“Saw” Director Explains Why He Was Worried By BitTorrent
Written by enigmax on October 04, 2008TorrentFreak recently ran a story about a movie director’s unique approach to piracy. Now, Darren Bousman, director of Saw II, III and IV, talks to us about his decision to target BitTorrent, the fallout and his dreams, as 10 years of effort comes to fruition with his latest movie, Repo! The Genetic Opera.
On Thursday we reported that the director of the ‘Saw’ sequels was rallying support for a novel way to tackle piracy, by encouraging fans to upload fakes to BitTorrent. The director, Darren Bousman, who admits to not being particularly Internet tech-savvy, was doing his best to protect the soundtrack of his upcoming movie, Repo! The Genetic Opera, from Internet piracy.
The report caused quite a stir, with dedicated Repo! fans, known as the ‘Repo Army’, angry at BitTorrent users for “stealing” their soundtrack (more about why this is so important to them later) and BitTorrent users angry at the Repo! fans for trying to mess up their torrent sites with fakes.
Director Darren Bousman has since told his fans to leave BitTorrent alone, and there even some torrent users having friendly chats on the Repo! forums now. To see things from ‘the other side’, we caught up with Darren to find out exactly why this soundtrack is so important to the Repo! fans.
TF: Please introduce yourself to the TorrentFreak readers.
dlb: Most of you know me from the SAW films. But long before SAW I was directing this little stage play called Repo! The Genetic Opera. It was the first thing I ever read that spoke to me. I have been fighting to get it made [as a movie] ever since. It’s been a long long road – and only now, after the success of three SAW films am I able to get Repo! off the ground.
TF: What makes it so different to your previous work?
dlb: Repo! to me was about doing something completely different. I had directed three sequels. I am proud of the SAW films, but I wanted to do something unique. Repo! is that. A lot of people will hate Repo!, a lot will love it. I will admit it’s polarizing. But I wouldn’t have it any other way. Repo! is so different than SAW in every single aspect. I hope people give it a chance, and don’t prejudge it because of certain cast members they may dislike, or on the mere fact people ’sing’ in it.
TF: You’ve gone on record saying that you feel very protective of the movie, as if watching over a child’s first day at school, and that’s understandable. The actual movie comes out on November 7th, however, you asked the fans to concentrate on ‘protecting’ the soundtrack instead. Could you explain why this soundtrack is so crucial to you, your fans and the upcoming movie?
dlb: I am not some muti-millionaire – and sales of this album will affect me personally. I have been begging and pleading to get this movie made since 2001. I have fought, burned bridges, sacrificed relationships, and even ended relationships all based on Repo! Why? Because I believe in the project so much. I put all my resources into making this movie. However through the entire course of making it I was told IT WOULDN’T work, that there wasn’t an audience for this. I have been met with constant opposition. At one point there was talk of not even releasing a soundtrack. I fought, screamed and fought some more to get this small release we have – on Amazon, iTunes and other downloadable sites. This was a way to gauge the interest in the film. I did this to show all the nay-sayers LOOK at our numbers. Look at the reactions.
TF: You told Alternative Film Guide that Repo! was so weird, out of the box, and avant garde that people didn’t know what to make of it. It sounds like getting people outside the mainstream familiar with the movie might be a challenge. How would you feel if thousands downloaded this soundtrack for free via BitTorrent but a proportion of those loved it and turned up at the theater as a paying customer?
dlb: I wish it worked like this but for this film it doesn’t. That’s why I had the reaction I did when I heard it was being downloaded for free. The release of Repo! is only in 6 theaters. SIX THEATERS. Even if I sold out EVERY single show – in every single city – for the entire run, it still wouldn’t make the money it needs to make. Sales of the soundtrack are the only way to prove if this film registered with fans. Our hope was – the sales would be so good on the soundtrack – we would get more theaters. More screens, more showing. Repo! will not be in the majority of cities, or countries. Its only in three cities. THREE CITIES. This album was our way of showing those in charge there is an audience for this.
