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US Official Speaks Untruths About Torrent-Finder Domain Seizure

Two months ago the United States Government seized more than 80 domains that were allegedly involved in copyright related offenses. Among these sites was the relatively unknown BitTorrent meta-search engine Torrent-Finder. From the start there has been a lot of critique, but the director of ICE has now come out to defend their actions. Unfortunately, his ignorance and hugely misleading comments add yet more black marks to the track record of his office.

iceLate November last year, the news that 82 domains had been seized by the Department of Justice (DOJ) and Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) was making headlines across the Internet. In particular, the seizure of the BitTorrent meta-search engine Torrent-Finder has been discussed widely.

The legitimacy of the Torrent-Finder domain seizure was questioned from the start, and the owner of the site is now fighting to get his domain back through an expensive legal procedure. In the past several weeks the authorities involved in the seizures have not responded to the critique, but at the Congressional Internet Caucus’ State of the ‘Net conference ICE director John Morton broke the silence.

“They were all knowingly engaged in the sale of counterfeit goods,” Morton said yesterday, defending the “Cyber Monday Crackdown” domain seizures. “We’re going to enforce the law. It’s that simple,” he added.

Now this is just flat out wrong, on more than one count.

For one, torrent sites are in no way connected to counterfeit goods. A counterfeit product is by definition an imitation of a product that is often sold to consumers as the real deal. The term applies to fake watches, clothing and other consumer goods, but certainly not to any of the digital files that can be found via search engines such as Torrent-Finder.

In addition, the ICE director claims that such counterfeit goods were sold at Torrent-Finder. Again, this is nowhere near the truth as virtually all torrent sites, Torrent-Finder included, offer their services to the public at no cost. There is nothing to be sold, and certainly not any counterfeit goods.

It has to be said that many of the seized domains were indeed involved in selling counterfeit products, but Torrent-Finder and several music linking sites weren’t. That said, Morton’s statement specifically includes all their seized sites, even though the controversial position of Torrent-Finder and the music linking sites were brought up at the conference.

The ICE director made quite a misstep with the statement we quoted above, and the worrying part is that it might even be unintentional. It wouldn’t surprise us if Morton has no idea what a torrent site actually is. The frequent mix-up between counterfeiting and digital piracy, however, is a worrying trend for sure.

Although we quoted less than two dozen words from Morton there is another part that we believe isn’t as “simple” as the ICE director claims. “We’re going to enforce the law,” he said, but that’s a stretched statement to say the least. What law is it, that mandates the seizure of a website that links to other websites that may link to files that could link to copyrighted material?

If there’s arguably any suspicion of a copyright infringement related offense committed by Torrent-Finder, wouldn’t it be a civil dispute under current law?

The documentation and the official response from ICE regarding the seizure of Torrent-Finder have “fail” written all over them. Not only is the response from Morton factually incorrect and inappropriate, but the original seizure warrant was also full of inaccuracies and misunderstandings as well.

The big question is whether it will matter in the end. The Government seems to be committed to a crackdown on piracy, and domain seizures are an effective tool to get sites down temporarily. It’s a grim outlook, but with the increased Government involvement in the Internet we fear that many sites may lose their domains in the coming year.

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  • lulz

    That’s comical… You know they aren’t saying jack because they know they’ve screwed up bad. How about some info on those court proceedings? There any dates set for that yet or is the paperwork still being filed?

    • Jay

      Pffft… A Court date? Next thing you know these pirates are going to ask for due process!

      We can’t have that in our Americas!

      • hotdog

        YOU SCARED?

      • Anonymous

        Yes this indexing website (you know, like google) wants their due process. Because they do nothing that is against the law. dealwithit.jpg

        • Jay

          Guys and girls…

          I was joking. I agree full heartedly. Obviously, text doesn’t put up the sarcasm quite well.

    • d56hot

      Start bookmarking the ip address of the sites LOL

      - http://www.sexy-southbabes.blogspot.com/

      • captain obvious

        WAY ahead of you

      • Bryan

        Why did you feel the need to link to a blog full of fat mexican girls?

    • Bob

      I just pulled my buttocks apart and did a massive FART…..My god it stinks…

      • everyoneisanonymous

        Dude, get over yourself, this is the second time Ive seen you post the same thing. And BTW, if you have to spread your cheeks to fart……..go see a doctor!

