I can not agree with you in 100% regarding some thoughts, but you got good point of view…

Ever work with horses? Sometimes they’re persnickety, just to _be_ persnickety.
In the cat and mouse battle between DPI and P2P, DPI may be able to detect P2P traffic; it may even be able to tell the type of traffic;

but if it can ever _read_ fully encrypted traffic? Then online commerce is dead.

Either it is publicly possible to send data streams of completely unreadable information across the internet, or else every account number, login, password – every deail – of every online transaction is comprised. Not might be compromised. IS compromised.

So it seems reasonable to assume that it will always be possible to create completely unreadable data streams on the internet.

And as for DPI’ing your way through these, to figure out what song goes where, and allocating the money accordingly? Good luck; you may be able to tell our traffic is encrypted, but you won’t be able to find out its contents. Ergo, you won’t be able to determine how to divy up the money, or at least prove you did it legitimately. And, finally, ergo if I were an artist being paid (or not) by this system, I think I’d be pretty pissed off at being assigned my dues on an arbitrary basis!

And believe you me, we are persnickety; make this DPI intra/transnational, and we can / I will go to full scale encryption: just because :)

It’s really very easy, as all of you have proved.[/quote]

*facepalms* look you idiot you obviously don’t understand the future of file-sharing like the general public does. obviously you have the intelligence of a gnat if you honestly think what the RIAA and the MPAA are doing the right thing. I’ll give you something to chew on. Sony BMG one of the biggest names in the industry. the LAST ONE to hold out on putting their music up for sale on Amazon and getting rid of the Digital Rights Management. if you read all of the studies they show that COMPACT DISK SALES ARE DOWN! NOT DIGITAL MEDIA!

@112 is very interesting.
This is a very good view, the problem is, people in Europe (Euopean Community) got a real great portion of not to be free: if you are using the internet, ALL YOUR ACTIVITIES will be recorded and stored at leas for 6 months.
So, again, for better understanding: AT LEAST FOR 6 MONTHS.

Sad to see a potentially great discussion topic get ruined by some idiot..

It’s really very easy, as all of you have proved.

wow, you don’t get it, do you? NOBODY CARES what you think about the upcoming ISP fees! NOBODY.

But you apparently care, Quisling. You’re very invested, it seems, in having us watch you gloating and giggling to yourself and rubbing your little hands together with glee. You want to demonstrate some kind of superior understanding or morality or something over us, little Quisling. I detect that eagerness in you.

What do you want, Quisling? Why are you gleefully, if prematurely, celebrating the prospect of the public (that include you) getting a worse deal? Have you let yourself imagine that you’re not like us, one of the public?

Tell us, Quisling. We’re all so very curious about you now, you frothing little tool. Tell us what your interest in this matter is, Quisling. I wonder what a pro-RIAA member of the public might be like. Podunk RIAA under-lawyer? Coke-head music industry promotional shill? Garage-dwelling emo band boy? Freeper/slashdotter, Ron Paul-bot?

What’s your beef, Quisling? Why are you here?

The ISP fee is going to work, and very easily. Bands will be paid based on how many times their songs or albums are downloaded. The playing field will be leveled; bands will get paid whether they’re on a major label or an independent artist.[/quote]

Dude.. You still didn’t answer my question..

What about Authors?

I’m writing a book, and I want all isp’s to give me money too. So i can sit back and do nothing but count the money, like the RIAA.

How can I get into this tax, or is this so called music fee only for the elite few?

The ISP fee is going to work, and very easily. Bands will be paid based on how many times their songs or albums are downloaded. The playing field will be leveled; bands will get paid whether they’re on a major label or an independent artist.

I find it amusing that you cited a U.S. Supreme Court decision to disprove an obvious troll. That’s like killing a spider with a shotgun! ;) Seriously, great work.