TF: Could you tell us about your hugely dedicated fans, the ‘Repo! Army’ ?
dlb: These are the greatest fans I have ever come across – the most loyal people I think I will ever meet. These people weren’t hired by me. They found Repo! A good portion of the Repo! Army has seen the movie through various festivals. And the movie spoke to them. Since I don’t have the support of most movies – I turn to them to help spread the word. I never realized how passionate they were until recently when they turned out in droves to Austin Texas to see a screening of Repo! They are as passionate about Repo! as your users are about file sharing.
TF: Of course, BitTorrent fans can spread the word for you too. An interesting group have been vocal in emails to TorrentFreak – the Repo! fans who are also BitTorrent users. Are you surprised that some of your fans in the ‘Repo Army’ are buying your material with a passion, yet appear to be using BitTorrent too?
dlb: No, not at all. I am sure tons of people use these sites. The sad fact with Repo! is that every person who purchases the album for $9.99 is making a big statement. And these statements are going to be be the difference between Repo! playing in six theaters, or seven. To the mass population this will seem trivial – but for us, who have very little support or marketing. One paid download is huge.
TF: Thanks for speaking with us Darren, and we wish you well with the movie.
The brief storm that blew up between the opposing groups has largely died down now, after being dampened by Darren’s request to his fans to stop actions against torrents. After much correspondence with Darren it seems clear to us that he never really intended to hurt BitTorrent, but acted passionately in his role as the ‘protective father’ of the movie, not as some greedy corporate fat cat.
Darren told TorrentFreak that he was sorry that his actions offended some BitTorrent users, adding “Just understand, we are not the studio system. We are not the major corporation. We are a group of people who have been fighting to get something made only to see it released in just 6 theaters.”
It’s not hard to see why this movie and its soundtrack has raised such passions, when years of planning, investment and dreams rest on the success of such a small release window. However, in the absence of a huge marketing investment by Lions Gate, the movie will live or die by word of mouth and magnitude of Internet ‘buzz’.
Big named movies and albums gain less from the publicity offered by piracy than smaller productions desperate for exposure, so at least on the surface, Repo! seems an ideal candidate to benefit. It will be interesting to see how much success this movie gets, and if the piracy situation mirrors that. Hopefully, if the Repo! soundtrack does get downloaded a lot – and loved – those six theaters will be full and extended to more, which can’t fail to boost January’s DVD release.
Of course, when you rely on companies like Lions Gate to get even 6 theaters, admitting that piracy might help isn’t going to go down too well.
Previously: Judge Spanks Insatiable Gay Porn Pirate
Next: News Site Criticized for Linking to Pirate Bay Torrents
67 Responses
Interesting…
I understand what he is saying, and I really hope that the movie gets successful. This overrides my negative view of them after the fans came on with their “SHRING IS RLY ACTULLY STELLING” mantra.
He did get a lot of buzz through his initial statement, although part of that might backfire into a “imma download this cuz hes an ass” unless the word is spread about his actual position on it. The internet might be a pile of shit, but it’s a likeable pile of shit that can turn out huge numbers of support if the cause is right.
whether he meant it or not, apologizing now was very smart. No one director needs the pirate groups pissed at them.
Anyway, I downloaded the soundtrack, loved it, and yes, I am now going to go out and buy it because I know it’s a small production and I wanna show my support. That’s the way it has to work nowadays, sorry Darren.
Doesn’t really tell us anything new though, does it? He basically dismisses the whole “Try before you buy” phenomenon as not working for this film in particular, utterly discounting the possibility that anyone could go out and buy the soundtrack based on a BT download
looks like another blinkered studio guy trying to save face after being caught out, tbh
I agree with him. I actually feel bad. Going to buy it now. I just did some searching. They really are fucking the film.
