Swedish Politicians Strike Blows at Copyright Lobby
Written by Ben Jones on January 10, 2008Last week, seven Swedish MPs wrote to a prominent Swedish tabloid newspaper ‘Expressen’ to express their dissatisfaction with proposals for dealing with copyright infringers. Now, that number has increased to 13, and the issue seems to keep growing.
Initially, Karl Sigfrid, and 6 other MPs [Members of Parliament] wrote to Expressen (Swedish, English) to express their opposition to a plan proposed by Cecilia Renfors, a copyright analyst appointed by the Swedish government, in what Expressen called “Seven MPs defy the party line: Legalizing file sharing is not just the best solution, but the only solution”. Her plan was that ISPs would close down the connections of filesharers, preventing them from participating in any further copyright infringement. The condemnation for this was broad-based, from the Data inspection Board, the Competition Authority, all the way to the Swedish court of Appeal.
The message from the Moderate Party MPs to their AntipiratbyrÃ¥n supporting colleagues was “be careful, they will never be satisfied”, drawing parallels to the earlier attempts to ban MP3 players, and VCRs, both areas in which, having failed to ban, industry groups are now making a profit from selling content.
Karl Sigfrid told TorrentFreak that the APB proposals make no practical sense. “I think it could be solved in theory. However, in reality, you would need such a surveillance system to achieve this that it would be all out of proportion. So I don’t think there’s a feasilbe way of stopping individuals copying. The cause for file sharing is basically that it’s possible. People have always done it to the extent that they’ve been able to. With cassette tapes 20 years ago and electronically today. Copyright laws preventing individuals from sharing information have never been legitimate in the eyes of most people.”
When asked about if it was down to content industries being slow to change their business practices, he replied: “It’s hard to say what would have happened if the content industries had been quicker releasing their material online, before the P2P networks grew mainstream. Probably the illegal filesharing would be less extensive, but it’s possible that it would still have been increasingly difficult for iTunes and such services to compete with free downloading. The change needed might be so radical that it’s no longer about selling copies of immaterial products at all.”
Rickard Falkvinge, of the Swedish Pirate Party was understandably upbeat about it. “Karl Sigfrid’s taking a stand marks a major turning point. For the first time, an established politician shows deep-down understanding of the real conflict, instead of cluelessly humming along with a technophobical luddite industry. Some other Swedish mainstream politicians have previously talked in terms of how it’s unreasonable to declare war on an entire generation. Sigfrid is the first to understand why.” His enthusiasm is understandable as, one Swedish torrent user put it “a bunch of members of The Conservative Party have started listening to the policies of The Pirate Party, and they want to jump on their bandwagon, as it’s gaining popularity”.
Gaining popularity it is, as yesterday, thirteen members of Parliament joined in another attack (Swedish only, no English translation at present) on the likes of the APB, and recording industries, saying “The record labels are obviously opposed to a development that makes them obsolete.” However, not everyone has been celebrating. Pirate Bay administrator Brokep was skeptical, saying “I’m intrigued that the debate is sparking up again. There’s been a lot of lies from the politicians. Promises and nothing has happened, so at least this will put the debate back on the map.”
The initial seven MPs were Karl Sigfrid. Margareta Cederfelt. Ulf Berg. Lena Asplund. Staffan Appelros. Lisbeth Grönfeldt Bergman and Göran Montan. Tuesdays additions were Marie Weibull Kornias,Finn Bengtsson, Ann-Charlotte Hammar Johnsson, Sven Yngve Persson, and Anders Hansson.
**UPDATE**Â Sorry, forgot to add this translation of the second piece, available here
Previously: Download from BitTorrent and Usenet with Your Web Server
Next: UK BitTorrent Users Under More Pressure From Lawyers
125 Responses
bahahaha theyll turn into China.
Lets ban everything.
Cause everyones CopyRightIn….Dirty lol
Embrace the Technology
but hey theyre pollys
theyre unpopular anyways
or as the Simpsons would say;
Lisa: The second amendment is just a remnant from revolutionary periods, it has no real meaning today
Homer: You couldn’t be more wrong Lisa. If I didn’t have this gun the King of England could just come in here and start pushing you around. Do you want that, well do ya?
