Sarkozy Says He Will “Go All The Way” With 3 Strikes
Written by enigmax on June 23, 2009Yesterday from the Palace of Versailles, Nicolas Sarkozy became the first president to address Parliament in 150 years. He took the opportunity to show his determination over the proposed HADOPI legislation, promising that he will “go all the way” to enforce law on the Internet.
Sarkozy’s address yesterday was made possible by the annulment of a law prohibiting a sitting president from addressing lawmakers. The last time an address of this type occurred was 1848, in Napoleon’s day.
After condemning the wearing of burqas by Muslim women in France and labeling it a “sign of subservience,” he moved on to HADOPI – France’s controversial anti-piracy law which aimed to implement “3 Strikes” for alleged pirates.
Earlier this month the Constitutional Council, France’s highest legal authority, deemed Internet disconnections unconstitutional, and stopped the law.
Speaking to both the Senate and the National Assembly in a joint session at Versailles Palace just outside of Paris, Sarkozy was clearly undeterred. During a 45 minute speech, he turned to the issue of Internet piracy, stating;
“How can there be areas of lawlessness in areas of our society? How can one simultaneously claim that the economy is regulated but the Internet is not so? How can we accept that the rules that apply to society as a whole are not binding on the Internet?”
Sarkozy Will “Go All The Way” With 3 Strikes
Sarkozy went on to say that by championing HADOPI, he’s not just protecting artists.
“By defending copyright I do not just defend artistic creation, I also defend my idea of a free society where everyone’s freedom is based on respect for the rights of others. I am also defending the future of our culture. It is the future of creation.”
In pressing for HADOPI, Sarkozy said he will “go all the way.”
Previously: Anti-Piracy Lawyers Lose License To Chase Pirates
Next: No “3 Strikes” in Spain, Watch Out Torrent Sites
165 Responses
And to anyone french this is why that law was originally passed so that one person does not make the law or control its making.
Also why the hell does Sarkozy so adamant about ruling the internet and making the three strike rule in law?
How much is he been payed to do it? And by who?
If they can repel a 150 year old law they can easily make one that if more than 60% of the public want a reelection it is done so not when there president has had enough screwing the public over.
-Jay
Anyone up for killing Sarkozy?
Can he not smell “la merde” he shovelling?
Again, how is Guilty until proven Innocent acceptable in any free society.
I guess I shouldn’t get into the massive conflicts of interests that are represented by this mafia front of a president when it comes to copyright and media.
Mais oui monsieur le president … you can go “all the way” to hell.
those high people that love a free to share internet are to afraid of the people that are against piracy
but they shudent be afraid lets hear your voice its a free world you know
cool story bro :)
I think he just ate and threw up words that were spoonfeed to him by RIAA and Co.
Internet is a freedom that we should cherish and fight for. Knowledge is power. If one entity were to control the information on the net, then people will be ever more threatened to take action in the their own hands.
After all, I dont think these bastards have read any george orwell’s novels, espicially 1984 and animal farm.
Absolute power corrupts absolutely.
Sarkozy aint gonna do shit!!Piracy till the day we die!!!
Dictator much?
Honestly, this guy is ridiculous.
Has his head deep up a dark place when he states the following:
“How can there be areas of lawlessness in areas of our society? How can one simultaneously claim that the economy is regulated but the Internet is not so? How can we accept that the rules that apply to society as a whole are not binding on the Internet?”
and later, conflictingly:
“By defending copyright I do not just defend artistic creation, I also defend my idea of a free society where everyone’s freedom is based on respect for the rights of others. I am also defending the future of our culture. It is the future of creation.”
My bullshit detector is running overtime.
@ 11
Mine broke. :)
Fuck you, damned dwarf. Go play with your wife and leave us alone.
Sarkozy wants to put a burka on the Internet.
“”Sarkozy wants to put a burka on the Internet.”"
hahaha, good one ! especially regarding ongoing debates here in France.
Fortunately he also attack muslim culture, so there’s got to be some pissed off terrorist, who will take him down.
OMG fukin retard, its just gonna fail again
Well, well Mr. “I’m doin this for my wife” is talking again. I’m more than certain, that he wants to score points for BJ @ homebase.
The opportunity to address the parliament in this manner speaks again for the Supersarko, who is using this “historic” opportunity to 2 truly important issues:
- making sure, that women do not express their religion freely ( ok, i’m not sure on that one though, cause it’s often the family’s choice for the daughter to put on the veil.)
- making sure, that some atavistic business model, which (in its death-wrangling) is damaging individuals financially and morally, polarizing the issue even further.
It’s good to see, which politicians are noting the paradigm change in society and who’s are not. This is guess is indeed something to bring up approval stats.
- making sure that some atavistic business model ……..survives. Which it will not.
“from the Palace of Versailles”
What better place to make a statement that is so detached from reality.
The architecture in the Palace of Versaille may be unparalleled, but it was created because of the amount of power and wealth that came into the hands of the few.
Its sort of image the abbreviations and middlemen would want to choose for themselves.
@ 17 by MaloenBCN
LoL, you read my mind mate.
I wonder if he’s got a little stand for when it’s BJ time too….
WOMEN WHO NEVER OWNED A COMPUTER IS SUED BY RIAA AND “SETTLES”
http://www.slyck.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=47694
I hope ppl get him off the stand on the next election
i am not French but this could lead to changes elsewhere as well. he sounds like a megalomaniacal dictator to me! trying to set himself up as above everyone and everything and, in particular, the law. how and why should he be able to overturn what has been refused by the highest court in that country and also by the EU? i sense a revolt on the cards!
@7
im the real 1!!!
identity theft
but
cool story bro :)
@ 19 by A B
Nice image man. Makes me feel good, that these guys are on their way out.
@ 20 by Robbing Hood
He will be screaming: “I will go all the waaaaay, dont stop u biatch!” [dickslap]
Freedom? I just don’t see it…
He can’t be worried about protecting his wife’s music – who wants that?
@ 22 by anon2
I wonder really…what is the Supersarko up to again?
Will he just modify the the rules the HADOPI is run, like there will be no disconnection(fundamental rights bla, main reason behind the supreme block) but there might be other things to come:
1. slowing down/throttling connection.
2. giving your IP to the maffia
3. raping yo mum.
What interest me is, does HADOPI have access to similar stuff like below?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/8112550.stm
ahaha yet another 1 man idiot trying to control the entire internet..
GOT NEWS FOR YA BUDDY! Your not the first and you certainly wont be the last!
Prepare for your fail cake.
Time to take the guillotines out of Versailles Palace’s attic…
This guy’s a modern day dictator. The only d1ck that’s getting blown is RIAA’s and Sarko’s the one swallowing corporate spunk.
Simply put…he has bowed to political and corporate pressures to play nice or get bitch slapped
toss him into the dumpster hes worthless. mess with the best die like the rest ;)
I actually think they are holding internet sharers to a higher standard. If I were to share something I bought in the real world, nobody would care. Yes, I’m sure most companies would like to stop that as well, but unlike on the internet, our every move isn’t being tracked. It’s still cost effective to stop us right now. It’s simply not in the non-digital world so they learned to live with it. Just because they can see what we’re doing on the net, doesn’t mean they should be able to control it.
