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Anti-Piracy Group Hints at Disclosure “On Demand”

The chief executive of UK anti-piracy FAST says the chances of a completely voluntary agreement between rights holders and ISPs to tackle file-sharing is “unlikely”. John Lovelock, boss at the Federation Against Software Theft goes on to imply that what his outfit would really like is file-sharers’ names and addresses on demand, with no need for a court order. This would be “gold plating” he said.

FASTAfter joining the Federation Against Software Theft (FAST) back in 2002, John Lovelock is the Chief Executive of the anti-piracy group, responsible for lobbying the government for copyright legislative reform, promoting copyright ‘education’ to students and, of course, taking legal action against those who don’t fall into line.

This blend of ‘education’ backed up by legal action has caused controversy for FAST. The outfit is known to track down people who use company Internet connections to share files. FAST then approaches the company with what many consider to be veiled threats of being raided, audited and/or prosecuted. If the company capitulates, FAST introduces the customer to the ‘commercial arm’ of their ‘non-profit’ outfit which goes about aggressively selling software and licenses to ensure the target company ‘complies’. FAST’s approach is not popular, with a lawyer claiming that FAST actually undermines work to protect copyrights. Many companies that have sought legal advice after being contacted by FAST have been advised by their lawyers not to speak with them.

However, FAST is not limiting itself to putting pressure on businesses, it wants to go after individuals too. FAST (or The Federation as it likes to be known), has just responded to the Department for Business Enterprise and Regulatory Reform’s (BERR) ‘Consultation on Legislative Options To Address Illicit Peer-to-peer File Sharing‘, which was launched in July 2008. In a nutshell, this consultation was designed to find a way for ISPs and rights holders to reach agreement on what to do about illicit file-sharing, via “3 strikes” or another mechanism.

Of course, this hasn’t been plain sailing for them, since ISPs don’t really want to start harassing their customers at the behest of copyright lobbyists. FAST CEO John Lovelock clearly believes that a voluntary agreement is unlikely: “A voluntary approach would be the easiest solution but experience has shown that such an approach may well not work, as it is dependent on a full consensus being achieved; to date this has not been successful, despite ongoing dialogue between rights holders and ISPs.”

The fact that ISPs don’t want to go after their own customers isn’t lost on Lovelock, who says that government regulation is ‘inevitable’, since this will “take the decision out of the hands of the ISPs themselves.” He also says that he feels that ISPs should not be able to ‘opt-out’ of any scheme, since this would “undermine the entire arrangement”.

Lovelock is calling for “political will” to force ISPs to take action against illicit file-sharing, whilst conveniently skipping over the legal difficulties this would cause. ISPs are not responsible for the actions of their users and time and time again they have refused to become ‘Internet Police’, and quite rightly so. In the meantime, trying to force ISPs to do things against their will, or taking steps to ensure that they are side-stepped in the decision making process, isn’t going to be appreciated.

More worrying is how organizations like FAST feel that somehow they should be able to shortcut, bypass or change the law to suit their needs. “One argument,” said Lovelock, “is that personal data relating to a given IP-address may be given to the rights holder on request, without a court order being needed, which is arguably gold plating.”

Sure, let’s just scrap due process and the Data Protection Act. They just complicate things.

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  • Andy

    What a fucking joke

  • Drugs

    It’s truly amazing that some people are so ignorant.

    What I don’t understand is, if they’re non-profit, then why are they so aggressive when it comes to going after people…almost like they really are making money.

    Hopefully, no government will ever be dumb enough to let something like this happen…but then again you never know.

  • mister_playboy

    Yet another vengeful jerk who would love to be a copyright Rambo, if only annoying things like “the law” did not stand in the way.

  • js

    This guy’s out of his little mind, he sounds certifiably insane!

    I bet his kids are filesharing at home and he wouldn’t even know.

  • Roze

    The “political will”? Which way does the “political will” go? Is it the same as the “popular will”?

    Clearly these people at FAST think of themselves as some authority figure, when they are, in fact, no such thing. Clearly, many people are mislead into thinking that they are the authority, when such things as their “education” propaganda are spread to the masses.

    Well, what can be done by this? There are plenty of file-sharers, so hopefully there is a “file-sharers’ will” – can this will ever gain any influence? I think it not best for this “file-sharers’ will” to lay dormant at all.

    Roze
    http://www.10ch.org/

  • MeH

    ha ha, if this does happen people just won’t buy the internet… they will use public wifi spots and other things… :-)

    They don’t think that the ISPs won’t agree to it because it means that they will lose so much money, as the pirates are probably the majority of the internet users (even if it teenagers that dont know what they are doing is wrong!)…

    MeH
    Mayhem excites Hell

  • uhh

    Is it just me or does he sound like Satan or some really evil character that not even the biggest of assholes would listen to..

