsgroups linking sites (did I miss any) have replaced Napster, direct connect,  Kazaa, eDonkey, eMule linking sites as the primary targets.  It won’t be long before other types of P2P apps and/or other forms of file sharing become more popular than the current options.

  • HerculesXPT

    What is the difference between pornhub/youporn and cyberlockeers?

  • None

    big money will lost for oron. complainants, attorney and judges will earn for this fight . .  . 

  • Bonjour

    the evidence is gone ! ! !

  • Yaru

    And why exactly would anyone use oron and fund Indian idio*s uploading shi**y pr0n when they can easily go to pr0nolab and get whatever they want for FREE? There is practically nothing that can be found outside pr0nolab that they don’t already have (except the sick types of pr0n).

  • Lol
    • dwpbike

      i love romantic porn

  • The_seventh_guest

    The chase will end with bitcoin

    Looks like the porn industry wants to get screwed (pun intended)

  • Jimbo

    basically, any method that will start to bring in revenue for a new business, get a new company on the bottom rung of the ladder, is fine to use. in fact it’s actually encouraged. after fame and fortune comes calling, everything that was used becomes infringing, becomes illegal, becomes contrary to what is wanted and the image displayed. the good old double standards coming into play as usual. when it helps, it’s the dog’s bollocks. once it’s done it’s job, throw it off the planet.

  • Dan

    don’t give up oron keep fighting ! we stand with you!

    • Guest

      Yeah because you get paid by them.

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/LTQXNMUE64CKKCVMV6O2UERHPQ Alex

    as Gloria replied I’m surprised that a single mom can make $8908 in one month on the internet. have you seen this website (Click on menu Home more information)   http://goo.gl/BrDPU  

  • 0omg

    omg i cant believe what i just read …… you gotta be kidding right ….. as i recall these 2 site started by SHARING COPYRIGHTED PORN ….. so now please pornhub and youporn DIE or stfu about that crap ….. you made your money EXACTLY like that a couple years ago you sellfish bastard full of 
    hipocricy …… you guys are the wrost scum ever …. you started “pirate” and even ripped a other site idea and now that you made yourself rich you wanna chase them …. EPIC FAIL and ultimate BOYCOTT you make me sick …….

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Don-Dilly/1624894683 Don Dilly

    I got no problem with them trying to cut off funding to a blatent pirate site with the proviso that the site has a track record of ignoring DMCA notices and that the cut off of transaction processing is done via a court order .

    What is dangerous here is that an industry body is trying to block funding via extrajudicial means and is being funded by a competor of the filelockers and acting no better than them.

    Most worrying and likely to come back and bite adult content providers in the Ass. In a similar vein to paypals blanket ban on payment processing for VPN services that mention bittorrent on their site. CCBill has blocked processing for ANY cyberlocker irrespective of the site legality.

    ACIUF’s actions bearing in mind payment processor’s reactions may well come back to haunt an adult industry with a very short memory. 10 to 15 years ago there was a massive backlash against rogue adult sites (and rogue users) that generated loads of chargebacks from creditcards. A lot of this was due to auto renewals and failure to cancel accounts. The payment processors rather than treating sites on a case by case basis just gave a blanket refusal to deal with porn sites.

    The legit porn industry whip up trouble with payment processors at their own peril.

  • DannyBoy

    Irony. The tube sites who make their living on stolen property is going after the file locker sites who make their living on stolen property.

    May the best thief win.

    • Fredrika

      > “Irony. The tube sites who make their living on stolen property is going after the file locker sites who make their living on stolen property.”

      You seem confused. First of all nothing has been stolen, and secondly, intellectual works does not constitute any kind of property. Property is something that has an inherent scarcity, it is something that can be owned, sold and bought, and if property is taken or stolen from one place and put in another, it no longer exists in it’s original place. Is property and stealing concepts that you do not understand?

      Or maybe you’re confusing intellectual works, with intellectual property? Intellectual property does not refer to the intellectual work in itself, it refers to the copyright monopoly, but that is something different than the intellectual work in itself, and performing an infringement in a legislative monopoly does not equal that something has been stolen. All property involved in filesharing or file lockers is owned by the involved parties themselves, not an eventual copyright holder.