Let’s go back to the days when art wasn’t sheerly created for profit, instead for others enjoyment. Let’s go back to the days when artist weren’t exploited to gain a buck. Let’s be a society that is free and free to share!
little man syndrome
The f*cking midget.A man who wear high heels….he`s an idiot!
[...]my idea of a free society where everyone’s freedom is based on respect for the rights of others. [...]
Well, then he must read more articles on TorrentFreak.
The MAFIAA that he suppport have never respected the rights of others, and on the way they do it, they will never do.
Sarkozy = Vichy! He’s a dirty coward and collaborator who must suffer the fate of ALL such criminals.
Addition to my last post:
[...]
Sarkozy went on to say that by championing HADOPI, he’s not just protecting artists.
[...]
Conversely, He only harm the artists, the money-eating bosses of the artists are defended by him.
It’s WTF LOL OMFG
This is Embassy of Piracy
- we are building a new kind of network
Cutmi, pastmi, kopimi
Internets is in different forms
assimilate, copy and swarm!
that’s one man’s opinion.
there are millions of US, we can’t lose!
keep pirating!
I think I’ll agree with Sarkozy on this one, public torrents and open infringement of (c) should be stopped.
is this really the most important issue he could find to address them with? I mean, REALLY ?
Wauw, I want some of what Narkozy has been smoking, he must be really wasted to spout bullshit like that :)
Poor midget doesn’t know what he’s talking about. It’s a completly different world in here, there’s no way to impose anything, some of the smartest people in the planet run the p2p show. He’ll fail all the way
#41: hello kitty, you’re life is now officially in danger. Keep low profile if you’re against the movement.
There is a very simple way for France to put a stop to french citizens using the internet to do things which are morally wrong.
The same technique would work in any country that the media industries can convince to implement it.
It’s such a simple method of reducing online sharing of copyrighted music, videos and games that I’m suprised that the majority of countries hasnt already done it.
The method is simple.
Make it against the law to connect a personal computer to the outside world.
Thats right just a simple outright ban on the internet or any other network that tries to pop up and take its place.
Can’t for the life of me work out why governments worldwide havent adopted this policy, it’s not as if the benefits of being connected are worth the loss of the large media distribution companys.
I love Sarkozy. I really do, he is the greatest ruler to ever help pirace fight. How long will people stand up for such bullshit when it starts hitting then? Today we have the most popular internet sites locked down by silly copyright laws, such as music being removed from YouTube videos for copyright infrigement (Even Guitar Hero videos are suffering from this, could it be MORE retarded!?)
The more they strike, the stronger will become. The day will soon rise when no president with a pro-current-copyright. Of course, it won’t be tomorrow, and we will still take increasing amounts of bullshit for the next two, three years. Expect major basic liberty breaches to come. But that will be RIAA/MIAA downfall, as their insuferable greed turn their customers and supporters against then.
What a fine way to seize the occasion! let’s see, what did napoleon addressed in 1848? I can top that!
#2 I’m on the way
To paraphrase Monty Python: “Oh Vichy Vichy Vichy Vich… I wonder where that Vichy is!”
I`m impressed by a few things; first, that a retarted monkey can make it all the way to president! Second, that the French have elected this asswipe. Third, and last, how the hell can a president be allowed to press stupid things trough for his own gains?
—quote—
Sarkozy wants to put a burka on the Internet.
–endquote—
Totally agree! He makes me think of that moron named Geert Wilders, altough Sarkozy is more stupid.
next he will crown himself king of french.
sarkozy est un putain de MEEERDE!!!
(see, i have french in school) lol
that motherfucker should calm the fuck down, such a ultra conservative bastard who is surpressing freedom rights in the same country in which the the ideas about such rights originated from!
Sarkozy got payed by the movie studio’s… and quite a lot… so he now has to do this otherwise he is in trouble…
i hope so much that the proof for it will be leaked soon…
/me takes out his block of “Countries never to go to” and writes “FRANCE”.
I don’t know why, but I don’t like places where freedom is not a fundamental right….
Why did he got crowned -um- elected king of France? Because his friends are the ones who own all the media -newspaper, tv- but he needs one more…internet.
Va chier sarko ! J’ai pas voté pour toi, je voterais pas pour toi ! Tu me pourris la vie avec tes lois a deux balles ! Depenalise le cannabis, arrete de croire que la propriete intelectuelle peut se chiffrer et laisses nous en paix !
Aujourd’hui il y a tellement de merde que ce soit en audio ou video qu’on est obligé de parser tout le net pour trouver des bons trucs si on a pas eu des parents avec une culture un peu ouverte. Alors plutot que de brider la prochaine generation uqi viendra pisser sur ta tombe, fait avancer les choses ailleurs, ou c’est plus important !
FUCK FUCK FUCK !
NO FUTUR !!!
MEME PAS MORT !!!
YOU ARE LOST !
fuck you Sikolas Narcozy
I thought the headline said that Sarkozy will ‘go away’ with 3 Strikes.
He’s struck out twice already with this crazy scheme… Looking forward to his successor…
the droll spoke again. remember what happened to the last french king? i predict he will be soon be a little bit shorter.
Wow…how stupid comments, this piracy ideology is really getting down
on the one hand, we’ve got Sarkozy who is controlled by the media.
and on the other hand, we’ve got berlusconi, who is in control of the media.
That’s a pretty good news, considering Sarko’s records on keeping his words…
Since 95% of his promises were pure demagogy and failed, I tell you this is definitely good news !
@ 62. [though normally not responding to trolls]
Its not an ideology, it’s a paradigm change in music distribution and IP law.
We are not 17 year old people with the PB T-shirt (though no problem with PB T-shirts) and painting us like these will not make the dying of this business model any slower…:)
try stop kimsufi/ovh 1st , then the individual users ;)
“How can we accept that the rules that apply to society as a whole are not binding on the Internet?”
Society is flawed, don’t bring (more of) that flawness onto the internet
Sarkozy says, “How can there be areas of lawlessness in areas of our society? How can one simultaneously claim that the economy is regulated but the Internet is not so? How can we accept that the rules that apply to society as a whole are not binding on the Internet?”
What he can’t (or won’t) understand is that this is an argument AGAINST Hadopi! The Hadopi law would abolish the rule of law on the Internet, by allowing copyright-holders to exercise private vigilante justice of a kind that is not accepted in any other arena.
“That’s a pretty good news, considering Sarko’s records on keeping his words…”
He just repelled a 150 year old law, addressed parliament for the first time and pretty much the first thing he said was he was going to pass this law.
You don’t go through all that trouble and set up a huge event in French political history and talk about nothing much in particular. For some reason he wants this legislation to go through very badly and I have a feeling that it is not because of his profound sense of justice.
good luck the courts are in place to prevent that… they said NO… thx god Frances is a democracy not a dictatorship. Keeps one yahoo with a agenda from running amok
haha sucks to be french
I’m sure all the executives from the RIAA/MPAA have wined and dined him relentlessly. Any why not? The RIAA/MPAA already know how to manipulate judges, politicians, lawmakers and government officials. This guy shouldn’t be treated any differently.