    *sigh* he gets to live the good life while he changes the world to suit him better… while I work my ass off everyday and now have a better chance of getting sued..

    all for shit I wouldnt buy anyway.. being as Im too poor.

    People take this kind of thing too lightly, he is no better then Hitler.

  • Anonymous

    @6 “he is no better then Hitler.”
    ————————————–

    Millions of DEAD Jews beg to differ you colossal idiot.

  • yea right

    with the new pay by the gig bandwidth schemes file sharers = money.
    why would any corporation agree to hand them over to the dogs while violating their own Terms Of Service not to mention local privacy laws ?

    John Lovelock is delusional if he thinks people will sit back and let this happen. Gold plate my cock.

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  • That Guy

    These guys at fast are ridiculous. I hate people who think they know best when they dont.

    Visit P2P Tech Time
    http://www.p2ptechtime.com

  • Phishybongwaters

    Ok then. How about this. How about we decree that at any given time, the police can come into your house, search it top to bottom, looking for anything?

    Well, we’d say, that’s a violation of various rights we hold dear.

    So these yahoos think it’s fine to simply grab all the names of any “potential” downloaders/uploaders?

    These morons know 1 thing well. They simply CAN’T win these cases in court. This is why when you see them claiming victory, it’s because the defendant settled, it didn’t go to court. But of course, when the defendant fights back and says bring it to court, they “drop the case”.

    Their last desperate chance is to get the names of everyone with internet access (even those without, you CAN pirate at your local library) so they can send blanket notices to everyone on earth claiming they are suing and demand money. They want this because they know, probably a good 50% will just pay them to shut the hell up, even tho they would win if it went to court.

    Pure insanity. How about fixing the global credit crisis? What about the automotive sector that’s failing? What about the wars we’re involved in and will be soon? What about health care? What about the environment?

    No folks, anti-piracy is more important, more important even than protecting you from a terrorist.

    Go take a flight, any flight, in the US, are they looking for bombs on your laptop and ipod? Nope, but they ARE looking for pirated content.

    Go suck a goat.

  • A hairy dog

    “This would be “gold plating” he said.”

    “This would be “an invasion of privacy & against the law” I said.”

    WOOF

  • Chairman Mao

    “Gold plate my cock.” by yea right.

    Dear yea right,

    I happen to know King Midas, friend of a friend of an uncle of a granddad of an aardvark of a cabbage. I’ll send him round to molest you whenever is convenient.

    Yours sincerly
    Chairman Mao

  • yea right

    emperor Mao,

    my address is as follows: Clivemont House, 54 Clivemont Road, Maidenhead, Berks. SL6 7BZ, UK

    Please send me everything about anything. Oh and molestors, scam artists and whoever else wants to have a chat about why FAST is a fail call: +44 (0)1753 527999;

  • Anonymous

    If something like this happens I’ll just make zombies out of the computers of others and download through them…

  • Anonymous

    you media companies are bound by the law as is everyone you will not change things to suit your own preferences and you are not authority figures. isps better watch themselves as well they also seem to think they are authority figures and that they have the right to shove paying customers around. your days are numbered if you start that stuff.

  • wman

    lucidvain.co.nr

  • Anonymous

    lol typo in the name should be john lovecock xD

  • Dimagus

    Yes, we all wish we could invade privacy plus suspend rights, freedoms, and liberties “on demand”. However, since that’s not possible for everyone, we might as well give it to a for-profit global corporation.

    am i right?

  • Crynsos

    So what would happen if the CD / DVD / Software sales around the world kept going down, but there would be suddenly no file sharers around at all to sue?

    I guess that would be the moment when many companies suddenly go like MediaDefender and only think “This is fucked up”, cause the customers keep leaving, there are no more people to sue and live from and they are too stupid to think about new business models… yeah, what if…

  • pahaha

    FAST have been around since the 80′s (Showing my age now :P ). They were shite then & they are still Shite now.

    Funny how they all seem to be called “John” tho, used to be a “John Loader” coz thats what we all did then ;) LOAD everything mahahahaahah

    FAST & FACT = FAiL :)

    Hey “John” what eva, u dint catch me then, u wont catch me now. . .