    • Cords

      These types of things are what Americans should worry about. This is a REAL threat to freedom and culture. Culture and art should be freely available to all!

      Instead 99% of all (poorly educated) yanks believe in the propaganda on their ad sponsored junk TV News…

      So they worry about North Korea, Iran and all the other “ghosts under the bed” invented to distracted Americans from the reality that’s happening right under their noses.

      Good bless Americans… they are going to need it.

      El pueblo unido jamas sera vencido!

      • Anonymous

        Just so you know, no American has ever been offended by the term “yank.”

        And yes, you were trying to use it as a slur; let’s just stop that backpedaling attempt ahead of time.

  • Anonymous

    ICE and DHS has no business seizing domains. John Morton, please stop being a puppet to the private sector.

    • Johnny Boy

      Quit buying those counterfeit torrents on torrent-finder & go to the store & buy the torrents made by the companies that own the rights to make them.

      • Ice

        YES. If there were a ‘thumbs up’ button for these comments, you would deserve over 9000 of them, Johnny Boy.

      • Reks

        I agree! Those torrents were all counterfeit! They came from other sites and Torrent-Finder was profiting (ad income!) from making these counterfeited torrents available through his domain!

        • Mr Po from Chinatown

          Yo, the counterfeited torrents are made in China. They look very authentic…

  • Anonymous

    Website hosting companies based in the US really need to get active and stop this nonsense, by forcing these feckless agencies to demonstrate whether their requests have any legal validity at all.

    Very few hosts really have the inclination or capacity to examine such things and even less want to take it on.

    But their customers need them to do exactly that.

    Without it their customers are getting kicked around which costs them business and the cost of so many RIAA-lead claims coming in lead to an increase in the cost of hosting, which hurts both websites and their users.

  • Current reader of TF

    Well, I guess the ends justify the means… Once again…

    This guy has been told that torrent sites sell counterfeited goods, he was told that their actions were in line with the current laws. He never took a second to reflect on the question because, like a good soldier, he has learned to obey without asking questions.

    I’m reminded of a quote from the movie “The Matrix”:

    “The Matrix is a system, Neo. That system is our enemy. But when you’re inside, you look around, what do you see? Businessmen, teachers, lawyers, carpenters. The very minds of the people we are trying to save. But until we do, these people are still a part of that system and that makes them our enemy. You have to understand, most of these people are not ready to be unplugged. And many of them are so inured, so hopelessly dependent on the system, that they will fight to protect it. ”

    The FBI boss is part of the system and the system tells him that torrent sites are not in the best interest of the system. People like him make it possible for a system, that has seen little changes over the past fifty year, to survive. People like him try hard to stop the inevitable evolution of societies by fear that their beloved system might not be able to adapt.

    Change is good, evolution is inevitable and those who can’t cope should go extinct. That is the law of nature!

  • Aleksander

    Untruths? I think they’re called “lies”.

    • anony nonny nonny a

      I’m not going to look up meanings but I believe that a lie is where someone knowingly does not tell the truth whereas an untruth is where someone unknowingly lies.

      I think from the article above & the statement from Morton we can 99% say he was uninformed & therefore stated an untruth.

      On the other hand if it was an out & out lie then Moron (oops sorry my T sticks sometimes) Morton is leaving himself wide open for more ridicule & nonsensical exposure of the stupidity of these corporate driven actions.

  • politux

    I find it interesting that Torrent-Finder was run by an Egyptian national. Notice they didn’t seize The Pirate Bay or isoHunt. Considering the similar nature of the three sites it seems there is a double standard for Arab-run torrent sites and everyone else. I wouldn’t be surprised if racism played into their decision.

    • hotdog

      I DOUBT IT HAS ANYTHING TO DO WITH ARABs YOU’RE JUST ADDING MORE BEEF TO THE PLATTER.I’m not sure if you’ve been paying attention but the it was a “.com” which is run by icann and verisign. do your research before you comment.

      • politux

        isoHunt is a .com

        • hotdog

          you’re making assumptions 82 domains do you actually think they sat there figuring out which country is from where etc?
          The case is that homeland security and ice have no jurisdiction and and people have rights to fight back which as a Brazilian-American. You pretty damn well would see me fighting back I am a REVOLUTIONARY AND WILL NOT LIVE IN FEAR OF ANY GOVERNMENT BECAUSE I LIKE MUSIC OR MOVIES!! So goes to say onsmash was also part of the seizure hip hop run site which was promoting music of independent artist and even major artist that gave onsmash permission to show their music.Yet I don’t understand why hasn’t torrentfreak said anything about them?????Domain seizures have no color race or religion.