To the troll: stick around, you’re fun. A lot of people actually think the flatrate system is a good idea, and your posting has elicited a number of solid reasons why not. Sometimes it helps to have someone who brings out these answers.

second: file sharing is not stealing. it’s spreading of information, culture and knowledge.
if you say i’m a criminal then i will act like one and beat the shit out of you when i ever get a chance.

third: on the “making a living out of touring” topic: yes, music performers can make a living out of touring if they are good anf worth listening to. of course they should tour regularly not only once-twice a year. by us (hungary) the really good performers, bands do this and they do make a good living out of it. they don’t mind filesharing as it is the way they get new fans, who then go to concerts and buy merch. only the untalented, bad, “worthless” ones are bragging about filesharing, and of course the ones who are too lasy to tour and they expect a constant high-grade living from record sales (and they do have it, but they always want more and more and more…). britney spears and alike aren’t going to starve to death because of filesharing, they will only earn 10 milloin $-s instead of 15 million a year (or something like that). oh, how bad for them… :P

fourth: ever thought of people who can’t afford to buy records at those ridiculous prices? like a college student who, after paying the costs of education, barely can afford even food? or a 12-16 year old kid who gets about 5$ a week? these people hardly could by the records of their loved bands. and what about exploring new bands, music? imagine somebody gathering his little money for a month and then buying a CD wich turns out to be crap.

and that leads us to the fifth: without filesharing, you could hardly explore new bands. you would only listen to the ones on the radios’ top 40 or top 100 charts and that’s all. britney spears and madonna and alike for a lifetime… . this goes especially for people who have different tastes than the mainstream pop music. i’m one of them. without filesharing i wouldn’t even know the 90% of my loved bands because you CAN’T get them here. this goes even for a lot of well known bands. imagine how it is for some other more underground, not so mainstream performers (and i do listen to a lot of them)and music genres. not everybody wants to listen to pop, rap and disco. the fact is that in a lot of countries you can’t get non mainstream music from legal ways if the band/performer lives in an other country. the hungarian anti-piracy organisations are bragging about us filesharers, though we download stuff they haven’t even heard of (so they don’t even sell it). i simply CAN’T buy them. and even if i could, as i’m one of the above already mentioned poor students, i couldn’t pay the prices of the recordings, not to mention the shipping costs between countries, continents.

these are some very good reasons for letting people share files.

for the topic about monitoring internet activity and ban filesharers: that fucking bitch is nuts. somebody should kill her with a car-bomb as she is a threat to humanity. i pay for the isp-s for internet acces. without restrictions, without monitoring. i have a right to privacy, and that goes for my internet activity to. as police can’t come and search through my house without evidence and court order, nobody should monitor my activity on the net for the same reasons. nor the police, nor some other authority, and especially not some wanna-be-god, self proclaimed “copiright defender”, profit hunting organisations made up from a bunch of worthless wanna-be-god assholes who couldn’t find themself a real job, so they decided to suck other peoples blood.

they want to take away our rights and freedom and turn the world in to a police state in order to suck the blood of musicians and their fans. they think that they are somekind of ubermensch , that they can push around governments and change laws. they think they can tell the rest (99,99%) of the world what to do and what not. such people should die. or at least get a good beating a few times.
if they ever manage to take away my rights and my freedom i will place a huge bomb in their building and blow it up when the most of them are inside. then i will grab a rifle, track down and execute the rest of them.

it is our right to share files for non commercial purpose. better said: it is our DUTY to spread culture and knowledge and to fight for our rights.

and for that above mentioned anonymous prick: i would love to have 10 minutes alone with you in a room, without any questions.

Er, no. Not lost. Gained. You really don’t know any economics, do you, you dumbass troll? Anyone who uses the word “lost” in that context betrays themselves as a fuckwit, a stooge, or as in your case, both.

If I give a copy of a CD to a friend, my friend is up $20, that he will spend elsewhere in the economy. The record industry isn’t down $20, no-one is. If I was unable to give my friend the copy, he wouldn’t have bothered buying it. So now, he has a CD, and $20 worth of petrol or a shirt or whatever-the-fuck as well as the CD. He has gained.