      > “May the best thief win.”

      Is this more confusion or plain ignorance? Someone who performs a copyright infringement, by using his own property, that he owns, in a certain manner, is not a thief. This indisputable fact can be verified in both law and a dictionary.

      • Guesticles

        Amazing script you got there TF. Your resident spambot never fails to show up with the same “You seem confused” babble whenever someone has a slightly different view than what your site promotes.

        • Guest

           Yes, their resident spambot also seems confused about / unaware of the fact that the UK Theft Act considers theft to apply not only to  physical goods and property but also to intangible goods such as “rights”.

        • Fredrika

          > “..also seems confused about / unaware of the fact that the UK Theft Act considers theft to apply not only to  physical goods and property but also to intangible goods such as “rights”.”

          Rest assured i’m fully aware of the fact that the UK Theft Act says that theft can occur to intangible assets, such as legislative monopolies, but performing an intrusion into said monopoly and it’s unlimited distribution rights does not mean that theft has occurred, or that any scarce asset has been been appropriated, the owner still owns the monopoly. An intrusion into distribution rights is simply not theft according to the UK Theft Act. Intrusions into the copyright monopoly is not regulated in the UK Theft Act, which it would have been had it been theft, it’s regulated in a entirely different part of the UK law.

          I had a discussion with another ignorant troll about this very topic ten months ago, who had an unusually hard time understanding this, and finally he referred to press translations of German court sentences for completely different crimes, and a judges personal attempt at an analogy, as his only evidence of his misconception.

        • Guest

           Fredrika, that’s your “opinion” which, of course, you are entitled to. It is not, however, what the UK Theft Act says as anyone who cares to read it will discover. No amount of strawmen presented by you regarding “legislative monopolies” will change the fact. I respect your position & opinion but please, unless you are suitably qualified to do so or have appropriate precedents to refer to, don’t try to pretend that the law is not what it is.

        • DocGerbil100

          … yet, strangely, in the – what is it, now, two years, since she started here? – not one of you buggers has been able to shoot down a single significant part of her arguments.

          Funny, that.

          >:D

        • Guest

           Fredrika, here is what an intangible asset is – scarcity is irrelevant. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intangible_asset I know it’s inconvenient for you to be challenged here on your home turf but again I’ll ask you – are you suitably legally qualified to give a legal interpretation of the Theft Act or are you simply positing your opinion as qualified legal “fact”? I’m genuinely interested to know.

        • Fredrika

          > “..here is what an intangible asset is..”

          The text clearly stated that the copyright is what constitutes an intangible asset, as in the copyright monopoly. But the monopoly is not permanently deprived from it’s owner when someone performs an intrusion into the monopoly, and therefore no theft has taken place according to the UK Theft Act.

          > “I know it’s inconvenient for you to be challenged here on your home turf..”

          Inconvenient? I welcome it!! =)

          > “..but again I’ll ask you – are you suitably legally qualified to give a legal interpretation of the Theft Act..”

          Regardless of my qualification, i assume you would agree that the UK Courts are even more qualified on the subject? And for some reason they never sentence copyright infringing individuals for theft according to the UK Theft Act, when they have committed copyright infringements, the courts instead for some magical reason choose to sentence people according to an entirely different part of the UK law.

        • Guest

          Yes, I agree that the UK courts are more qualified that either of us on the matter. I also thank you for confirming to readers that what you post is not qualified legal advice or a qualified interpretation but rather, as I has assumed, your opinion. It is important that people know this, I’m sure you will agree. As I said earlier, I respect your position and your opinion – all I ask is that you afford me the same courtesy and I don’t think that’s too much to ask, is it?

        • Fredrika

          > “Yes, I agree that the UK courts are more qualified that either of us on the matter.”

          And why do they never come to your conclusion, that it’s theft? Why do they not sentence any copyright infringer according to the UK Theft Act? Why did the UK feel the need to create an entirely different legislation for handling copyright infringements? Hmm..