    OT. Our fav Pink Pig is due to have a hearing tomorrow…

    Hope all goes well Pinky PiG!!! Fukk cleaveland Pigs

  • Phishybongwaters

    keep in mind if you buy blank media you’ve already paid a tariff to recover money lost from piracy directly to the mpaa/riaa and similar groups.

    gotta always keep that floating around, people tend to forget. Google it if you think I’m wrong. This started with tape cassettes and VHS (now I’m showing MY age)

  • heh

    @8:

    Cry me a fucking river.

    This is a joke, though.

  • I’m a Wee Fanny

    “Our fav Pink Pig is due to have a hearing tomorrow.” – pahaha

    It’s been adjourned … again … 12th December

  • pahaha

    @24

    Ba$tard$… They got nowt have they? And now they are dragging it out…

    Welcome to the UK, 1984.

    Thx fer the update, keep it up m8 :)

  • Jeff

    Said by #5:

    “Clearly these people at FAST think of themselves as some authority figure, when they are, in fact, no such thing. Clearly, many people are mislead into thinking that they are the authority, when such things as their “education” propaganda are spread to the masses.”

    They sound remarkably like WebSheriff, and probably ought to be treated in the same way. Time for FAST to get the Pirate Bay style pwnage they deserve.

  • jacob

    Argh anit-piracy agencies will burn in hell. You wait to we get pro-piracy governments then we will seem some action. I hate those theiving companys that make crappy products and try and force us to buy them. Couldn’t that allso be considered stealing our money. Or if they fine us is that not also stealing. Is stealing not illegal. Don’t raids normally steal stuff. How are raids legal? Is everyone not innocent to proven guilty? So then wouldn’t anti-p2p groups need more evidence than ip adreses. And how do we know they have not fallsafied them. It is easy enough to edit a text file :P. So how can any log they show on a computer prove that i “stole their bad tv shows”? How can the courts trust evidence from those types of groups considering that many of them have been proven to be doing illegal dodgey things? And ISP should just refuse to comply with anti-p2p groups saying that firstly it would be wrong to reveal our customers details and secondly that we do not police the internet and doing so would be considered morraly wrong by us and our customers. I mean OMFG do you get your drivers licence takien of off you just because you where trafficing cocaine arround your country??? Then why the hell is your internet cut off????? And isn’t geting someones telecomunications cut-of also stealing our enjoyment, our happiness, our freedom of speach, our ability to communicate and use a service that many would consider to be as important as eating? How can anti-p2p groups live with themselves?

    And if they can argue that they got my ip adress then why cant I stand up in court and say “mr judge I got their ip adress of them stealing my stuff I put on ThePirateBay but said that no one can download it without my permission. I made it and its mine and its copyrighted. I wish that the mpaa has their internet connection terminated and that they pay me 1 billion million trillion and so on dollars for the thing I would have sold for 1billion dollars each. And that being smart I copyed down their ip adress to a text pad then printed it out” Lol I should do that. And I could quote their methedology and belives in damage done by this and say that because they downloaded my file, I lost 1 unit of sales valued at 1billion dollars for a text document containg the words “fuk u u anti-p2p groups”. Lol i would be set for life. And following the anti-p2p groups evidence techniques maybe I could pull one on them by giving a list of people (possible blured for privay reasons) that witnessed them downloading it from me? Maybe I could sue them for using my name in a legal threat because it is mine and it is copyrighted? Maybe I could sue them for using a pattern of ones and zeros that I had writen down on paper years before pcs where invented that is contained within all their media works (such combinations might consider of “1″ “10″ “01″ “0″ and so on). Maybe I too could say that these units, patterns of 0s are for sale for the most reasonable price of $10 each. I could say that they use these multiple times in each cd of music or whatever. I could say that they have stolen this over 100 billion times from me and i have yet to gain a single sale. Maybe I could get all their buisness and moneys for myself for compensation for stolen customers? I do not understand why governments listen to this bull shit about copying stuff is bad.

  • aquariumfish

    sounds a little daft, another person with big ideas that will come to nothing

    http://www.aquariumfish.me

  • Anonymous

    FAST are nothing more than gangsters who, like many other loosely sanctioned criminals that compose the anti-P2P scene, discovered they could set up an extortion racket by intimidating filesharers/companies with a poor grasp of the law.

    “WHAT? YOU’VE BEEN FILESHARING!? WELL THEN, SIR, YOU HAVE BUT TWO OPTIONS. EITHER BUY THIS EXORBITANTLY EXPENSIVE SOFTWARE AND THESE EXORBITANTLY EXPENSIVE LISCENSES WE’RE SELLING, OR… GO TO JAIL! MUAHAHAHAH!!”