I notice you’re still too dumb to figure out how to allocate yourself a name …

Gotta feel sorry for him though really, to be so desperate.

Please talk to a professional, then come back into the community when you’re better.

Problem is, no one cares what you think.

Millions of dollars have been lost from illegal downloading. The ISP fee is the remedy. Now stop whining, bitch.

The definitions of stealing, and copyright infringements, is decided by legislatures and courts. In different nations, at different times, these definitions have changed. The current US definition, by the US Supreme Court, of copyright infringement is quoted above.

I can’t imagine why any private individual might want unelected, unaccountable, money-grubbing corporations to decide social morality. The idea is ridiculous.

yeah, you’ve got NPD.[/quote]

And who should decide the definition? You?

I think you have a serious mental issue. Seriously, to get so upset over this, you should talk to someone.

yeah, you’ve got NPD.

Your ability to write “LOL” before every comment impresses no-one, douchebag. Come up with some new schtick.

Yeah, all those judgments being handed down against music thieves are just a figment of my imagination.

Judgements for what? Not stealing. Hell, not even for assault. OMGZORS, guess what? Those judgements aren’t for jaywalking either! Those people were only ever charged with, or sued for, infringement of copyright.

Which. Isn’t. Stealing.

LOL.

Yeah, all those judgments being handed down against music thieves are just a figment of my imagination.[/quote]

What judgments?

Oh.. the paid arguments you mean?

Well.. we all know who the real thieves are don’t we.

LOL.

Yeah, all those judgments being handed down against music thieves are just a figment of my imagination.

Bloody well get on with it then.

Here’s where the law was stated: USSC Dowling v United States, 1985. Blackmun J: “(copyright infringement) does not easily equate with theft, conversion, or fraud… The infringer invades a statutorily defined province guaranteed to the copyright holder alone. But he does not assume physical control over copyright; nor does he wholly deprive its owner of its use.”

… and it has not since changed, despite the frantic efforts of the RIAA/MPAA and their various trolls (ie, you) to conflate copyright infringement and stealing in the minds of the public.

Maybe you’d like to try for … hmm … “overtaking against the lane markers” or something. “Copyright is overtaking against the lane markers! You’re overtaking! See the double-yellow line? See? The law says there’s a double-yellow line there, and when you download a movie, you are overtaking!”

Show me where the law changed.

It didn’t. You’re stealing.[/quote]

LAW? Who gives a flying fark what the law says, the laws will change due to popular opinion, and that is, it’s not stealing.

ok.. now i’m off to get me some music that people are sharing.

Show me where the law changed.

It didn’t. You’re stealing.

Change with the times. If you can’t handle the future, change your job.

That doesn’t change the law, or the owners right to distribute their work in a way they decide.

They get to decide that, not you.

Unless they say you can take it, you’re stealing.

The proper analogy would be “I’ve decided I like your car, I should be able to see it/a picture of it/whatever”. You viewing his car doesn’t affect his possession of his car in the least, nor does replicating the image of it (via a photo). He still has his car.

OIC, you get to decide how the world should work and live, huh? I like your thinking. I’ve decided you need to share your girlfriend with me. Tell her to get her stinky ass over here right now, and get ready for long afternoon of blowing me.

You see, you’re all very, very ill. Classic NPD.[/quote]

Good point !

Although, should change girlfriend to car (Porshe whatever), thereby bypassing any human rights issues yet staying right on topic.

I love analogies! Keep’em up, guys!

I think it’s pretty obvious he doesn’t have a girlfriend.

OIC, you get to decide how the world should work and live, huh? I like your thinking. I’ve decided you need to share your girlfriend with me. Tell her to get her stinky ass over here right now, and get ready for long afternoon of blowing me.