          That would be because they, unlike you, have no problem understanding the fact that the UK Theft Act does not say that copyright infringement is theft.

          > “I also thank you for confirming to readers that what you post is not qualified legal advice or a qualified interpretation..”

          You seem confused, i have not confirmed any such? Not commenting on the topic does not equal confirming anything.

          > “..but rather, as I has assumed, your opinion.”

          Rest assured, when i comment on this topic it is not my opinion i put forward, it is facts, facts that no UK Court has ever gone against. Facts that are so indisputable that the UK finds it absolutely necessary to handle copyright infringements in an entirely different part of their legislation.

          The one who puts forward an opinion is you, an opinion which is shared by no court or any logical line of reasoning.

          > “It is important that people know this, I’m sure you will agree.”

          I think something that is more important to have knowledge of is the basic logical understanding for the fact that not commenting on something does not equal confirming a particular statement. To not grasp this fundamental logical fact you have to be unusually ignorant.

          > “As I said earlier, I respect your position and your opinion..”

          Which i haven’t put forward any.

          > “..all I ask is that you afford me the same courtesy and I don’t think that’s too much to ask, is it?”

          By all means, you have a personal opinion that no UK court agrees with in any sentence whatsoever, an opinion that the UK has such an diametrically opposed opinion on, that they handle copyright infringements in a different part of their law.

          But you should really try to understand that your opinion on the matter does not equal that the UK Theft Act says that a copyright infringement is theft, because it simply doesn’t.

      • Ftyl

        I do not even understand this discussion. Who gives a rats ass if it is called theft or infringement?!

        Criminal infringement will get you into jail just like theft. General infringement will cost you a lot of money in a civil suit. So what’s the point of this discussion?!

        • Fredrika

          > “I do not even understand this discussion. Who gives a rats ass if it is called theft or infringement?!

          Criminal infringement will get you into jail just like theft. General infringement will cost you a lot of money in a civil suit. So what’s the point of this discussion?!”

          The debate about copyright and filesharing is not about what the law currently says, or what can get you punished. It would be completely meaningless to have a debate about what is already stated in the law. The debate is a political one, about what the law should say, and why it should say that, but when doing so, looking at what the law currently says as a starting point for what the law should say is text book circular reasoning, which is a logical fallacy.

          To poison this debate and it’s outcome some dishonest pro-copyright monopoly trolls purposely use the negative term theft about infringing, theft which is something that society already considers negative at a wide consensus, to project a negative value on the act, without arguing for why it’s negative in the first place or why it should be illegal.

          The pro-copyright trolls knows it isn’t theft, and most people knows this as well, but some doesn’t, including some politicians.

          Poisoning the debate with such dishonest rhetoric is a attempt to trick these somewhat ignorant people and politicians to use logical fallacies when they try to form their opinion on what the law should say, and why. This is something that will only slow the debate down and possibly even corrupt it, and that is something that is definitely harmful for society, so if you care about society, copyright, culture and having an honest debate, the first thing one should do is to weed out the dishonest trolls. Sometimes that means pointing out facts about what is and what definitely isn’t theft, so that their dishonest rhetoric’s trying to persuade people drawing their conclusions in a by others pre-determined direction, is exposed as the fraud it is.

          Did this explanation clear things up for you? Maybe you already knew it isn’t theft, but others might not because of ignorance, and it’s for them i write the comments i write, to help keeping the debate honest and un-poisoned.

        • DocGerbil100

          Fredrika: speaking as someone who is both (a) on the sauce and (b) exists openly with something of a foot in both pro- and anti-copyright camps, this is probably the single best and most honest answer you could possibly have ever written.

          Thank you very much, Fredrika.
          It’s appreciated.

          :):):):):)

        • Fredrika

          > “speaking as someone who is both (a) on the sauce and (b) exists openly with something of a foot in both pro- and anti-copyright camps, this is probably the single best and most honest answer you could possibly have ever written.”

          You are clearly on the sauce, because stating the bleeding obvious can’t be considered that good!? =)

          But thanks for the tip, because i had completely forgotten about my glass of elderberry schnapps!! It’s been standing besides me for hours.. =)

          > “Thank you very much, Fredrika.
          It’s appreciated.”