That would be worth checking out.
French people u voted for him so u deal with it
good lesson for the future
lol
Just because he made a decision that wasn’t in the favor of piracy doesn’t mean he’s being paid off. Pretty juvenile.
As far as I know France isn’t really Europe’s most involved pirating country. Still, this will increase international pressure on places like Sweden and Norway to start playing by the rules.
/quote Just because he made a decision that wasn’t in the favor of piracy doesn’t mean he’s being paid off. /quote
Doesnt it? you mean he’s stupid enough to make a decision against media companys and not take the offered bribes?
oops i meant for the media companys not against :(
erm…. hasn’t 3 strikes already been thrown out by EU parliament a while ago??
@77 the EU can only make suggestions and guidelines, but not enforce them.. when it comes to stuff like this.
Has anyone noticed that HADOPI reads iPod AH backwards? Maybe AH means Adolf Hitler and they found these plans on his (Naz)iPod?
Godwin’s Law has been invoked.
now we can all log off, safe in the knowledge that no productive conversation will take place in here again.
neostyles! Why so short? I’d have thought you’d have more to offer in support of the copyright baron. Ah, well, I can plane you all the same…
People are naturally greedy, but they won’t go against human rights unless there is something in it for them. Sarzoky being paid off for this is a strong theory atm because it provides a motive for his actions- a motive that is certainly understandable when it comes to government officials.
What rules? The United States’ rules? Geez. Who do you think you are to insist that the US’s way of doing things should be the world’s way of doing things? These countries can clearly understand concepts you can’t, like “People have the right to education and information” and “People have the natural, inalieable right to share.” Anyway, your attitude is hugely arrogant and I can’t imagine that many foreign people appreciate being told how to run their countries.
I’ve hated Sarkozy ever since he was elected and He keeps giving me more reasons. Hope when reelection comes up he is voted out for someone more left leaning.
Sarkozy is the most powerful man in Europe. I’d like to use his image in one of my blog posts, somebody help me out.
~Rob
http://www.mytextsecret.com
He defends his idea of freedom by telling people what they can and cannot do. I guess all the violent crimes, rioting and illegal aliens aren’t that important.
He makes a judgement call by claiming burka is debasement of women. But then he goes on to state this:
“..By defending copyright I do not just defend artistic creation, I also defend my idea of a free society where everyone’s freedom is based on respect for the rights of others”
Rights? What rights? He just took away the rights of the people to wear whatever the frig they want. People can roam around naked in a society, but not fully clothed? Contradiction anyone?
He’s just a plan dumb A**
hehehehe, you french torrent users are f*cked, hehehe, F*CKED!!!!
have to agree with paran0id, and the world thought it couldnt get any more idiotic with bush but then sarkozy comes and shows theres a whole new stupid in town
Laws follow technology, politics follows code. The technology to make and distribute digital copies of content cannot be put back into the bottle by legislation.
1. It is not your natural right to steal things. Sorry.
2. You have no empiracal proof that he is being paid off, just unfounded conjecture.
Wrong. Copyright is an international legal concept as specified in the Berne over , convention, which every member of the World Trade Organisation is bound by
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berne_Convention_for_the_Protection_of_Literary_and_Artistic_Works
Do some reading up next time.
Fuck this guy. Basically he doesn’t want any freedom to be allowed. “What kind of society do we live in when I can’t control everything?!?!”
I stand with Sarkozy!!!
http://www.ejpress.org/article/16491
Nettwerk CEO Terry McBride Puts Fans in Charge of Bands
http://www.pbs.org/mediashift/2008/12/nettwerk-ceo-terry-mcbride-puts-fans-in-charge-of-bands346.html
That guy there is not complaining about people downloading anything from the net, he even paid for the defense of people and he is part of the RIAA LoL
He represents this artists here:
Coldplay, Barenaked Ladies, K-OS and Avril Lavigne and he gives their music for free on youtube LoL
Seriously the only people that say downloading is stealing are the dumb people that didn’t saw it coming in the beginning of the 21st century, I mean look at the guy he is not sad having huge losses he is having profits were others are feeling the pain of the their own stupidity. Arts don’t need more laws need more people that can survive in a changing environment without cheating capitalism this really is freedom.
The guy even experimented with “pay what you think is fare on the way out” and people paid up.
Canadian Record Label To Pay For Teen’s Lawsuit Against The RIAA
http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20060126/2025216.shtml
Nettwerk, Topspin Show: Give People A Reason To Buy… And Many Of Them Come Through
http://techdirt.com/articles/20090618/1858245284.shtml
With some numbers about successful business that made the transition to digital LoL
But please don’t believe me or them go ask yourself around and see if the numbers are solid.
“By defending copyright I do not just defend artistic creation, I also defend my idea of a free society where everyone’s freedom is based on respect for the rights of others. I am also defending the future of our culture. It is the future of creation.”
‘My idea of a free society’ is an oxymoron. I understand the need for laws. I understand not allowing thievery to take place. But to use the thugish tactics enforced my the likes of the RIAA and MPAA whose acts against internet usage is the epitome of thugism is the ultimate in non-fairness against the internet. To not allow someone internet access is to deny them the freedon the french courts agreed is a constitutional right. You might as well not allow them to read a book or watch TV as they might think the wrong thoughts.
The internet is forcing industry to adapt faster than it wants to, not faster than they can. We’ve seen how fast they can put crap out onto the market, but they get pissed when people don’t want to pay the ludicrous prices fro said crapola.
This is the start of the french people starting to fear their own government after 150 years of the government fearing its people.
I feel that the next revolution is when the people in the world stop fearing corporations and learn to stand up to the self serving powers that are trying to control people and their thoughts.
The guy even experimented with “pay what you think is fare on the way out” and people paid up.
In bold should be read as “fair” not “fare” sorry.
myths:
1. file sharing both hurts creative individuals and art creativity.
2. copying for private use is stealing.
3. file sharing = lost income
truth:
1. file sharing removes monopoly current the movie industry.
2. copying hurts music coorporations who used to have complete distribution monopoly.
3. file sharing = increased money flowing to the music industry as a whole.
4. file sharing results in profit by talent (how imballanced).
5. free information is the most sacred relic for the future – bulletproof safeguard vs dictatorship, given decentralization of the internet is implemented.
anti-piracy is 1 of 4 things
greed
ignorance
powerhunger
coruption
-ignorance for the ppl,
-greed/powerhunger for the record labels,
-powerhunger/ignorance/coruption for the lawmakers.
Lets hope free information abolishes the ignorance before lawmakers censor the truth.
@neostyles
Laws get outrun by technology once in a while.. Trespassing used to include infinite space upwards until the invention of airplanes. Saying its a law doesnt defend it.
In the day of Napoleon III not Napoleon Bonaparte who is the only Napoleon referred only as Napoleon. Catch the Napoleonic drift?
Copyright is a set of defined rules about usage not ownership.