Any publicity is good publicity for a production like this. A torrent of the soundtrack will help get the word out. He could even release an official one with instructions on how people can help get the film shown in their local cinema. Petition link, link to amazon etc. I mean it’s already out there, why not get something out of it. Pirates have money too, they just don’t like wasting it.
I think his argumentation is quite flawed. For a non-mainstream project like this that already experienced all the hurdles and hoops of the business distribution and fan cult from the net is probably THE most important source of revenue. Sure you won’t be able to make money off off it this way. Six theatres? Why not a couple thousand downloads that in turn then maybe buy T-Shirts and Posters and all that merchandising stuff. This is the way to go if you have a small window of opportunity. The major studios only do it because it’s “additional” revenue since they practically own the box office.
If you have no box office the dumbest thing you could do was to try it in three different places that are bound to fail and do nothing else. I would have pumped that Soundtrack out for free, online, with a teaser for a lottery for all the people that manage to buy tickets for the screenings. Anyone else could watch the movie streamed or buy the DVD rightaway. Sounds more feasible to me than “upload fake stuff so the people won’t steal the soundtrack of a movie nobody but four and a half theatres worth of people will ever see”.
About the movie: Interesting take on the future of organ donation.
Also; I think Hannibal would have loved a repo-job like that. If he was hungry, he could always grab a ’snack’ along with the organs he reposessed, nobody would notice or even care.
I’m not going to pay for this… I don’t pay for anything regardless of how much I like it.
Hmm… Doesn’t look like something i’d be interested in. I wouldn’t be paying for this soundtrack, just in case I may like it. The movie just looks weird. Either way, via torrenters, he’s getting the exposure he could have only dreamed of before.
Welcome to the potential market.
Increase your profits sevenfold.
If its of any help, after reading about the online war.. holy crap.. I downloaded it, liked it, decided that he does really need the help, and bought that shit.
Im passing it around to my friends (Yes for free) and telling them the same thing, buy this shit if you want to support it.
If the movie is good am buying the dvd easy as that!
He’s rather full of himself thinking anyone knows who he is or cares about what he’s done to preemptively announce his work WILL BE PIRATED and he needs to act in advance – this sounds like a publicity stunt. SAW = Share And Weep?
Has anyone noticed that the pirate bay torrent for the soundtrack has somehow disappeared?
Its still being tracked by there tracker but the torrent itself is gone.
Yeah, one of the Repo! fans convinced the torrent uploader to take it down, and because it’s still being tracked it can’t be re-upped. Someone could recreate it from scratch, I suppose.
SO ITS A MUSICAL EH?….
I WILL NOT GET CAUGHT FOR DOWNLOADING.
SO WHY SHOULD I GIVE A FUCK?
I WOULDNT OF DL’D IT ANYWAY.
SOUNDS LIKE A HEAP OF SHIT MUSICAL WITH NO MONEY BEHIND IT. :)
AND IF ITS ONLY SHOWIN IN 6 PLACES, ISNT THAT MORE OF A REASON TO ‘SHARE’ IT?
TO DARREN BOUSMAN…FUCK YOU!
IMMA USE MY FIVE EURO TO BUY A SHELL INSTEAD :)
CATCH ME NOW , FUCKER
bittorrent is for newbz
Reason why the torrent disappeared from TPB:
http://www.repo-opera.com/board/viewtopic.php?f=92&t=2174
now that i know that bousman is fighting “the man,” i feel more sympathetic toward his cause. i downloaded the album and really took to it. fuck it — it’s 9 bucks. i’ll buy it. i kinda feel bad now for spamming amazon… til next time, folks.
This idiot has got recognition from buying into a franchise from the start just so he could get his pathetic film & soundtrack made
“I am not some muti-millionaire – and sales of this album will affect me personally. I have been begging and pleading to get this movie made since 2001. I have fought, burned bridges, sacrificed relationships, and even ended relationships all based on Repo!”
Welcome to reality, welcome to the internet. Come and think outside the box, we’re all out here, waiting for a change.