          I do what little i can. And spread the word about me!! =)

        • ftyl

          Can not reply to Fredrika… so replied to my own instead…

          So yes, its not theft, it is infringement. Last time I checked, “infringement” is also a negative word. At least people with knowledge of the english language will know that.

          I love how people that do not create intellectual property call it a “monopoly” or “trolling” though when people that have a copyright on something want to protect it…

          Explain this to me, why exactly should a copyright owner not have the right to protect their creation that they spent money on? You seem in a unique position to answer this.

          This is not about DMCA or other legal issues surrounding copyright law btw. I completely get why DMCA is there and such… but I also understand where its limits should be. This is purely about the fact that certain people, and you included it seems like, wants to think that someone that CREATES something should not have any rights to it. That seems strange to me.

          Then you also have a bunch of people here saying how professional porn sucks anyway, amateurs are much better… great, I think both have their place… but most importantly, amateurs that create their own clips also own copyrights to them. So explain to me how this changes anything in the debate itself?!

        • Fredrika

          > “Can not reply to Fredrika… so replied to my own instead…”

          You can always post the reply in its correct place through the Disqus Dashboard.

          > “So yes, its not theft, it is infringement. Last time I checked, “infringement” is also a negative word. At least people with knowledge of the english language will know that.”

          There is a difference in the negative value of theft versus infringement. Almost nobody questions that the act of theft is wrong, but that an infringement is wrong is not an as easy conclusion to come to for most people, unless they use circular reasoning and assume it’s wrong just because it’s illegal. The debate is about whether or not certain acts should be an infringement in the first place or not, and that might not be the case. Using the word theft as pro-copyright monopoly trolls do is an dishonest attempt at pushing the debate in the pre-determined direction that it should be, simply because theft is wrong, which is a completely irrelevant fact.

          > “I love how people that do not create intellectual property call it a “monopoly”..”

          The copyright monopoly is a legislative monopoly regardless of whether or not someone creates? Calling a monopoly for a monopoly is factual. Are you saying that some people because of what they do tries to hide facts?

          Secondly, you can not create intellectual property. You can create intellectual works, but the intellectual work does not constitute intellectual property Intellectual property refers to the copyright monopoly, which only exists if the law says it exists, the intellectual works exists regardless of what any law says.

          Were you not aware of the difference between an intellectual work and intellectual property?

          > “..or “trolling” though when people that have a copyright on something want to protect it…”

          Whether or not you are a monopoly holder and want to have your monopoly protected has no relevance whatsoever for what constitutes trolling? Trolling is when you purposely resort to logical fallacies to poison a debate. Do you not know what trolling or logical fallacies is?

          > “Explain this to me, why exactly should a copyright owner not have the right to protect their creation that they spent money on?”

          The question is false, because it reverses the order of society. The only thing that should be justified is the prohibitions in law, in this case the copyright monopoly. So the real question is why should society prohibit people from certain use of their property if the use is based on the use of intellectual works, and the burden of proof for answering that question lies upon the party that wants the copyright monopoly.

          The answer to the question should contain evidence that proofs that 1) a verifiable documented problem exist for society, 2) that the solution, the monopoly, solves the problem, and 3) that the prohibition and the upholding of it constitutes an proportionate intrusion into peoples freedom and human rights, and that it causes a positive value for society, because as you might know, all legislative monopolies aim to benefit society as a whole, not the individual monopoly holder.

          > “I completely get why DMCA is there and such…”

          Because some monopoly holders lobbied the US government to adopt it. No other country in the world has fallen for that trick.

          > “This is purely about the fact that certain people, and you included it seems like, wants to think that someone that CREATES something should not have any rights to it. That seems strange to me.”

          That is not my opinion nor is the opinion of most pirates. Most agree that society would benefit from a copyright monopoly regulating some use of intellectual works. But the copyright monopoly has never ever been absolute, regulating all use, and it never will be.