I as a representative of the people would never agree to someone forcing me to pay for free air TV or free radio and I’m not agreeing with having to pay for downloading on the internet were is the choice?
Every student of administration learns about the impact of monopolies and how bad they are for society and the economy so if the law should err, it should do it on the side of society for there can no good come out of strong copyright and this is hinted as the true in many independent studies carry out by many universities around the world.
People can still make a living out of their work and there is people proving that right now.
does he not realize that “illegally” downloading music does next to no damage to the artists, only the fatcat industries?
Damn Napoleon complex “world” leaders : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napoleon_complex
Sarkozy being short like hell
Copyright monopoly is a cancer spreading throughout society the more it gets stronger the more the economy and society suffer.
Short guy.. Lol Napoleon Complex.
http://antimatter.atbhost.net/2009/06/23/sarkozy-says-he-will-%E2%80%9Cgo-all-the-way%E2%80%9D-with-3-strikes/
@97:
This is a commonly used fallacy. Just because the internet has made it easier to steal, doesn’t justify it.
I think you got your myths and facts mixed up. Switch those two and then you would have it correct.
Nevertheless, let me address each one with ACTUAL PROOF.
Correct! Finally, you’re getting something right! If no one can reap the rewards of their work or receive recognition for their innovation, they no longer have any motivation to produce creative works. You’re doing good. Keep this up!
Again! Exactly right! Even if it’s not physical ptoperty, it’s intellectual property, which was concieved to give creators of digital works similar rights. You are taking something without paying for it. Whether you are removing a physical copy or a copy that someone else “shared with you”, you are still avoiding payment and depriving the creator of the profits they DESERVE . The underlying morality of this situation is self explanatory.
Read this from Tweake Guide
This completely destroys the “lol wel u can always dohnayt ^__^” load of bullshit.
3. file sharing = lost income
Ding ding ding! A perfect score!
When people hand out things freely to each other, they are avoiding payment, and thus depriving the creator of the monetary sustenance.
Looks like I spoke too soon. Where did you get this from? Seriously, who came up with this line?
Actually, filesharing encourages monopolies, by making it much harder for small groups to survive. It also promotes mediocrity, because when people no longer receive compensation for their work, they have no motivation to innovate and thus the competitive market framework that drives progression vanishes.
Are you high? How the hell does avoiding payment equal more money?
Please, consider using logic. People with more talent produce better things, which are almost always in higher demand in the theif.. cough cough.. pirate scene.
Wow, you’re ignorance of copyright.. is just… wow. Copyright doesn’t protect ideas, it protects the creative expression fo them. Movies and music aren’t information. They are creative works.
@59 yes, that’s exactly what i believe: everyone should have free and unlimited access to cultural artifacts. it is only your abhorrent greed that’s pathetic, “sir”.
Harvard Study Finds Weaker Copyright Protection Has Benefited Society
http://www.michaelgeist.ca/content/view/4062/125/
So much for the myth that filesharing hurts artists LoL
This is a brand new spanking clean study :)
Sarkozy is an idiot.
Just because it’s harvard doesn’t automatically correct. People just don’t want to pay for anything.
Put yourself in the creators shoes. If you spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on something, and a bunch of people who just tossing out copies off it to each other for free, how would you feel? Would you want to create more. Piracy makes any business model imaginable nonviable.
It’s simple logic.
If people not paying for anything, by some absurd means, actually did help artists are creators, I doubt copyright would be here to begin with.
People stoped paying for:
- live concerts?
- merchandise?
- digital services?
Nope, so your comment saying otherwise is a lie or could be just ignorance.
As soon as figures indicate that hollywood has had a successful year, pirates immediately proclaim that freeloading is somehow beneficial because correlation equals causation. People ripping off of hollywood is clearly good for it.
However, when the music and software industries experience huge financial losses, pirates are quick to change their minds and go “well correlation not really causation.”
So, logically, you are implying that theft somehow helped live concerts and merchandise become more popular?
He’s married to a madame of the copyright industry so ofcourse he will.
TF this is not really “news”, this is a simple confermation of what those of us politically involved new would happen.
Artists should be compensated for their work and NOT ONLY though merchandise and live concerts. Making an album or any other art product is a costly investment.
The system they are compensated through just doesn’t work anymore. If we have to be implement liberty limiting restrictions as bad as what’s being suggested by the entertainment industry in order to life support the old dying system it clearly means it’s time for a change.
There are some alternative systems already being used out there, one of the most famous being how TV works.
Did I imply that?
sorry, what I said an repeat is that the only thing going down is CD sales, films still profit and they are doing very well, publishers still sell a lot of books and turn a profit, netlabels are turning a profit and even RIAA members that choose to abandone the castle and let it fall are doing great, only those that want to defend the old ways are really suffering don’t you agree?
I don’t see where copyright needs more power if nothing copyright needs to be scaled down.
@ 104
- Stealing is the fallacy you are currently utilizing to force a conception, which is not true, or not anymore.
- No motivation to produce creative works, because there is no PROFIT involved, well, I think I might be an old cynic, but you really cannot go lower that this. Yes, the music will probably stop playing and my neighbor will stop painting. Nope.
- Substituting such values with each other so go-easy, like the personal motivation of an artist, and your PROFIT, speaks volumes of the character.
- your thuggish behavior and your mates which hunt is showing the profit-panic which your industry is facing, so STFU.
- competitive market framework….hm…no thanks, rather having my music selected by me, and not spoon fed by some mediamonkey like yourself sire. Natural selection, Profit by Talent is just one aspect of the picture, the rarities market is an other, mixing apples+pears I’m afraid.
5. free information is the most sacred relic for the future – bulletproof safeguard vs dictatorship, given decentralization of the internet is implemented.
Wow, you’re ignorance of copyright.. is just… wow. Copyright doesn’t protect ideas, it protects the creative expression fo them. Movies and music aren’t information. They are creative works.
- Copyright, and with the words of Jesus(hell yeah) = your words, not mine. And you are connecting it again with your type of reward-scheme. Now that is a fallacy as in a book.
For the sake of the discussion lets assume that industries are loosing money, can anyone prove that it’s directly related to filesharing?
Could it not be for others factors like suing your own customers>
The software industry is competing with opensource and everyday the opensource business model gain terrain.
The movie industry seems immune to filesharing as they see growth even in a recession no less so where is the basis to say that filesharing is affecting business in a bad way?
Here a lot of opensource commercial software that I don’t see loosing money why?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commercial_open_source_applications#List_of_Commercial_Open_Source_Applications_and_Services
They give the software for free and still make a living anybody doubt that?
@neostyles
Lessee.
Of course it isn’t. But when you share files, nothing is being stolen. It’s amazing how you continue to utilize concepts and etymology that have been trampled into the ground.
I never said he was certainly being paid off. I said it is a /theory/. Okay, perhaps it’s more like a hypothesis, but nonetheless my point stands. I simply believe it’s likely that he’s doing this for some obscure reason that would be embarrassing were it made publicly known- like bribes from the entertainment industry.
Filesharing is not stealing.