@ #4 and #7,
I agree. He’s mistaken.
Has he not heard of the Rocky Horror Picture Show? What about the Grateful Dead? The Dead only had 100,000 hardcore fans. The Dead also encouraged taping of every one of their shows.
The director is acting out of fear, which is no way to go in this day and age. You have to embrace the free marketing/distribution tool known as the Torrent Swarm. If your movie is only in six theaters, you should be glad as hell that torrents exist. Torrents are the most effective form of advertising he could wish for. What is he going to do, rely on a MySpace page? Now THAT would be a joke.
Its not about that I fear. The issue is a sole director fighting a big studio. No one knows how to market the movie. The repo team is counting on word of mouth to sell the record and thus prove their worth in more theaters. Its a bad Catch 22 – because downloading the album in this case works against the cause. It’s not as if a ton of pirate downloads helps. However without the downloads people wouldn’t know of the movie. So I guess the hope is pirates download it, and like it, they go back in pay for it?
Repo.The.Genetic.Opera.DVDRiP.XViD-VOMiT
Haha. Sure, now he has attention, but the ONLY musical I will ever like is Sweeney Todd. The End.
Well… if a movie is AWESOME, like the Dark Knight, for example, I’ll of course buy the DVD/Blu-Ray without hesitation. But… yeah. Maybe once this movie is ripped, THEN maybe someone will buy the DVD. Maybe… xD
Why show things to the “guys in charge”? It makes no sense. Popular culture is not about avant garde. As long as copyright is there, it shall always be about more of the same. In order to truly have a culture with avant garde, the “people in charge” need to go down – and that requires a change in copyright law. I don’t think that any culture that bases popularity on “sales of CDs” can be conducive at all to any alternative film.
Roze
http://www.28chan.org/fs/
I thought Musical were just shit until i saw Sweeney Todd . If its Like That .. I might like it .
If He Cant Distribute The Movie , He Needs To Put a Torrent File On his Site of the Movie For A Price .
Welcome To Internet , t3h biggest marketplace.
What are the six theaters? I’m guessing Mark Cuban’s Landmark chain.
I intend to catch the film when it comes out. It has to be interesting.
If it’s at the Sunshine in NYC ( our landmark chain member ) it would be great. That’s a great place to see films.
i know it is in new york and la but its also going on the road two
http://www.reporoadtour.com
I might give his film the benefit of the doubt and check it out, but it has Paris Hilton in it. End of story.
Commendable but unfortunately still a bit misguided. Bit torrent, is in this case, exactly how you want to spread the word or market said work. In fact, he should send it up the pipe himself.
J.
Avant Garde my ass. This has been done before. The soundtrack is a cross between bad goth dance music and an evanescence song. Nothing exciting or new about it. And the idea of a “spooky sci fi fantasy rock opera” has been done before. Watch Rocky Horror Picture Show, or Sweeny Todd. And in my opinion these were superior productions.
Look if all this guy cared about was getting as many people to see his film as possible, he would have embraced piracy as a way to advertise for the movie. We all know that if people download the soundtrack and they really like it, they will watch the movie. This guy doesn’t care about the movie. He cares about the money, and that’s why he freaked out. The only reason he called off his army was because he saw the negative press that we filesharers could generate.
Did you read the post. Its only in six theatres. How can people see it if its not showing. The soundtrack is a means to open it further.
saw I was awesome. saw II, III, and IV fucking sucked satan’s nutsack. this guy is a douche.
“…Darren Bousman, director of Saw II, III and IV…”
He doesn’t deserve a cent since he were a big studio whore for as long as it took for him to get funding for his “masterpiece”.
@6 My criticism is based on the soundtrack, which I downloaded after I read the article. And it sucked.
Not to mention, I can also figure out the story from hearing the music. It’s an opera. The story is lame.
Perhaps the visuals are avant garde, but from the look of the trailer, its nothing new.