          Secondly, the discussion is not about any rights to it as to the intellectual work, which is what they created. It’s about a privilege to intrude into other peoples property, property that they own, and their freedom of communication. A legislative monopoly only exists as an intrusion into property rights, forbidding all other people, than the monopoly holder, to manufacture goods and services with their property.

          So the reason it seems strange to you might because you evidently seem to be completely ignorant of the most fundamental basics about the copyright monopoly, what it is and what it does.

          > “Then you also have a bunch of people here saying how professional porn sucks anyway, amateurs are much better… great, I think both have their place… but most importantly, amateurs that create their own clips also own copyrights to them. So explain to me how this changes anything in the debate itself?!”

          It doesn’t.

        • DocGerbil100

          “You can always post the reply in its correct place through the Disqus Dashboard”

          Hello, Fredrika.

          I can reply to you, because you have a name I can and reply to, directly via the Disqus dashboard, but I was wondering: is there any way to reply to the unfeasible number of trolls who seem to be waiting for the second nested layer of comments (or later) in order to post, in clear attempt to avoid replies that contradict their shameless/shameful propaganda?

          If not, does anyone know of a Disqus link, where we can complain about it’s absence?

          To all: Many thanks for coherent replies. :)

        • Fredrika

          > “I can reply to you, because you have a name I can and reply to, directly via the Disqus dashboard..”

          Can you reply to people you follow directly through the Dashboard even if their answer isn’t directed at you personally? I’ve never followed anyone, so i didn’t know about that feature in that case, but that would be helpful when the trolls post propaganda to other persons in the final layer. On many occasions i’ve wanted to write replies to such comments, but i usually avoid posting replies if i can’t get them to end up in the correct place.

          > “..but I was wondering: is there any way to reply to the unfeasible number of trolls who seem to be waiting for the second nested layer of comments (or later) in order to post, in clear attempt to avoid replies that contradict their shameless/shameful propaganda?”

          One method is to have the article page in a tab with the real-time updating active(although that tends to stop working after a while), then they will appear at the top, where you can reply to them, as long as you don’t update the page or the comments sorting.

          > “If not, does anyone know of a Disqus link, where we can complain about it’s absence?”

          http://disqus.com/support/

          And they have support forums as well i guess.

        • ftyl

          Frederika, you are quite good at not answering questions, got to give you that ;)

          You have not answered a single question I asked, you simply turned every single one around in an attempt to not have to answer it. That’s not a discussion, that’s evading the question.

          If you want to define it as intellectual work or property pre or post some statute in law does not matter and is completely irrelevant, you know perfectly well what I meant.

          I will ask you again. Explain to me why someone that creates something, spending for example 1000 USD doing so, should not be protected? Why should someone be interested in spending 1000 USD if they can not be sure that they have rights which protects their investment so that they can do what they see fit to get return on their investment?

          You say this discussion is about why someone can not do what they want with their property. To as you say “manufacture goods for their property”… Online Piracy is simple, no need to evade the discussion:

          1) Person A creates a work, spends X USD doing so, sells copies of it for Y USD.
          2) Person B buys 1 such copy for Y USD.
          3) Person B then gives copies of his 1 copy for free (or not free) to Persons C-Z.

          Explain to me why Person B should be allowed to do that. How is Person B any worse off if she is not allowed to do 3). Is there any physical or financial harm to Person B if he is not allowed to do 3)?

          No need to now argue that there is no financial harm to Person A since you claim none of Persons C-Z would have bought a copy. That argument is flawed simply because you have no guarantee that this is the case, so the argument does not work.

        • Fredrika

          > “..you are quite good at not answering questions, got to give you that ;)”

          You are quite good at asking false dishonest questions.

          > “You have not answered a single question I asked, you simply turned every single one around in an attempt to not have to answer it. That’s not a discussion, that’s evading the question.”

          I do not answer dishonest question that are based on false premisses, that reverse the order of society. Asking those questions are logical fallacies, and such questions should never be answered, they should instead be identified as false questions, and left alone just as that, leaving the questionnaire with shame over realizing what he just did, but you don’t seem to understand that?