Come ON! Apparently you know nothing of the concept of selflessness, so I’m going to go ahead and explain it for you. You see, not everyone in the world is a slave to the paycheck, as big business would like everyone to be. Though they be comparatively rare creatures, there actually are people out there who do things out of the goodness of their heart, and for the betterment of society as a whole, as opposed to because there is some financial reward in it for them. There are more important things in the world than money. If you simply dismiss what I say and refuse to listen, which seems to be the overwhelming norm when it comes to my replies to you, then well, there are plenty of examples of this. If you need a couple modern-day examples, look at copyright holders that have embraced filesharing. Look at the entire Creative Commons project. Look at the free software movement. Look at those and then tell me to my face that nobody has incentive to create because they aren’t guaranteed incredible profits.
So… IP was created within the past few decades, in response to the digital age? Perhaps you are the one who needs to do some reading.
But while we’re on the subject, let’s talk about intellectual property for a moment. The concept that you can own an idea. The concept that you can control the use of an idea and even keep that idea from benefiting mankind if such restriction benefits your wallet. It’s fallacious and ridiculous. Ideas belong to society as a whole. They are public domain; they belong to everyone. If I came up with an idea for building a sand castle to live in, and you went ahead and did it, I’d be a childish moron for crying that you’d stolen my idea and demanding fair compensation for it. Even though creating the idea took a tenth of a second of my time, I should, under intellectual property, be ‘compensated’ for that idea for the rest of my life. I have the right to be fat and rich at the expense of the whole world because I thought of something.
Copyright hurts the economy, but more importantly, copyright as we know it hurts society. It discourages creation more than it encourages it. But how, do you ask, can this possibly be the case? The answer is simple: Copyright is commercial in nature. And as we reviewed in a previous lesson, there are more important things in the world than money. I’m quite certain that I will be pounding that point into your thick skull for as long as it takes for you to get it. If you even can.
No, we’re not. We’re copying our things and sharing them with others. Nothing is being stolen or taken, only given.
Another point that needs to be drilled through your skull: You can’t deprive someone of something they never would have had in the first place. I have paid for none of the music I downloaded. The artists have received zero compensation (in monetary terms) for what I’ve downloaded of theirs. However, because I’ve downloaded it, I know about them and I appreciate their music. This, in turn, means that I have a reason to support them if the opportunity ever comes up and I can afford it. Which would you rather have: One million sales, with maybe twice that many people knowing about your work, or 75% as many sales with the entire world knowing of your work?
So construction workers should be paid every time someone new moves into a house they helped build?
I want to see a link to that example, by the way. It uses such terms as “theft” and “earning appropriate income.” Sounds to me like you wrote that.
Not if we accept that there are more important things in the world than money and that people create for noncommercial reasons. Also, you’re generalizing. Saying that people who support donation type like that is making them seem like uneducated morons- so you’re accomplishing both personal attacks and generalizing at once! I guess it takes someone as horribly misled as you to accomplish that.
You are disgusting. Right there you are saying “Everyone who shares something in order to help their neighbor is a thief because they are depriving someone else of profits.” If someone asked me for a copy of a program because he needed it to perform some task, I would be wrong to say no. It would be terrible of me to say “I apologize, but such behavior would violate the exclusive rights of the copyright holders. You are legally required to purchase a copy of the program in order to satisfy intellectual property laws.” I’d say “Sure” and hand him a flash drive. Or, on another note: If my friend gives me a cookie, are we acting immorally or breaking the law because neither of us are paying the food industry for use of the cookie? I’m going to reiterate another basic point you haven’t been able to understand: Sharing is a fundamental part of prosperous society.
You really do love using the same nonsense over and over and over. Because of filesharing, public awareness of these small groups, who are not heavily advertised by the recording industry, will increase. As such more people will be in a position to support these groups financially; you can’t buy a CD of a band you are unaware of. Your argument is fallacious.
He means that filesharers buy more because they are aware of more. Try to consider such things before you launch off with junk like “Are you high?”
Filesharing isn’t theft. Anyway. Because people who share files undermine the recording industry’s advertising and promotion by replacing it with a much more effective system, filesharing allows for a system based on merit. Public opinion of a work, instead of the official promotion and advertising behind it, determines how successful a certain album or equivalent is. This is much fairer because it means you have to be a decent musician to be successful, instead of just having a rich uncle who’s an industry executive.
Conclusion: Once again you have suitably demonstrated your relative inability to grasp the basic concepts of filesharing. Your indoctrination into intellectual property and industry-promoted propaganda is preventing you from using your head. From here on out, I will be bolding the basic concepts in my posts, when I use them, that you need to understand. If I have to use them so much that you see them in your sleep, so be it. So long as you lose at least a little of your utter ignorance. Good luck.
People may be going to the hospital and being served by Freetards that had the audacity to make medical software for free.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_open_source_healthcare_software
I will tell you I’m running from strong copyright and IP in general, I do not use proprietary software anymore I like Octave, blender, avidemux, VLC, Dr Geo, Stellarium, gnucash, inkscape, gimp, kino, openoffice and a lot of others softwares and I donate to ten projects every month because I know things don’t get done for free there is always a cost but I can pay what I can and I feel confortable that is great would microsoft let me do that? Well they didn’t and I changed my OS and discovered a new world because of a silly thing I paid $400 for a windows XP and couldn’t change the language of it, it was a the support guy told me an option of a higher priced version that I would have to buy a new license WTF was the first thing that crossed my mind.
Now I’m doing the same thing with music and video.
Jamendo and Miro are your friends, I’m not supporting stronger copyrights and I can change my habits, I maybe not be able to change laws but I sure can say I’m not buying nothing from these people LoL
Will artist pass law forcing me to buy their stuff?
Wow, you go dude!
RT
http://www.anon-tools.tk
Alright geez.. I get the point..
I do see the logic in your points, I don’t agree with EVERYTHING but we will agree to disagree.
Appreciate your enlightenment though.
@neostyles:
No you don’t, at the first available opportunity you’ll start trolling that filesharing is theft (in all variations) again, as usual.
Jeeze! Ya buy em books. Ya send em to school. And look what happens.
“…was 1848, in Napoleon’s day.”
That would be in the time of Louis-Napoleon, not Napoleon. Napoleon died in 1821.
Napoleon died in 1821; enigmax must have been thinking of Napoleon III when he said the last address of this type was made “in Napoleon’s day.”
@2 — I’m on it ;) j/k… :P
I propose that everyone who voted for that piece of shit perform hara-kiri right now! And that some hero comes along and slayes that foul beast.
“he will go all the way with 3 strikes”
that’s what she said! ZING!
The only people who defend rampant piracy have no skin in the game, and nothing to lose.
It’s the whole welfare VS rich people thing played out again. The rich saying get your lazy asses to work, the welfare people saying – where’s my free money.
Piracy doesn’t just kill motivation – it kills the ability for many people to devote their life to their passion, because they need to do something else to make money and feed their families.
It’s pretty reprehensible to be defending piracy in front of the very creators you admire, while they stop creating in order to survive.
Congrats to all the winners.