  • Lorelei

    He meant to say the word copyright instead of counterfeit. Hardly worth dwelling on. Now write about what’s actually going on, please.

    • Astar

      “They were all knowingly engaged in the sale of [copyright] goods.”

      If that is what was written for him to say, they really need to get better writers.

  • the one

    i would love to see a slander lawsuit come out of these comments, it would be justified and easily won

  • Stephen

    What is suggested then as a way to stop people from stealing music? I’m not trying to flame here. Just an honest question. In these discussions, one rarely hears the opinions of torrent users on this subject.

    • Someone

      Add more guards at shops, or insert some alarm system to the product they are stealing.

      • Stephen

        Good one. Ok then… stealing the music digitally. Distributing digital copies.

        • Anon

          Okay,

          1. There is no stopping music piracy or any other piracy, it will NEVER end unless the people themselves stop doing it.

          2. The issue here is not the domain name seizure, but that Torrent-Finder did absolutely NOTHING wrong. As it said in the article, “What law is it, that mandates the seizure of a website that links to other websites that may link to files that could link to copyrighted material?”

        • Anonymous

          Okay,

          1. There is no stopping music piracy or any other piracy, it will NEVER end unless the people themselves stop doing it.

          This may be true. Really, I wanted to see if torrent users had opinions or ideas about ways to stop piracy.

          2. The issue here is not the domain name seizure, but that Torrent-Finder did absolutely NOTHING wrong. As it said in the article, “What law is it, that mandates the seizure of a website that links to other websites that may link to files that could link to copyrighted material?”

          This makes sense to me.

        • Anonymous

          Wait, we have to come up with a solution for your problem now? lol.

          So how about you throw all your music on youtube and have them watched 3 times per account before payment (on demand radio). Offer a download/sync option for mp3 players (service). Now i don’t need to waste 200GB of my HD (service). No album bullshit if people want just one song (respect). And make it fordable for me to buy my 200GB of music online in a period of (2?) years. I can get to my songs (playlists!) on whatever party i am (easy!). And you know what, i will drop my grudge about the songs i already have 3 times, on casette, cd and dvd. Once you have them online you have them forever in the best possible quality, even when better can be offered at some future time (beats torrents). Sure people can rip them from that site, but than you don’t have the music forever in your cloud and all the other conveniences your friends have (friends have something cool). And your friends can get all kind of bonuses. Like live/special tracks only visible if you bought the original (awesome!). Imagine the possibilities for plugging new songs… “have you heard this yet?” Boom, to all six billion earthlings (ultimate plugging). You can even keep playing record company because the money to plug them has to come from somewhere (yay!). Now you take this idea that cost me 5 minutes that you get for free (just SHARING this with you). And you get a couple of your overpaid babyboomers to do the final details. Bonus points for you if you make them think they came up with the whole thing…

          x internet

        • Anonymous

          And what does stealing have to do with filesharing, Stephen?

  • tiger97a

    the music and movie company’s should set a internet store for you to dl from and charge a flat fee of a amount from say 100 to 200 dollars and let you dl all you want for that fee at good speeds and great quailty and they would make money as they could save a bundle of lawyer fees.

    • Anonymous

      Yeah like so that producing less over all music will give more money per song per artists? And they get their money even when it sucks… nah.

  • Anon

    “What law is it, that mandates the seizure of a website that links to other websites that may link to files that could link to copyrighted material?”

    Great Line, lets see them argue with that.

  • hotdog

    Sue Morton and ice aswell “it’s that simple”.it’s A POWER TRIP IN GOVERNMENT AN EMBARRASSMENT TO AMERICANS THAT WANT NOTHING TO DO WITH GOVERNMENT AFFAIRS!!Bad enough we have people in government that don’t even know the American constitution!!

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  • Anonymous

    i once read an amazing dilbert comic that has stuck with me for years,

    Dilbert was talking to the garbage man it goes
    “Morality is based on accepted norms. And accepted norms are based on morality.”
    “It’s self causing?”
    “Ironically, yes.”

    well societies norms are changing and it isn’t unmoral to download music anymore.