You see, you’re all very, very ill. Classic NPD.

get a job

He’ll be out of office soon.
…
[/quote]

What is up with blaming Bush for anti-filesharing? Its a BIG government over there, folks! Its not like one guy controls, or even knows about, every little thing that’s going on. I mean, to us p2p is big, but when you have to deal with national defense, healthcare, education, agriculture, transportation, immigration, arts and science funding, etc. etc. etc. for over 300 million people plus keep an eye on international affairs with every country on the planet, then p2p amoungst 60 million or so of your citizens makes a pretty damn small blip on your radar!

Whether you picture him as an honest guy splitting his time between his national responsibilities and his family, or a greedy dumbass *wad trying to take over the planet and steal everyone’s stuff, clamping down on music sharing is, I would think, pretty low on his list of priorities.

PS – that’s not to say there are no lower-level factions in his government which take bribes from the mafIAA and do everything in their power to clamp down on p2p.

Nice punt.

I created it. I get to decide where goes, not you.[/quote]

Not really. If your song becomes part of mainstream media the public ultimately decides where it goes. If all goes well it will become part of a society’s culture and end up in the public domain. Future artists may draw on it for inspiration to create new works. This enriches the world. This is written into the constitution of the united States. Because of what we call the ‘Bono Act’ a law on October 27, 1998, amends the copyright laws by extending the duration of copyright protection. In general, copyright terms were extended for an additional 20 years. Hollywood lobbied congress to pass un fair laws like this that hurt everyone. Let me give a brief example here: the Sonny Bono Copyright Term Extension Act of 1998—so named in honor of the late Rep. Bono, and not because it extended his copyright terms—was constitutional. Prior to the Bono Act, an individually owned work was protected for the creator’s life plus 50 more years; corporate-owned copyrights lasted a flat 75 years. The law extended both timespans by two decades, prompting a legal challenge from Eric Eldred, a bibliophile in New Hampshire who wanted to put digitized editions of old books online.

When the Court ruled against Eldred, the Disney Corporation issued a collective sigh of relief. Before the Bono Act passed, Mickey Mouse was set to enter the public domain in 2004, with his best-known animated pals following shortly afterward. One reason Disney put its weight behind the 1998 legislation was to keep Mickey and the gang on the plantation; Eldred’s backers subsequently adopted Free the Mouse as an unofficial slogan.

Mickey’s own reaction to the decision was less enthusiastic. Telling his keepers that he was going on an “ice run for the boss,” the mouse made his way to a dive bar a few miles outside Disneyland, where he gave reason an exclusive interview.

Q: How does it feel to have your sentence extended by two decades?

A: How do you think it feels? For almost 70 years, I’ve only been allowed to do what the Disney people say I can do. Sometimes someone comes up with a new idea, and I think to myself, “Great! Here’s a chance to stretch myself!” But of course they won’t let me leave the reservation. If I do, they send out their lawyers to bring me home.

In 1971, for instance, Dan O’Neill got me a part in something called Air Pirates Funnies. It was great: I got to have sex, I got to use drugs, I got to explore the whole underground comix scene. It was liberating.

USA + Canada = 3rd World.

Our pipes are pathetic. (50-150 kB/s anyone?)

Its not the US government thats the problem, its the corporations donating to candidates so they can get political favors.
If the world desires do download something, eventually it will become legal to download- the point we need to make is (of course) with our money. Currently, the big corporations are “donating” millions away into the US government, trying to stop piracy. just look here!

http://www.opensecrets.org/industries/indus.asp?Ind=B02

im not saying that all of that money is from the RIAA, but I can assure you that a good chunk of it is.
@76, a truly brilliant statement, for that is the truth of how things are now. with the advent of CD’s even, it got harder and harder to control the spread of information- ever since then, large corporations have of course been trying to protect “their product”. Look where its gotten them- on the verge of collapse because they cant hold back the tide of information.

They don’t give a shit about this because Swedish stuff isn’t being stolen.

And like their opinion is going to actually ever matter anyway. haha.[/quote]

Are you one of those people who thinks the USA creates everything?