          > “If you want to define it as intellectual work or property pre or post some statute in law does not matter and is completely irrelevant..”

          I’m not defining anything? The distinction between an intellectual work and intellectual property is a fact. I asked you if you weren’t aware of this fact?

          > “..you know perfectly well what I meant.”

          To what particular part of your previous response do you refer?

          > “I will ask you again. Explain to me why someone that creates something, spending for example 1000 USD doing so, should not be protected?”

          I answered the question, did you not understand the answer?

          > “Why should someone be interested in spending 1000 USD if they can not be sure that they have rights which protects their investment so that they can do what they see fit to get return on their investment?”

          How is it my responsibility to convince confused investors with delusions of grandeur?

          > “You say this discussion is about why someone can not do what they want with their property. To as you say “manufacture goods for their property”..”

          No, i’m not saying that, and that is a false quotation.

          > “1) Person A creates a work, spends X USD doing so, sells copies of it for Y USD.
          2) Person B buys 1 such copy for Y USD.
          3) Person B then gives copies of his 1 copy for free (or not free) to Persons C-Z.

          Explain to me why Person B should be allowed to do that.”

          I will never answer such a dishonest question, that reverses the order of society and the burden of proof. I explained to you in great detail why that question should never be answered little less asked, and yet you again you ask it. Did you not understand what i wrote in my previous reply?

          > “How is Person B any worse off if she is not allowed to do 3).”

          A prohibition by nature prohibits someone from doing something. If they want to do it, they are logically worse of by not being allowed to do it. Is simple logical reasoning a problem for you?

          > “Is there any physical or financial harm to Person B if he is not allowed to do 3)?”

          If he wishes to sell copies according to the free market rules to support himself you could obviously argue that there is financial harm if he’s not allowed to do that. Legislative monopolies usually do harm the economy and entrepreneurship, this is the first thing you learn when you study economics.

          > “No need to now argue that there is no financial harm to Person A since you claim none of Persons C-Z would have bought a copy.”

          Are you confusing me with someone else? I have never argued such, nor would i, because it is irrelevant to this discussion whether or not person A suffers financial harm, since because as i mentioned, legislative monopolies are never intended to benefit the individual monopoly holder.

          > “That argument is flawed simply because you have no guarantee that this is the case, so the argument does not work.”

          Do you know what a straw-man argument is? It is when you argue against an alleged claim from the other person, which that person never put forward in the first place, as you just did., Doing so is another logical fallacy. You’re supposed to stay away from those, not embracing them in such a ignorant manner as you for some reason do.

    • PelouzeTF

      Many people have noticed this. Irony indeed ;)

  • Phil Landry

    Anyway, nowadays everybody has a camera, so even the amateur stuff is not that bad. And there is so much pr0n already online, that we could jerk for the rest of our lives without probably seeing the same video twice and still have enough without making new videos!

  • anon

    i know how hard it is to stop watching porn, im not saying to stop im just saying QUIT USING PORNHUB AND YOUPORN. There are other choices out there lets start using them.cough cough redtube i remember when that was everyones choice

  • Violated0

    This sounds much like “no honour amongst thieves”
    If they are all DMCA safe-harbour companies and all follow take-down procedure then they are all lawful. The rest is then corporate bullying, unfair trade practices, and of course rights holders not doing a good enough job policing their own creations.
    I well know that YouPorn & PornHub have lots of infringing media when it is impossible to avoid this which makes them stupid.

    They also ignore that some people want to shut them down as well. The truth is they are supplying pornography to children when there is no age rating system backed up by a bank card to prove age 18. That means agony aunts now hear from young teenagers pondering fetishes once only the realm of bored middle-aged men.
    Not that I much care. Where would our species be without curiosity and the desire to bang each other? Restrictions would also be against our freely sharing culture and anonymity. One can always hope for some parental guidance though.In then end we are heading towards an open sexual culture not unlike the Roman Empire shortly before their fall.

    • http://profiles.google.com/zerianis10 Christopher Kidwell

      There is no age rating system backed up by a credit card because it is not that goddamned hard for a kid to ‘grab’ their parents credit card or have the number written down and use it to get on these porn sites.