    Honestly, these people are like Scooby Doo villians. They run around scaring people with these elaborate smoke and mirrors, but once you pull the mask off, they’re just these pathetic old farts with all the power to do only two things: jack, and shit.

    That’s why organizations like FAST desperately try to break, bend, sidestep, and rewrite the law every chance they get. But in the grand shceme of things, like all Saturday morning cartoon villians, they ultimately fail.

    Have fun twirling your handelbar mustache and cackling while you can, John Lovelock. If you think it’s hard to bend ISPs to your will now, you ain’t seen NOTHING yet.

  • Anonymous

    piracy sux

  • Anonymous

    Im proud of the ISP’s i wouldnt mind supporting them if they needed any

  • NubCakes

    @28 : jacob said – “I hate those theiving companys that make crappy products and try and force us to buy them. Couldn’t that allso be considered stealing our money. Or if they fine us is that not also stealing. Is stealing not illegal. Don’t raids normally steal stuff. How are raids legal? Is everyone not innocent to proven guilty? So then wouldn’t anti-p2p groups need more evidence than ip adreses. And how do we know they have not fallsafied them. It is easy enough to edit a text file :P.”

    1. OK, no one is forcing you to buy anything you idiot. You make a choice when you hand over your money, the vendor is not forcing you in any way to do this. It is not stealing. Stupid people (like you) buy inferior products.

    2. They are not fining you they are offering out of court settlements which some people are dumb enough to take.

    3. Raids are legal because the complainant has satisfied the relevant authorites that the entity being raided has broked/conspired to break relevant laws.

    4. Yes, people are innocent until proven guily, no they don’t need more evidence. Because it’s EVIDENCE ( jesus you retarded) and doesn’t imply a conviction will occur.

    5. You cannot change your external IP address by editing any file – it is assigned by your ISP and as far as BT the only viable way to change it is to use a VPN tunneling service

    Your entire long winded post comes off like the ramblings of a stoned moron having a lot of trouble working out what’s real and what’s imaginination. If you crapped on like that in real life people would start to gnore you real fast or just tell you to STFU.

    The rest of your post I didn’t quote is similar to the part I quoted – the ramblings of someone who is completely clueless about computers but doesn’t know it and also has trouble sorting out reality and wild imagination.

  • Anonymous

    torrent is for tards

  • Anonymous

    lolol doubt it’s newsworthy but definitely lulzworthy:
    http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ecrans.fr%2FP2P-L-offensive-francaise-contre%2C5616.html&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&sl=fr&tl=en

    France is suing teh internets! Vuze and Limewire are at least corporations you could actually sue if it was illegal anywhere but in France but shareeza?

  • HAGGS

    HAGSS

    Hackers Against Geeks in Snowmobiles Suits

    UPTHERES = UT

    and

    HOw about we start telling people where these people live.

    OPENSOURCE AND FREE SOFTWARE DOESNT NEED FAST

    sourceforge.net forever

  • Roze

    @33
    Wrong. Those raids are damn illegal. They do not go through the legal process correctly, and try to impose their own twisted version of “justice” upon the legal system.

    Roze

  • ‘chelle

    invitees to waffles.fm…? contact the little irish 17 year old sys-admin here- beau@waffles.fm

  • Anonymous

    @28 “I hate those theiving companys that make crappy products and try and force us to buy them. Couldn’t that allso be considered stealing our money.”
    ————————————

    wow.

    just…wow.

    even for a pirate that is some convoluted rationale. so much so, that you may have actually trumped roze in the idiot department. did anyone think that was even possible?

  • voice of reason

    The film industry needs to get its act together by making film downloads available from there own web sites. Charge a sane sensible price and capitalise on this market.
    To try and outlaw it is just madness and doomed to failier.

    We have been at war with drugs in this country for over 50 years. Clearly, as anyone with an ounce of sense can see, it’s a war we haven’t won.

    Sometimes you just have to face the reality of a situation and change the way you view it.
    You will never get rid or piracy in one form or another, no matter now many laws you bring in.

    The advert tells us priracy is stealing! I somethins wonder who’s stealing from who when I buy a DVd for £14.99 and see it a couple of years later for £3.99 at my local supermarket.

  • bob

    What annoys me is that an actor/singer goes to a studio of some sort, for a single period of time to produce their album/movie and then goes home. But, and you’ll love this, they expect to be paid for the next 50 fucking years for doing so. Now, I don’t know about you guys, but if I phoned work tomorrow and said i’m not coming in any more, I don’t think I’d keep receiving paycheques. If the british government does force isps to invade our privacy, it’ll just be time to sign up to ssl’d socks proxying services hosted outside of their grasp, so they can still fuck off.

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