Re: the below.. Yeah buddy, tell that to my landlord. I’ve yet to see any free rents, given away by selfless building owners.
You can blame “big business” all you want, but people need a place to live – and it’s not free.
You call it a “slave to a paycheck”, I call it a “slave to a roof, running water, and electricity”.
You call it a “financial reward”, I call it “sustenance and survival”
Look out your window (if you’re not in your parents basement) there’s a real world out there. People need to survive mang. It was cool when you could create something and make a living from your creations, but that’s getting a lot harder with everything given away for free, by anonymous individuals – RUNNING THEIR CORPORATIONS.. The torrent sites are businesses too.
Now explain how file sharing is not stealing.. Buying a CD does not give you a 50,000 user license to send it all your myspace friends. Don’t tiptoe – it’s piracy. And even if you don’t do that, lots of people do. Just because you don’t crash your car when you drink, doesn’t make it right to drive around drunk.
—-
“Come ON! Apparently you know nothing of the concept of selflessness, so I’m going to go ahead and explain it for you. You see, not everyone in the world is a slave to the paycheck, as big business would like everyone to be. Though they be comparatively rare creatures, there actually are people out there who do things out of the goodness of their heart, and for the betterment of society as a whole, as opposed to because there is some financial reward in it for them. There are more important things in the world than money.”
What if they wanted your car? Would you be wrong to say no? What if they wanted it for the whole month, or the whole year?
Sure, if you could COPY your car, then it might be easier. You care much less about the copy, because you still have your car.
Fact is, you worked hard to buy your car, it’s yours, and you care what happens to it. You also require or desire the use of it.
How is this any different?
If you COULD copy your car, do you think it would be fair to the car companies? I mean they can copy cars too right? But they did design, develop, manufacture, produce, market, and sell the car after all.
More specifically, let’s say you developed a muffler that was quieter, more efficient, and looked amazing. You spent a great part of a few years working on this, hoping you could bring it to market. You know there’s a demand, people will like your muffler. But then Honda and Toyota see it, and just copies it exactly, and puts it on all their new cars. They can sell them for less than you can make them for.
How would you feel?
“You are disgusting. Right there you are saying “Everyone who shares something in order to help their neighbor is a thief because they are depriving someone else of profits.” If someone asked me for a copy of a program because he needed it to perform some task, I would be wrong to say no. It would be terrible of me to say “I apologize, but such behavior would violate the exclusive rights of the copyright holders. You are legally required to purchase a copy of the program in order to satisfy intellectual property laws.” I’d say “Sure” and hand him a flash drive. Or, on another note: If my friend gives me a cookie, are we acting immorally or breaking the law because neither of us are paying the food industry for use of the cookie? I’m going to reiterate another basic point you haven’t been able to understand: Sharing is a fundamental part of prosperous society.
Like nobody cares if you share your car. Nobody cares if you share the muffler they sold you. You can even resell them, no problem.
However when you start making copies, things get hectic.
Does he also not have a real birth certificate?
@Socks Manly
You have a funny replying format, and it took me a minute to figure out whether you were reposting for +1 or responding to what I said. That said… thanks for remaining civil. :)
That doesn’t really have anything to do with filesharing, considering that the vast majority who do it do not do it for profit.
But have they? We still have media. More importantly, we still have new media. People are still writing software (for profit, which I think is sad), making movies, creating music, etc, despite filesharing and despite the fact that it’s been going for years. And more people are saying it’s okay to download their stuff. They’re making that choice voluntarily, so can you really hold it against them?
What I think is reprehensible is the recording industry claiming to represent justice for the artists, when in fact it defends its own interests.
And I happen to think that it’s really sad that people capitalize on the basic survival needs of others.
I still have yet to see any hard data proving that all torrent sites make huge profits…
I think it’s just a justification for anti-piracy, and a false one at that.
Okay!
Stealing is taking something from someone else. The conventional definition of this is taking someone else’s car, money, sandwich, etc. Filesharing fails this definition because stealing applied to the physical world means you are depriving one person of something. It was in their possession; now it’s in yours. They don’t have it anymore. When applied to the intangible, this does not work because you are simply receiving a copy of something from someone. You do not go into their computer and erase the original file; therefore, you are not stealing from them.
What about the artists, you say? First of all, when you download, you do not “steal” (to use anti-piracy terminology) from the artists, as the artists do not hold the copyrights on their works. The record labels do. The job of the record labels is to distribute and promote the music of the artists that sign onto them- a job that the artists can now do themselves with the Internet. The record labels have an outdated business model that is not compatible with modern technology, and rather than embrace the changing times, they will fight for their lives and their profits. But I digress.
Anti-piracy advocates will say that you are stealing from these labels: that you are “depriving them of a chance to make a gain.” This is fallacious. For one, you cannot steal from someone what they never would have had in the first place. If you tell me that you are going to give me ten billion dollars, and then you decide not to, I can’t have you prosecuted for theft. For the vast majority of downloads, the p2p user would not have purchased the album had he or she not downloaded it; this refers to the entertainment industry’s assumption that one download is one lost sale, which is flawed for the very reason I just stated. Additionally, the “loss of a chance to make a gain” is ridiculous. As long as a company has products for sale that are available at all times to the general public, that company always has a chance to make a gain. Someone can always make the decision to buy from them. At best one can claim that filesharing reduces a company’s chance to make a gain by providing an alternative, and this is not sufficient justification to close down filesharing, considering the many benefits it brings to the common man.
But all in all, the biggest reason that filesharing is not stealing is because the concept of intellectual property, the idea that you can own intangible things, is in itself fallacious.
If we could magically copy anything and distribute it like we can digital files, it would be the best thing to ever happen to mankind. There would be no world hunger. There would be no disease crises in third-world countries. Everyone would have everything they ever needed to survive and make the world a better place. It would completely eliminate the need for an economy, which is fundamentally based on the concept of getting to people the things they need but do not have. So how could you say that it wouldn’t be okay to copy a car? You couldn’t say that you were stealing from a car company, because there’s no longer any such thing as money.
As for the muffler? I’d let them use the design. Any such designing on my part would be for the benefit of humanity as a whole, as opposed to my own commercial gain. Being commercial companies, Honda and Toyota would probably profit from my design and my work, but that’s just a consequence of how our system is. The point is that my design would help society, and that’s what really matters. After all, I couldn’t really go after them for stealing my idea- that is in the same ballpark as intellectual property.
this little dwarf is causing quite a bit of trouble,
ILL GO ALL THE WAY FOR 3 STRIKES
oh boy did his slut wife put him up for this, that’s the only possible reason he is fighting so hard for it, she was probably like
“listen hear little, no more poonani for you until you fight for my honour”
poor man always was a bit daft
file sharing is my human right, RIAA is Hitler
Ha come on, you went too far this time : it’s the foundation of our economy and it’s been for centuries. Someone makes or creates something – a house, a car, a movie, bread, clothes etc – and you buy it. As a consequence the person you bought it from is able to afford the stuff he needs.
The problem in this equation is that nowadays the corporations just have too much power, control and interests and get too big a share of the money.