I’m having second opinions, unfortunately. The songs aren’t that bad… they’re rock, after all. I dunno. Maybe a download. Maybe…
Okay, so he overreacted. This is a PERFECT opportunity to show how torrents can boost word of mouth and sales.
WHEN you see a copy of the DVDRip out there, please consider tagging it as iNDY to let people know its an independent film and needs support.
I saw the iNDY tag on “We Are The Strange” last year (and bought the DVD direct from the dude’s website) and thought it was a great way to show respect and encouragement.
You can’t have alternative culture by trying to “impress the big guys.” True alternative culture is in P2P.
So the songs aren’t for you thats very fair. I however really like them, and this movie does speak to me. To each his own, I know a lot of people don’t like ROCKY HORROR, but I know a TON that do.
Like they have always said, some will hate this movie, others will love it.
I agree with the director.
This seems to be a seriously small release where in this case file sharing could actually hurt him.
I’m all about file sharing, and have no problem sharing big studio movies but this one just seems wrong. It’s the difference between stealing from a Virgin Megastore and a small mom and pop store in a small town.
To be honest, I wouldn’t mind paying writers/directors directly for their creations, rather than having most of it soaked up by corporate companies.
@NastyBedazzler
he doesnt have big company supporting him in advertising and anything. he has bunch of devoted fans who spread the news person by person.they did some, but apparently, not enough.
This audio on the other hand, by getting on TF, got huge advertising.
Hundreds and hundreds of thousands people have read about it now.
Respect to repo “army” but their efforts look just funny compared to this.
bottom line: if you dont have money for big advertising, is it really so bad that people who never heard of it download that soundtrack? that is also a question for you, NastyBedazzler.
and also, if you dont have big promotion, MAYBE giving an album to download for free, with links where to buy it legally, could have great impact on movie stats and publicity.
just think about it.
There was a film out in the 1970’s that no cinema wanted to show. The cinema managers would not take a gamble at showing it and risking losing revenue, when they could put a more ‘crowd pleasing’ picture in it’s place.
The movie studio had to do something VERY illegal to get the cinemas to try it out… they said ‘if you don’t take this film, we won’t let you show our next movie’ (which they knew was highly anticipated, as it was based on a best-selling book).
Even so… the movie still had a limited release in the cinemas, but fortunately it built a fan base very quickly and became the first ’summer blockbuster’.
The movie that the cinema managers did not want to take a chance on was STAR WARS!
Like most of you, I was upset by Darren’s initial comments and actions, but I have learned to look at both sides before ‘jumping to any conclusions’.
I wish him every luck in getting his movie shown in more cinemas and I hope he does not have to wait years for it to become a cult classic (like Rocky Horror had to).
Now, I’m off to do the timewarp again…
I use Torrents a lot, if there’s something I might be interested in I’ll grab a torrent, have a listen then if I do like it I’ll buy it, if not the torrent gets trashed & I never think about it again.
I bought a copy of the full soundtrack & I won’t lie I am the person who uploaded it to Demonoid, after reading this I’ve taken down the torrent, do I feel guilty about sharing it? No, I do hope that a few of the people who downloaded it from me will like it enough to go buy it & spread the word that it is something worth paying for.
I truly believe that torrent sites are the way of the future for the film & music industry if they would only just sit & think about it some more instead of trying to kill it all through their own misguided fear.
I sincerely hope that Repo! gets a wider distribution than just a few cinemas, I WANT to see this film on a Huge screen & will pay to see it.
Darren Bousman should hope that Opera will be shared a lot in the various file sharing networks – cause if that happens – he for sure will make it a success in the RT world as well
At the other hand – if only a few bother – his opera will probably never be a commercial success either!
Darren Bousman should look at the facts rather then depend on his believes. – Those songs – TV-shows – movies – games which are shared the most are also the most successful in the commercial world and vice versa
Everyone is missing the point; REPO haa all the odds stacked against them. REPO has a very limited window of success. The soundtrack sales were the hope to widen the release and dvd units. This is not like most films. Not saying I agree or disagree with either side. But their only chance is purchased downloads.