    • Stephen

      “well societies norms are changing and it isn’t unmoral to download music anymore.”

      Society’s norms may be changing, and possibly for the better in many cases, but it’s certainly “unmoral” to download somebody’s music if they don’t want you to. Many artists give away their music, which is great, but downloading something the artist didn’t intend you to have isn’t “moral” is it?

      • Anonymous

        You didn’t read his comment, did you?

        • Anonymous

          I did, but perhaps failed to see how it applies.

        • Anonymous

          It says that since morality is based on norms & the norm is now to download music, it makes it morally ok to download music.

          It may be ETHICALLY wrong, which is what you seem to be saying…

        • Stephen

          Ah. I get it, and yes ethically is probably the more appropriate term.

      • Jw

        Does the artist want you to not download his music or is it the man in a business suite thought “bought” the rights to the artist work that does not want you to download it. Music artists make more money of concerts then they do off music Cd’s. What i want to know is why is immigration control doing shutting down websites? Shouldn’t the FBI or Department of Commerce be doing that. oh, don’t worry about domains going away, Canada and the Caribbean would love to host your stuff for US dollars and the ACLU will have a field day if the net censorship law gets passed to blacklist websites.

        • Stephen

          “Does the artist want you to not download his music or is it the man in a business suite thought “bought” the rights to the artist work that does not want you to download it. Music artists make more money of concerts then they do off music Cd’s.”

          Often the “suit” for sure, but just as often, the artist. Either way, the artist is affected, as we all know. For smaller artists, the effects of piracy are certainly more damaging. Also, concerts are just one means of support, and not necessarily a better one than music sales. Especially for independent artists.

          Your other points make good sense.

        • Freedom.Fighter

          Actually, Stephen, with how the royalties system is set up, albums are a promotional tool, not a main source of income. I work in the industry and I do this math on a daily basis. Last year we had an artist make more money off of ring tones than album/singles sales. The current licensing system is broken in that respect. The reason concerts are a much better deal for the artist is that excepting certain cases, the business-suit makes no money off of live performance. He has purchased only the right to reproduce and distribute the recorded masters. This means that the artists receives a much larger share of the cash flow in the live arena, because they are not working to fight off the advances from the label or recoup costs on production. Your points are well thought, but lack information. Keep looking man, and you’ll see some interesting things.

        • Anonymous

          [quote] Often the “suit” for sure, but just as often, the artist. Either way, the artist is affected, as we all know. For smaller artists, the effects of piracy are certainly more damaging. Also, concerts are just one means of support, and not necessarily a better one than music sales. Especially for independent artists.[/quote]

          No we do not know, and do not agree. Smaller artists benefit from us, they get a way greater exposure. Like bigger musicians from CD’s which they make no money from. Smaller artists love torrents/youtube and selling/donations live from their own website.

          This is the wrong place to post your bs stories.
          (this was a test but if it fails, can you still quote?)

        • Smaller artist

          As a smaller artist I concur. Piracy is a great thing for us indies. It helps to get our music out around the world. I’ve had airplay on Moscow radio, had gigs around Europe and the far east thanks to contacts made through my music being ‘discovered’ via piracy.

          The days of the majors are over.

        • Bryan

          Stephen, you don’t get how this works apparently.
          Musicians, big or small, will almost always make more money off of shows and merch. They make very little off of album sales comparatively. If anything, piracy helps smaller artists by spreading their music to a larger audience. An audience that may not have otherwise even had access to this music.
          And obviously, with the ability to access the music, comes the ability to actually support the artist. I have pirated the music of small artits, became a fan of that artist, and supported them by purchasing their merch and going to shows. I don’t usually purchase albums unless this artist is independent and I know that my money will not be going to support an obsolete medium of distribution rather than the artist that I want to hear. I would have never been able to support these bands if I had not pirated their music.
          Another point I want to make, is that piracy promotes the production of music that isn’t shit. If I pirate a bands music, and it is fucking garbage, I will not support them. If I like the music, I can choose to support them.
          If I just blindly purchase an album because the radio told me to, and later find out that it sucks, guess what? The shitty artist and their even shittier recording company just got my money. That’s not fair.