Honestly, I really dont care what pollys think…
they cry lots anyways
but if the KOE put a massive lock on my internet connection
Id get a LITTLE TICKED off
Barack Obama 08′ for FreedomonTheNet
I hope these politics keep up the fight and not budging from this, that has happen to many times here in Sweden.
hopefully they will work this out. banning is not an option, and i dont think they’ll go that far. people arent known for being idiots in sweden, in general. not even politicians. most of them still think the way they did during the time the earth only had ferns living on it. but that will hopefully change.
hope they dont listen to much to the american government. that would sucks!
[quote comment="259615"]bahahaha theyll turn into China.
[/quote]
And yet it is the US of A we see taking the most inane actions against “copyright” infringement.
Maybe Simpsons should tell you to get your own head outta your ass first and then talk.
Lol.
This is awesome, politicians in sweden seem to actualy see beyond industry lies and propaganda.
It looks promising, however we all know how things can change…
Im sure they all will be bribed very soon..
No no anon, politicians can’t see those things. It’s just that they hate America.
Why is it you guys blame all this on America?
I think it’s stupid to say that. Seeing how they exist all over the world!
So put your country [HERE]. I blame it on [HERE].
You guys make it sound like there is a closed curtain at the white house with a sign saying [Secret Movie World Domination Here]
Never mind that person behind the curtain. It’s just George Bush whipping his A$$ on more religious belief’s.
He’ll be out of office soon.
And forgive the U.S.A for wanting to defend their country. It’s not like anybody died for it.
Let me think about my life here for a second……
…
……
..
.
G.A.G.
Anonymous@7, we blame the USA because we have seen (and felt) most of the pressure to clamp down on copyright infringement coming from the USA, often in ways which make us furious. Keep in mind that the US has a vested interest in tight copy controls since the entertainment industry is a major exporter.
Let’s hope that these aren’t just empty words. The more populare TPB gets, the more voters for politicians supporting TPBs doings. But it’s definitely a step in the right direction and also promising. We in germany are far from an understanding like that.
Its time for the content industry to realize that times change and the more they fight it the more obsolete they become.
I have translated the new article from
Expressen. Sorry for all misspellings and all D:
http://deathcoil.net/expressen-moderater.html
And Cheers to Torrentfreak
lol they have all watched stealthisfilm2, and dows now understand how stupid they are
That’s very cool news. As a USAmerican, I hope this newfound understanding can cross national borders as well.
[quote comment="259694"]Why is it you guys blame all this on America?
I think it’s stupid to say that. Seeing how they exist all over the world!
So put your country [HERE]. I blame it on [HERE].
You guys make it sound like there is a closed curtain at the white house with a sign saying [Secret Movie World Domination Here]
Never mind that person behind the curtain. It’s just George Bush whipping his A$$ on more religious belief’s.
He’ll be out of office soon.
And forgive the U.S.A for wanting to defend their country. It’s not like anybody died for it.
Let me think about my life here for a second……
…
……
..
.
G.A.G.[/quote]
Move out of your Amerifreedomghetto for a year and see it the other way for a bit. We can’t really be blamed for what we feel.
@7
why do we blame america, hhhmmmmmmm, good question.
1. it was AMERICA that put pressure on the swedish government so they would raid the pirate bay servers.
2. AMERICA is CONSTANTLY thinking it is the sheriff of the world and point #1 is one of hundreds of examples.
3. AMERICAn MPAA and RIAA are ALWAYS bitching about copyright laws in OTHER countries. get your own backyard sorted first, THEN come to mine.
4. the world in general is SICK AND TIRED of AMERICA thinking they can exert their power over everyone else . reminds me of a grade 4 bully but then they eventually get their ass kicked :)
sorry to group all americans in that rant as i know not everyone is like that or supports it. but seriously, generalizations are ALWAYS there for a good and valid reason.
ps AMERICA - your laws STOP at YOUR border.
You dorks have no idea how stupid you sound. You steal from American musicians and then bitch like little girls when they want to stop you. What exactly do think is going to happen? Bands are going to spend a lot of money on recording, touring and promotion so you can steal their work? That they’ll make records out of sheer goodness of their heart just to entertain you for free? Here’s a heads up: You’re wrong, and likely mentally disturbed:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissistic_personality_disorder
Ever considered that they earn ALOT of money on touring?
The average artist get like, what? 1-2usd per sold album at the most. If they would publish them on the internet like Radiohead they would most likley be able to earn more money in total.
Radiohead just put their album out for sale, Einstein.
And you don’t know jackshit about bands and touring. Bands don’t make DICK touring unless they’re already huge. Bands tour to PROMOTE and SELL their albums.
Now go see a shrink.