I agree it would be great to abolish this kind of system but it’s not gonna happen any time soon, right?
So why deprive just a certain part of the population – the artists – of the right to earn a living?
I know there are some other ways of earning a living than just selling copies but a lot of artists are generally not the most in tune with what’s going on tech wise or aware of much else than their art…
I generally agree with what you say but this particular statement is just wrong. You may also rather call it utopic.
I’d also like to add that you expertly avoided the question raised through the muffler analogy by expanding it to “copying everything” which was not the case in Sock’s Manly example, and certainly not with present-day artists…
the easist site for torrents (movies, music, software, games) is http://www.entertane.com – faster, simpler – and you can search all your favorite torrent sites.
@neoliar
“Just because he made a decision that wasn’t in the favor of piracy doesn’t mean he’s being paid off. ”
The fact that he’s vowed to support HADOPI despite it being ruled unsconstitutional and struck down by the highest legal authority in France, on the other hand, more than just implies that he’s being payed off.
@neoliar
“1. It is not your natural right to steal things. Sorry.”
Sharing isn’t stealing, liar. Try again.
As for the rest of your(as well as Socks Manly’s) fallacious bullshit, it’s easily debunked by the latest filesharing study out of Harvard Business School(see comment #107 for the link).
I quote, “The publication of new books rose
by 66% over the 2002-2007 period. Since 2000, the annual release of new music albums
has more than doubled, and worldwide feature film production is up by more than 30% since 2003. At the same time, empirical research in file sharing documents that consumer welfare increased substantially due to the new technology. ”
As you can see, reality seriously conflicts with your crack smoking delusion that filesharing stifles innovation and discourages the creation of new works.
Book, music, and film production would have DECLINED since the year 2000 if you were even remotely correct. But it hasn’t. To the contrary, the production of creative works has INCREASED as the number of filesharers continues to grow. How do you explain that?
Oh, wait. I’m sorry. You can’t. :D
4nd, sorry I don’t know the ins and outs of posting here, whatever.. :)
I’ve long argued that piracy helps. I was a BBS pirate before being an Internet pirate, and even then at the beginning it was just to get things to the BBS’s faster. It wasn’t an instant move here. However it was private. It was very private.
Computers advanced much more rapidly because of piracy. High school kids can’t afford photoshop, premier, these kinds of great tools that creativity is born from.
It had a purpose. It helped. I’m afraid it’s past that.
Sure there are cases where it helps. The indie artist who needs his name out there. The guy who DOES just do it for love, and wants people to listen, see, enjoy.
But the thing is – they can choose to do that themselves. What happens now is that whether they like it or not, their stuff is available for free, everywhere.
When it was just the computer kids who could get the stuff, the imprint on society was small. It was password protected. It was IP protected. It was super frowned upon to the point of expulsion from the scene to sell or even distribute things to less secure places. Those things happened, but it wasn’t the norm.
Nowadays you can just visit a free website, and bypass the system that rewards creativity.
Don’t fool yourself about their profits. Let me explain.
For a living now, I run adult websites. I’ve seen large people in the business say their sales are down over 60% this year. One guy who has always been honest said that through affiliate sales he did over $500,000 last year, and now his forecast for this year is just over $300,000. The economy and the free availability of porn videos on the net is a double whammy this year.
I know it’s hard for you to feel sorry for him, but he works hard. He makes that much because there are people that want what he produces, and enjoy what he offers, and are willing to pay for it. Everyone walks away happy.
When you ask anyone less than 25 or 30 years old nowadays if they pay for porn, they’ll just laugh and say why? It’s all just free, go to this tube, or that tube, or all the same stuff is available at TPB, or the forums where people post every single piece of each site.
Why? Lots of reasons. But the big one? Money my friend.
Google results are dominated by torrent sites, because people link to them. I mean it’s free shit after all, who can blame them. That’s hundreds of thousands of viewers a day, just from the big G.
The business model is simple. Steal everything you can, make it free, and sell OTHER stuff. Like penis pills, and weight gain supplements, energy drinks, medications, scams, all kinds of stuff.
Just look at the alexa rankings of some of these monsters.. Rapidshare, megaupload, all the tube sites.. Lots of them are some of the busiest sites in the world.
They’re busy and popular because people WANT media. People WANT professional quality. People WANT creations. And they love getting a deal. Free? Where.
The net gain to the world of turning all that lust for entertainment into way, way, way less money, for the people willing to step on anyone to get a piece of the action, is one of the most greedy and heinous business models to ever exist.
I’m not sure how you see it as any different. You write very effectively, and your points are good ones, but it’s not the world we live in. It’s an ideal that doesn’t deal with the problems at all. It’s cool if we can all sit around and play guitar around campfires all day, but whose going to work to pay for little billy’s leukemia treatment?
I mean at some point people have to grow up, and I don’t see any older people really defending piracy. Why? It’s always the kids with their ideals, purposely avoiding the problems.
If record labels are so evil, why are artists trying so hard to get signed? For an artist to be properly marketed nowadays you NEED good management. You NEED a good agent. You need people on the streets putting your posters up, and not just in the city where you’re from. It’s a lot easier to be an artist when you’re not also trying to run the business side of things too. A painter is supposed to paint, after all.
And please re-think your idea that media, software, music, all that isn’t tangible. It’s very tangible. Just because it’s digital 1’s and 0’s, it’s certainly arranged in order. It’s not 1’s and 0’s thrown in the air, ranndomly landing in a patter that makes us want to dance. :)
Is Dark Side of the Moon tangible evidence that awesome exists? I like to think so!
@revolution
“So why deprive just a certain part of the population – the artists – of the right to earn a living?”
I have a question.
Are you ignorant of the fact that filesharing doesn’t deprive artists from the right to earn a living(see Spain, Canada, where personal use filesharing is legal and yet – SHOCK! – artists continue to make a living), or are you merely spewing empty-headed MAFIAA propaganda?
If I was a gambler, I’d place my money in the latter. Call me cynical.
Anonymous.. Are you really anonymous or is the use of the world “fallacious” just popular around here? ;)
I can speak for my industry, and people are closing, up, shop. Websites are going offline. Hosting companies have seen a 30% decline across the board. Mom and pops websites are pretty much a thing of the past. Credit card billing practices are getting out of hand, being abused by companies trying to dump water from their sinking ships. Updates have stopped at tons of sites, as people figure they’ll cut back all expenses and just ride the last wave in without paddling.
What does that all mean? It means models aren’t being hired, studios aren’t being rented, equipment isn’t being purchased, contracts are being canceled, people are giving up and looking for new work. These are entrepreneurs who have run businesses for 10+ years, looking for any job they can get. The ratio of converting free visitors to paying customers has declined yearly since 2000, but this year fell like a rock. Not normal.
The people who are sticking around are putting up – guess what? Torrent sites, tube sites.. they’re not beating them, they’re joining them. Because that’s maybe the only way to survive.
And the cycle continues. It’s kind of like a devalued currency, where you need 10x the money to buy 1x the goods. It’s giving away the cow instead of selling milk.