The Saw series sucks anyways so I dont see why he cares.
http://www.privacy-center.ru.tc
Sorry, but if Repo is like anything in the past that this guy directed…it will be awful.
The guy is a hack.
For a hack. He has turned out quite the box office. #51 what have you done?
Meh…
Soundtracks alright.
Not great.
Thank god I didn’t fork over any money for it.
Perhaps being foreclosed on right now. How can anyone in the US waste their money on shit like this?
Seriously why would he take the torrent down..
I understand that we have come to peace with Repo, but thats no reason to take the torrent down.. lol. Everything needs to be shared regardless.
I tried a re-up on TPB but as they’re still tracking it, it can’t be put up again
here in Spain in SITGES film festival the REPo the genetic opera preview of yesterday, was canceled by order of the company arguing that is a high RISC of piracy the movie or the ost, in the preview
it was a little scandan here, because they cancel the preview with the room full of press
sorry i only find info in spanish
http://www.publico.es/culturas/cine/161477/cancela/sitges/pase/pelicula/miedo/pirateria
here in Sitges too. It was shown at one AM. It was canceled by the festival after another screening right before it someone was caught taping.
Why would anyone bother camming a small-scale screening of a limited-release movie like that? FAR safer to wait for the DVD release and just rip that.
That’s like trying to CAM a movie at Cannes, just retarded.
BAAAWWWWING in advance over (possible) $ = Epic Fail.
yeah, I feel kinda bad for the guy aswell. I mean they over-promote some horrible overbudget movie like Tranformers (which was based on a toy not an original idea) but somone who actually puts his heart into making somthing “different” they don’t even give him a chance of it succeeding.
He should send his army to attack some corrupt movie studio since they are the ones who killed this movie not us.
I wish him well, and might actually buy this on itunes (yes some pirates do give something back every once and a while).
“I’m not going to pay for this… I don’t pay for anything regardless of how much I like it.”
You, sir, are an ass.
Saw>saw 2 3 n 4 multiplied by each other amirite?
Saw 4 n 3 where horrible and frankly having payed to see them i demand my monies back in Ugandan dollars.
“At one point there was talk of not even releasing a soundtrack. I fought, screamed and fought some more to get this small release we have – on Amazon, iTunes and other downloadable sites. This was a way to gauge the interest in the film. I did this to show all the nay-sayers LOOK at our numbers.”
If you wanted to show interest show how many people downloaded it, just like the authors who released their books to thepiratebay and watched their sales rise, don’t try fucking up our torrent sites because of some assbag followers want to keep it out of our hands.
You can’t really scapegoat people who download the soundtrack. How is anyone supposed to be interested in purchasing the soundtrack if they can’t even see the movie?
A soundtrack for a movie that tens of thousands of people saw is not going to generate ten million sales, i’m sorry to say.
What needs to be done is get as many people as possible to see the movie and it will build an enourmous fanbase on its own, even if the subject matter is obscure.
This “buy the soundtrack first if you want to watch the movie” plan sounds a litte silly and unfeasible.
I wonder how you get 10 million people to see a movie that is only in 3 cities, hmmmm…
I had tickets for the session that was cancelled. We were treated as if we were a nasty bunch of thieves and pirates, so I WON’T PAY to watch that movie. I’ll simply wait until someone upload it. That’s the only thing the autor deserves.
So you were treated as if you were a thief, so now you’re going to steal?
Wow, you sure proved them wrong. Great logic you have going there. Good thing they didn’t treat you like a murderer or rapist.
<>
I would never have really known about saw if my mate hadn't bit torrented it, I have now bought all of them, so piracy helped spread the word of saw, if suddenly instead of 6 cinemas, what would happen if Repo was been played on 100,000 + TV's?? mighr just raise some awareness me thinks…
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