        • Stephen

          I’m actually a smallish artist, and have been for more than 20 years. I’ve done more than 15 records on small indie labels, larger indie labels and one on a major.

          I did a sort of solo record (me with guests) last year, which was leaked by an unscrupulous press person when it was sent out for review 2 weeks before the release date. No one had the record before I sent it to the person handling the press for it. It took less than 24 hours for it to show up on a ton of torrent sites. I was absolutely livid. The way I saw it, the record hadn’t even been made available for people to do the right thing, and buy a copy if they wanted it, but they could already do the wrong thing, and just get it for free. I can’t tell you how angry I was. I spent well over a year making it, and had many friends, some from much larger bands, who had contributed performances (my vocals suck). Now it was free.

          I would consider my situation to be better than most. I’m older, and no longer a full time touring musician, and I now produce, mix, and master records for other bands and labels. Music is much more of a hobby now, yet still my true passion. Making this record was much cheaper for me than it would be for many artists, since I had the resources of a studio. That said, I did have to account for my time, in that $ that weren’t being earned by doing my regular work were going into the record. Also, I wanted to be able to pay at least something to the other artists who contributed.

          Now, I know that since there’s no way of determining how many copies were shared, there’s no way to put a $ value on how much was lost in the leak of my record. One thing’s for sure, there’s no benefit to the leak, though the damage may not be that bad. I knew the record wouldn’t recoup either way, but I had hoped to get every bit that I could for it to offset the expense of making it, and to give something to the contributors.

          I started this discussion, because I want to understand the modern world, and adapt to it in the best way I can. I rarely play shows. My main focus is selling records. Many people who have commented here figure the artists can make their $ doing shows and selling merchandise. I just want to point out that many great artists rarely tour, if ever, and rely on record sales to stay afloat. Does that mean they should just hang it up? Tell that to Tom Waits, or other important artists who aren’t in a position to tour all year to make ends meet.

          I’m not trying to sway opinions. I agree with many thoughts posted here. I agree that the major label model is a dead one, and I thought so long before there was rampant sharing of anything over the internet. I come from a DIY background. The bands from my time and “scene” started their own labels and networked with each other to get show, and advance themselves. We weren’t.. and still aren’t… in it for the $, but still want to survive. This important revenue stream is dying, and I want to figure out how to make ends meet.

          I welcome opinions on the best ways to do that, and I really just want to understand the thought process here. I’m not trying to start a shit storm. The world is changing, and I know I must change with it. I do see some opinions that reek of “fuck everyone, entertainment should be free”, and that doesn’t bode well for any artist, large or small (though I know the small artists will be hit hardest by these attitudes).

          Thanks for the input. I welcome more.

  • Stephen

    I did, but perhaps failed to see how it applies.

  • Anonymous

    “The ICE director made quite a misstep with the statement we quoted above, and the worrying part is that it might even be unintentional. It wouldn’t surprise us if Morton has no idea what a torrent site actually is. The frequent mix-up between counterfeiting and digital piracy, however, is a worrying trend for sure.”

    Most certainly intentional conflation. It’s a staple behaviour for slithery, slimy sophists. All tools of deceit, that included, are used regularly in the field of public relations–which, given that US government is essentially an arm of the business lobby, is to be expected.

    • Anonymous

      I agree entirely, what a ridiculous form of government. It’ll come back to them at some point.

      • Jay

        The question is more or less, how?

        The problem with government is that once you have things on the books, it’s incredibly hard to get them off.

        Think about how long copyright has been extended and how long it’s been since anyone sat down with it and said “wait, does this make sense to our business model?”

        There are probably more ways to make money than CDs and yet, we are STILL fighting copyright issues 10 years after the DMCA.

  • Anonymous

    @27 @23 @16 @14
    The words you use.
    (stealing , immoral)

    1. copying is not stealing. FACT
    2. Sharing can actually boost sales. FACT
    3. One download does NOT equal One lost sale. FACT

    Millions if not billions of people share.

    But you say that they steal and have no morals.

    I say… The small group of rich media companies , have NO morals ,
    for stealing artist’s work and PROFITING
    eg. http://torrentfreak.com/record-labels-to-pay-45-million-for-pirating-artists-music-110110/
    and for punishing customers who just want to share.

  • Anonymous

    Do you really expect the US gov to respect the law and the constitution?