I’m telling you all that stuff I just wrote is real, from my experience, no word of a lie. It’s easy to find a report that matches your argument and then say “all arguments are off!” but the reality on the streets is saying something different.
@revolution
Thanks for your input.
For one, it’s not really depriving the artists of the right to earn a living. You speak of the power of corporations nowadays, and I wholeheartedly agree. I would like to take that into the direction of the artists’ income and point out how much the corporations hamper said income. It’s pretty common knowledge that the record labels barely let the artist make anything from CD sales, so it’s more the corporations that are depriving them of their living than filesharers. Anyway, I kind of digress. To say that filesharers deprive artists of income is to assume that filesharing results in zero sales. Some independent studies have been cited that say that filesharers purchase more media because p2p exposes them to more.
It’s probably a good idea for content creators to be in touch with the latest technological innovation. This way they can be “ahead of the game” and be among the first to take advantage of any new developments that appear. For example: If artists had begun to share their music for free when p2p was first implemented, I think they would be a lot better off and perhaps more people would have followed suit by now. I acknowledge that it isn’t like that, but it should be. :P
Are you sure? The last paragraph of my post was devoted to the muffler thing. If you need to, go back and read.
But I kind of see what you’re saying about the car copying. Although I take “expertly avoiding” as a compliment, I should point out that I didn’t actually avoid the question; I simply misunderstood it a little, I suppose. I guess I can properly answer here.
You know, it gets difficult when you switch to infinitely copying the tangible. All the rules that apply to digital copying- value of a copy, ownership of a copy, etc- have to be redefined. How much is something worth when you can copy it for free and yet it is a physical, resellable object? If you copy someone else’s car, who owns the copy? It’s a totally different situation than digital copying. So I’m not sure if I can adequately answer the question, but I can try.
Um, about the car companies. Would it be fair to them to copy a car? I guess it would mostly depend on if a copy had value. If it did, they’d want to keep people from copying their cars, so it could be argued that it would be unfair to them. If it did not, most of their industry would probably be focused on R&D as opposed to actual production, so it wouldn’t be a big deal.
“Some independent studies have been cited that say that filesharers purchase more media because p2p exposes them to more.”
Those aren’t studies, those are opinion pieces.
Are you willing to believe that people are more likely to pay for something they already have, in a good move gesture, for the sole sake of doing the right thing and feeling warm and fuzzy about it…. VS…. Seeing a pair of $250 shoes that cost $6 to produce but look AMAZING and omgigottahavethose NOW..
I mean it’s obvious. Sure maybe some people make donations or whatever.. I don’t. I have a kid to feed. When he’s paid for, and my debts are paid for, and my mom’s debts are paid for, and my sister is okay, and I can rest assured that food is covered till the end of my lifetime.. Then.. Then maybe I’ll just freely go giving money away. I’m just not rich enough to give it away without getting something in return that I value. Maybe the donators are doing just that. But I don’t think they see very far in front of them. Maybe that’s better too.. But I bet there’s more of me than there is of them. ;)
And I mean that’s how shopping works. What people are willing to pay for something is totally market driven. Some people see value differently too.. For some the buffet is the most amazing thing ever.. All that food for one low price? While others would rather have quality over quantity, and might pay 10x more for it.
Some people buy things to feel good, or satiate an anxiety, or an addiction, a feeling of importance, a personal goal, vanity, all kinds of reasons. That’s what makes the world go round. When people start saving all their money – economists get worried.
We’re part of a system more interconnected than ever, and everything affects everything. Giving away what could be sold isn’t doing much good I’m afraid. And I mean we’re not talking about blueprints to a well that can save thousands of lives in africa each year.. We’re talking about rich kids from rich families filling up their ipod. Are there not more noble causes to get behind, when speaking of freedom, expression and virtue?
I smell a major False Flag “terr0rist” attack. This time it will be digital.
I smell a major False Flag “terrorist” attack. This time it will be digital.
looks at sarkozy and thinks … *how france became a dictatorship again*
…and we’re going to go all the way underground and VPN until all this shit is going to change.
Also equalling a single society with a global internet is uhm…wrong, stupid, hybris, not applicable..all of the above? :P
Also I always thought the whole concept/idea of society is that it’s up to the MAJORITY to decide and agree upon what they want and then have this represented in the way they rule and live.
Oh wait, turns out it was just the majority of FUNDS that gets to decide. Oops.
so how do they currently prevent people from sharing copied cd’s with each other?
maybe his wife just isn’t putting out and he’s taking it out on the internet
The guy is mentally retarded and needs to be sent to a mental home.
Could’nt think of a nice way of saying it, so there it is.
I’m wondering how he’ll be able to push the legistlation trough when there the EU has explicitly outlawed 3 strikes types of deals.
Will he withdraw frances membership from the Union for his big music palls?
Sarkozy has interesting priorities.
There’s famine, wars, and a economic crisis on a global scale, yet Sarkozy is worried about file sharing. It boggles the mind.
The people who voted for him should take note, and make sure he doesn’t get into power again in the future.
Well, what you quoted came with a context. My point was : how fair would it be to go to Worst Buy and ask to get their stuff for free while still paying for everything else?
If you read the posts I made in the past, you’d know I’m far from being a MAFIAA supporter – they’re stupid greedy b*st*rds. Still, file sharing IS an issue.
You should…
And all this stuff costs money. For instance, the cost of making an album does not come down to just writing a few songs and recording them with a $50 mic in audacity. I think most people who consider musicians lazy and overpaid clearly have NO understanding at all of the process and cost of recording and promoting an album.
Sure, most artists make close to nothing on album sales and it is precisely because making and promoting an album costs so much…
He may go all the way and end up falling into the Atlantic Ocean. I hope the tides take him some where where he can not do any more harm.
http://www.entertane.com – the easist site for torrents (movies, music, software, games) – faster, simpler – and you can search all your favorite torrent sites.
Trolls everywhere
So much bullshit…
And no one vote for the dwarf?
He elect himself??
Fuck you all, and next time go vote, or vote somoene decent.
Its our world, its our Country, dont let the assholes rule it.
wonder what kind of baby sarkozy will have after he gets the 3 strikes law pregnant
oh ya its only morally wrong is the majority say its wrong, as the majority do it morally wrong is them trying to stop it
Sarkozy is Satan.
REMEMBER THIS
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what I find interesting is that for the first time in 150 years a President addresses Parliament and File-Sharing is what drew this event.
Not poverty – not global terrorism – not human trafficking – not arms dealing or drugs or actual Pirates on the oceans – but file-sharing.
Those menacing file-sharers – they’re going to bring the entire world to it’s knees.
France is looking for an underground network :p
Sarkozy Says He Will “Go All The Way” With 3 Strikes in his ass
The dwarf has spoken again! This guy is a joke when France is currently under fire because of the financial crisis he was else nothing else to fuckin do than pissed of people with a stupid law! Go to hell and leave us in peace! France ain’t a democraty anymore it’s pure dictatorship. As for me I promise I will disobey!
Seriously looks like some old faggot hasn’t had a chance to stick their head between Carla Bruni’s legs for a while.
That guy IS a joke.
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