      Bottom line is that if children want to see porn, THEY WILL SEE PORN! It’s perfectly natural at any age to be interested in naked bodies and the only people who say that porn ‘harms’ children who see is are religious asswipes who think that their ‘god’ is going to get angry if their children are sexually active before marriage.

      • Violated0

        I agree with you but their point is an age rating bank card system would keep out MOST children. The determined deserve to be there but idle browsing?

        It is not hard for an adult to troll sites popular with children and post links to adult media or sites. I recall 4Chan once proved that on YouTube.

        Two clicks later and all “Mommy! Mommy! Why it that black man doing that with his penis?”

      • YARIGHT

        not to mention when you curtail it bigtime they pedo priests come to mind 
        ya we need a war on religion not on terror….or maybe they both the same thing….

  • foff

    How ironic?  The internet helped spread porn like water.  Porn sites were growing in leaps and bounds,  Then it started to bite them in ass.  There is so much free porn out there only a stupid fuck will buy porn anymore.  I personally have never bought porn on the internet and never will.  May be some of the hard core porn addicts buy it I don’t know.  As for Oron they are a shit cyberlocker and would be no loss if they closed.  It is harder then hell download anything off of them even with a premium account which once years ago I made the mistake of buying, fortunately it was only on a month mistake.

  • Guest

    Don’t worry, Adult Content Industry United Foundation. I wouldn’t your download your hideous shit for free.

    Infact, the first keyword I exclude when I search for porn is “pornstar”, because I don’t even want to see your plastic, fake-titted, shemale-looking hags in the search results.

    You want to know why you’re making less money? It’s because you’re facing more and more competition from amateurs who are actually attractive.

    • Gae

      Yup. Nothing worse than 2 inches thick of makeup and 2 lumps of silicone on a naked woman.

    • :D

       Don’t forget the 99.9% of videos of woman faking orgasms and fake moaning.

      Amateur ftw!

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/L2FW55JCG4NNVE2CCP5336XJRE Cheese!

    Watching porn is cool.

  • Azamsaif72

    any women call 776950888 azam

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    like Rita explained I am alarmed that some people able to profit $4786 in 1 month on the internet. did you look at this page  (Click on menu Home more information)   http://goo.gl/lRWGI  

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  • Baba

    They do not see they are shooting themselves in the foot?
    Their turn will come and all that they did that they thought was good will just be used against them.

  • BildelbergGroup

     How ironic , creators of sex to watch (porn) are being fucked themselves.

  • dwpbike

    industry porn sux.  homemade, please

    • http://profile.yahoo.com/L2FW55JCG4NNVE2CCP5336XJRE Cheese!

      I had sex with my teacher all during 9th and 10th grade.
      ====> Homeschooled.

      • ScrewEwe2

        Was your teacher your Mom or Dad? There’s a lot of stay at home Dad’s these days.

      • Bonjour

        Is that your fantasy? you are lol 

  • jack murdock

    Hahaha oh wow. I bet if tommorow the makers of chocolate threw in their support for anti piracy, you would get a bunch of a comments with “chocolate suXx”

    • Guest

      Except that you can not upload or download a bar of chocolate. Not yet.

      And yes the porn movie industry suck. I never understood why there is some people stupid enough to feed these assholes.

    • Guest

      Don’t kid yourself, Jack. People say the shit produced by the professional porn industry is fucking terrible because it’s fucking terrible. And we’ve been  saying this since waaaaay before the porn industry began trying to lynch copyright infingers.

      BTW, what country do you live in where the chocolate doesn’t ruitinely  suck ass? Because here in America it’s mostly this sugary brown palm oil bullshit with like 0.1% cocoa. It’s the pro porn of chocolate.

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  • Guest

    I don’t understand why there is a porn movie industry at all.

    Where the fuck is the creativity in fucking?  Can you claim copyright on something which is not creative?

    People should Just videotape their own fucking and put it on you tube and  tell the fucking porn movie industry to fuck itself.