    One example with wikileaks:

    They had congress pass a law declaring Ddosing illegal and what did they do? They have the pentagon Ddosing Wikileaks! Try to explain to the US citizen that the have to follow the law now!

    I am not even talking about the rest the abusive search and seizure the spying on the US citizen, the indefinite detentions without trial, the kidnappings, the assassinations and the tortures.

    For a start the US gov should be kicked out of the net.

    Cyber soldiers: prepare your Ddosing and hacking tools. Your country need you!

  • Fantastic

    Whole thing was a crock and a preempt test for that Copyright Infringement Act. November was a setback with the changeover but soon enough they’ll have enough bought off to try and push again. They already got one attempting to brand it as a “conservative” issue so she can stealth it. Utter BS.

  • Anonymous

    @#19 tiger97a

    “the music and movie company’s should set a internet store for you to dl from and charge a flat fee of a amount from say 100 to 200 dollars and let you dl all you want for that fee at good speeds and great quailty and they would make money as they could save a bundle of lawyer fees.”

    No we will not let them we want them dead.

    We shall Ddos to death such a site. We can not afford parasites in our society.

    • Sean

      I don’t see what’s wrong with that? $$ for all the music you want, in high quality 320k mp3 or FLAC, and at a good download speed?

      Hell, even if it was $100 per year or something, I download roughly 70 albums per year, thats a little over $1 per album.

      Even if you only download 20 albums, thats still only $5 per album. A bit pricy, but not that bad.

      Compare that to $20-30 per album in stores…

      It would certainly be a very positive step foward.

  • Ignorant govt

    Its funny how from 1995 till about 2005 the govt didnt screw with the internet that much .. now all of a sudden we find ourselves in a recession and you have these people with govt jobs trying to be johnny do gooders so they can keep their jobs and appear to be doing us all a favor

    • Anonymous

      Yeah, didn’t you hear. Downloading is against god’s will…

  • Steell

    Say I’m sitting outside on the door step, and a fellow comes walking by with a basket of apples and asks if I’d like one. I say “Sure” and he says “Take your pick”, so I pick one out and happily munch on it as he walks away.
    Now let’s just assume that these apples were stolen, does that make me a thief? Not by any reasonable standards I’m aware of, nor am I aware of it being a violation of the US Criminal Code.
    What’s the difference between the above scenario and downloading files from the internet? Is it my responsibility to attempt to track down the legal owner of the property/file and ask? Copyright has become so overbearing I don’t even think about it any more. Everything is copyrighted and copyright last pretty much forever, and I’m not sure if reading what’s on my screen is not a copyright violation. I don’t buy music or movies, nor do I download them, I might listen to the radio once in awhile, or if at a friends house I might watch a little tv with them. But I’m not spending a dime on either one as long as they continue to abuse this copyright privilige we have granted them.

    • Jay

      Heh, funny how entertainment is supposed to be so expensive, is it not?

    • anonymous

      [quote]Say I’m sitting outside on the door step, and a fellow comes walking by with a basket of apples and asks if I’d like one. I say “Sure” and he says “Take your pick”, so I pick one out and happily munch on it as he walks away.
      Now let’s just assume that these apples were stolen, does that make me a thief? Not by any reasonable standards I’m aware of, nor am I aware of it being a violation of the US Criminal Code.[/quote]

      Actually, it would be receiving stolen property, but lets not mince words here.

  • Whosyou

    This US GoVeRnEmeNt crap is pissing me off. I used Torrent-finder for yrs and it was a great way to search and access torrent site. I’m back with TZ now. Screw the USA Nazi domination of the web : go kill yourself.

  • 5318008

    I am now hungry for a platter of beef.

  • JangoFett

    Ok, so of the comments I’m taking seriously (i.e. the correctly spelt, grammatical and reasoned ones) I’m getting the vibe that downloading via torrents is justified because it is the copyright owners that have failed to adapt to change and opportunity, not because of any hard-and-fast illegality by the people actually doing the downloading.

    And I agree.

    I’m originally from the UK, currently living in Spain. When I was in the UK I would download my favourite TV and films in advance of them appearing on DVD so I could watch them whenever I wanted. But I always then bought the DVDs (particularly for the extras and the shiny boxes!).

    Now I’m in Spain my viewing of UK TV is severely restricted (i.e. through BBC iPlayer) thanks to the whole business of ‘syndication’ and ‘worldwide rights’ – concepts which only exist for monetary reasons (remember, I’m talking here about the BBC, a publicly-funded corporation actually providing a different service to it’s competitors and who should not be concerned with such things as they have a guaranteed pot of money given to them each year…yet this pot of money is in itself not the full value of the licence fee thanks to the UK governments own obsession with ‘profit’).

    This restriction on availability is for one reason only. To ensure that I pay a disproportionate sum of money for the DVD of what is basically a free show, only available some months later, with the added bonus of obscene shipping costs thrown in.

    It seems the age-old mantra of ‘supply and demand’ still governs the capitalist world. Even the water and power companies hike their prices because they know they have a captive market.

    There is only one problem with this. The capitalist world is failing. At least where internet technology is concerned. Now, if these corporations AREN’T sensible about what they do and what they demand for their products, we all find another way round it. More and more people each year go past their personal breaking point and circumvent the corporations demands and expectations, yet the only ones who don’t acknowledge this fact are the corporations themselves. Blinded by their own greed they are (no apologies for the Yoda-ism there).

    I’m just glad that their ancient and archaic practices, and draconian efforts to stamp out file-sharing, are (for the time being at least) severely inconvenienced by the ancient and archaic laws of the land. And I put my faith in technology, and the amazing innovators who understand it, that when the time comes and the laws are changed, we find a way to circumnavigate the corporations again.

    • Johnny

      Nice comment, except one thing. The corporate bullies do not have the best interests of the consumer at heart they are firmly against a real free market (which I assume you mean with “capitalist”). The big incumbents do everything possible to *limit* the free market so as to prevent new players from competing with them. Their interests are diametrically opposed to that of consumers.

      In fact the RIAA and MPAA and their equivalent in other countries are cartels. Cartels are illegal in other branches of the economy, but apparently not in the music and movie industry. The cartels control outlets, such as cinemas, record stores, radio airplay time and not in the least the keep prices high. They can push their crap to the public while keeping the competition out. They act like they own music, in several countries taxes are levied on their behalf even on people who do not use their services.

      They lobby (= bribe) politicians to make laws in their favor (such as extending copyrights). Vast amounts of *our* tax money is being spent on trying to maintain *their* profits.

      I can only hope a true free market will come to the entertainment industry. The old dinosaurs will surely die without the distorting advantages they profit from now.

      That leads me add to your reasons for pirating:

      1. They have corrupted our politicians and stolen from us (the public) by extending copyrights on culture that should by now have belonged to us!

      2. They are diverting *our* taxes to their benefit.

      In other words the RIAA and MPAA scum have been stealing and are still stealing from us every day. They owe us big time!

      As a result I feel entitled to copy anything that I like without paying extra as I already paid these corporate bullies against my will. As has everyone else.

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  • starfleet7@aol.com

    the nation is crumbling…

    bureaucrats of all types are out of control..

    i see a nexus within the next 3 years…

    it will be nasty..

  • soapy

    46 use the following for your searches.
    http://www.bitsnoop.com
    http://www.torrentoff.com
    You will find these to be far superior to torrentfinder because they scrape trackers and not just 1 site at a time.

    • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_GNQ6QXLMMAXA4GYAQNAH7TWHZA Alex

      +1

    • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_GNQ6QXLMMAXA4GYAQNAH7TWHZA Alex

      +1

  • random pirate

    I’d like to see google put that “SEIZED!!” picture on their website for april’s fool

  • starfleet7

    My reading of history convinces me that most bad government results from too much government.
    Thomas Jefferson

    I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them.
    Thomas Jefferson

    Thomas Jefferson said in 1802:
    I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around the banks will deprive
    the people of all property – until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered.

  • frostygotchilled

    A documentary to watch is Zeitgeist: Addendum on Google. Another one is “The Corporation”. It makes perfect sense now.