  • Asdf

    their logo looks like an asshole

  • Afronauts

    Holy shit I almost thought a article about “Google Buying” porno tube sites would show up, but this…really? YouPorn was never that great, you can download a video titled “Hot Chick Fucks Guy” so many times. Pornohub was okay, but they gotten stale over the years. 

  • Andrew Lee

    Heh… I’m so confused right now :( Are they saying these sites would be okay if they were a “tube site”? O_o

    Anyways I am a very curious person so I decided to see how much uploaded content to Oron is exclusive. So far as I can see it’s not very exclusive :o out of few hundred  random files I’ve yet to find one that was only uploaded to Oron.
     
    In fact I found them with ease on multiple sites download & tube sites alike.. Giving it to Oron up the poop-chute is not going to fix anything. 

    It’s obvious to me that these people are severely handicap when it comes to finding files.

    Why in the hell do people have this grand idea of if it’s not on Google it does not exist? It would be like saying that since Wal-Mart does not sell a product it does not exist..

    Really if you can’t find something at Wal-Mart do you just stop looking?

    • Rii

      What the fuck!? Really, those bastards do know a couple of their vids are illegally on their site, right?
      Fuck em, I only dl their vids anyway, craphub don’t work on a wii.
      Let them kill the google links while the files still exist and I dl them as usual.

  • al

    I say ban porn on the internet. Then I can stilluse a cyberlocker. Simple fix for the money grubbing skin traders.

    • ScrewEwe2

      Ban porn on the internet? What do you suggest for getting free content, a library card to check out the latest National Geographic showing pics of hot African Babes with bare Boobs? Gotta admit that it did peak my interest in 7th grade before moving on to Playboy and Hustler.

  • lulzzz

    Meh.. crooks fighting crooks.. like gang wars over territory of who has rights to steal. antipiracy company takes hush money like when Pablo Escobar gave donations to charity… community thinks he is great. Lol!

  • blah

    Torrentfreak editor, I encourage you to look into the background of the scumbag who owns this site and is involved with the legal against Oron. http://truebabes.com/oron/

    He’s a CONVICTED kid fiddler.

  • 345

    i was never a fan of oron and their huge limitation for both free and premium users but i dont want this to happen cuz it makes other filehosts look bad.

  • john doe

    PornHub – “It makes your GREED bigger”

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  • hitler

    this is unfair to sue small number of company group , why don’t they sue all file hosting and tube that pirating materials . . .  quiter never win . but filesonic.com and wupload.com they quit earlier then, they’re save by the bell . . .lot of affiliate disappointed for filesonic they gone took the money. they must sue filesonic first

  • http://www.tubescentral.com/ Info

    pornhub is the greatest

  • mc1964

    This sounds like restraint of trade to me.

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  • Siao

    oron promoter 
    http://www.besteens.org/

  • Jg10021

    People are missing the larger story here.

    Taking down Oron is just one aspect of the pending litigation.

    The plaintiffs want to go after the resellers who profited most AND downloaders who presumably paid for higher download speeds.  It would be the first time that a lawsuit targeted the occasional downloader.  They are also trying to link all parties to the enterprise, i.e. making the downloaders responsible parties just as much as Oron or the resellers.

    As much as the plaintiffs want Oron shut down, they want their activity date and the IP addresses of those who downloaded content.

    They will soon be joined by other plaintiffs and since Oron’s financial assets are largely out of reach, the only way to make money on this litigation is to after individuals with settlement offers.

    That’s the larger game here.

    Taking out Oron is step one.  Getting them to hand over logs, etc. is step two.

  • Guest

    They’re all hypocrites anyway, all of the sponsors of ACIUF (ACI United Foundation), including it’s own president’s company (google the names and find out), have sites that contain a load of pirated content, but whats worse is that the sites of the ACIUF president’s company mostly contains illegal content (under-aged + if you talk to half of the girls on their live sites which actually are a bit older, they’ll tell you they’re being forced to make movies as well).

    The entire porn industry is full of illegal activities and actions, yet all they do is complain about what others do to them, never looking at how they should start with cleaning up their own shit first.

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