  • Anonymous

    Hey guys, if you haven’t found the IP of torrent-finder, here it is: 208.101.51.57

    Here is a site that you might find helpful: http://www.hm2k.com/posts/find-the-ip-address-of-a-seized-website

    Or check out the deICEr project: https://code.google.com/p/deicer/

  • April

    @45 no they did screw with the internet alot, in the beginning there were tons of loli sites, most of them got raided before 2005 invalidating your claim, learn your history. There were thousands, now very few…

  • Sandy

    @58 Yes the majority is supposed to rule, however when the net was new, the majority wanted loli and the traffic on the net (majority of it) went to loli. Why is it that when the majority rules as in the case it was, they wanted to suppress it? The us government stated that if they wanted to make the internet into a business model, they had to clean it so after that statement, then came the ls raids and many others and most of the loli sites went. True censorship it was. I didn’t see any of the people standing up then at the nazi governments shutting down the sites. Same with ed2k/kad sites, many went down, not many standsups besides shareconnector and a few others but by that time people moved on to bt. Bittorrent sites went like knock one down, another comes up and tpb actually stood up and kept re-opening after shutdowns just like the loli sites should have done. It took torrent sites to take up for everybody, when if people had done it before with loli, the net would be a lot better off.

    Bring back loli sites as they should be on net.

  • Tax Payer

    On a cost to benefit basis, the US government should be directly targeting major tax cheats and bribe takers.

    However, since the government is filled with major tax cheats they will target kids instead. Geithner admitted he cheated on his taxes. McCain admitted he cheated on his taxes and took bribes to interfere in the GAO investigation of corrupt S&Ls during the Bush Sr administration. Those two career criminals have cost US tax payers trillions.

    Instead, the feds will ruin the life of some comp sci and engineering students turning them from life long tax payers into $20K to $40K per year burdens as prisoners.

    Oh, and when they get out, who will they work for? It won’t be the US government.

  • powerless consumer, citizen civilian cattle

    @66 From my understanding, you are a sicko.
    I really hope I misunderstood that comment…

  • Jorge

    @ Stephan

    “Society’s norms may be changing, and possibly for the better in many cases, but it’s certainly “unmoral” to download somebody’s music if they don’t want you to. Many artists give away their music, which is great, but downloading something the artist didn’t intend you to have isn’t “moral” is it?”

    Good read for you regarding the social acceptance of downloading music…

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/8267238/Why-is-online-piracy-considered-socially-acceptable.html

    There’s some good follow-up comments as well at the end of the article.

    • Stephen

      I’ll check this out. Thanks.

  • RedBK

    Ok, I don’t remember who said it in a earlier post and I’m too lazy to scroll up on my iPod but seriously the corporations have our best interest at heart? LMFAO, So you saying Sony has OUR as consumers best interest. Wow, remove the veil from your eyes please. There is a major conflict now with Sony and GeoHot (George Hotz) about the jailbreak of the Sony PS3. Sony has the reasoning of “oh Mr. Hotz is a pirate so we should sue him” when in reality you CANNOT run pirated games without his coded signature on a package that MAY allow you to play a “pirated” game.

  • Stephen

    Well it’ time for me to bugger off…

  • ponderance

    “The capitalist world is failing.”
    “There is only one problem with this.”
    “What will replace it?”

  • skybon

    Fuck ICANN! Use alternative DNS roots!

  • Alex

    TF, Please add an option to Agree/Disagree with the post.

    Or at least mark as spam.

    • hymen

      +1

  • Lacrossse Lacock

    I for one don’t mind a little bit (no pun intended) of reigning in of some of these torrent sites. Sometimes for a given set of search terms there is and endless array of sites that crowd out other unrelated sites. Take for instance the Lacock Lacrosse Club ( http://lacrosselacock.bravehost.com/ ). Because there is a porn called Lacrosse Lacock on many torrent sites articles about the actual lacrosse tournament are lost on the web.

    Of course the is not the intent of the crack down but rather an unintended benefit that some will welcome.

  • Ninja

    There’s a lot of misinformation running around. And that’s how governments and corporate players are getting what they want nowadays. If you ‘infect’ ppl with lies, they’ll accept absurds more easily. These tactics have had some degree of success with the WikiLeaks case along with the financial stuff. But the success was limited. P2P has been around for ages now even before Napster made it popular. And Govenrments/corporations can’t evolve nearly as fast as the ordinary ppl.

    This will backfire hugely as the internet goes further away from any control. Dot p2p for you (and other techs) ;)

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  • yeah

    i hope they win in court.they break so many laws when they are trying to punish those who break laws. its a pitty

    http://www.fistingyouent.com

  • Anonymous

    Anyone else ready for the american government to implode on their own stupidty?

    • Gindil1

      They obviously need a push

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