@15: Best PS ever seen!
@16: you have not carefully read @15.
Key point: my law stops at my border, as your law stops at your border. Is that not correct?
@18:
Can you quote some sources to back up this statement that bands don’t make much money touring, and that they do it only to promote and sell albums?
I’ve seen that claim before, made by anonymous/pseudonymous people on internet debates, but I have also heard actual BAND MEMBERS say the opposite, many times.
For example, John Vanderslice, who I talked to after a show, said that he and his band mostly live off merch sales at concerts. In a 2005 interview (http://www.sctas.com/21/JV.html), he says, “I love file sharing to be honest. I don’t think it effects [sic] record sales (it seems to help me) and I think the goodwill has to be a good thing.”
Maybe he’s the exception to the rule, but I don’t think so. As for the REALLY small bands, they’re making no money period, are lucky to break even on CD releases, and still have day jobs for that reason — and it’s not because of internet piracy. (I know a lot of artists like this.)
I work in this business, and I see it first-hand. John Vanderslice makes his money producing.
None of this matters really, as there is going to be an ISP music fee, and people will have unlimited free downloads, thus rendering pirate sites passe.
@15
That was the stupidest post I’ve ever read.
You really have problems. Get your facts right before you tear apart a nation which you have no understanding of.
I don’t think that as much as everyone would want to that they can blame it on the U.S. by it’s self. You have to remember that regardless of the country as long as there’s big business they’ll want to earn as much money as possible. If something like pirating is preventing the big business’ from making as much money as they want then they’ll go after it. Besides other companies in other countries have tried to curtail pirating also, though needless to say not to the extent that the U.S. has. Just wait until a new generation gets into the governments around the world that are used to pirating and grew up with it then we’ll truly see what will happen.
@23 LOL. “yeah man, there’s gonna be a pirate in the white house someday!”
You have NPD. Go get yourself some help.
in the end notting will get done
thats politics for you
its just all talk and no action
The “pirate hunter” organisations are funded and backed by huge American corporations and their lawyers and politicians.
It’s no wonder that Swedes get angry when a foreign power tries to force them into becoming a police state.
American power should rule America, not Sweden.
Seven MPs are outright opposed to the mafIAA measures.
How many MPs are there total in the Swedish House of MPs?
349 from all parties.
13 for freedom is a start.
349 total from all parties.
13 for freedom is a start.
A follow up article poublished in the same newspaper Expressen:
“This is our second article in Expressen. It’s a response to the Swedish Academy’s secretary Horace Engdahl, who has strongly opposes decriminalizing file sharing. 13 Moderate-Party parliamentarians signed the article.”
http://sigfrid.wordpress.com/2008/01/10/horace-engdahl-pushes-for-internet-control/
What strikes me is how young the guy is in the photo. Normally politicians are over 60 in most countries.
@31:
The average age for Swedish MPs is currently somewhere just below 50 years (this page says 47.9 at the last election in September 2006: http://www.riksdagen.se/templates/R_PageFull____11296.aspx).
Having a majority of your legislators above 60 sounds like a bad idea. Someone who is actually going to live in the country for more than one or two decades is probably more inclined to care about making sane laws.
Average age is 47 ? Wow.. No wonder Sweden leads the world in being more modern in their thinking.
gay pirate faggets behind ur pc monitor acting tuff
I think America needs to decriminalize marijuana.
[quote comment="259942"]@23 LOL. “yeah man, there’s gonna be a pirate in the white house someday!”
better than a religious nut who thinks he is god and orders his troops to blindly commit genocide.
[quote comment="259889"]You dorks have no idea how stupid you sound.
always posting with the name Anonymous, or unkown or some dumb crap
You steal from American musicians like brittany spears, a whore who has had more wangs in her than a chinesse phone book,
or like countless others fresh out of rehab same day sucking dick for coke.
[/quote]
yes we must have
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissistic_personality_disorder
if we like that crap they trying to shove down our throats
[quote comment="260150"][quote comment="259942"]@23 LOL. “yeah man, there’s gonna be a pirate in the white house someday!”
better than a religious nut who thinks he is god and orders his troops to blindly commit genocide.
[quote comment="259889"]You dorks have no idea how stupid you sound.
always posting with the name Anonymous, or unkown or some dumb crap
You steal from American musicians like brittany spears, a whore who has had more wangs in her than a chinesse phone book,
or like countless others fresh out of rehab same day sucking dick for coke.
[/quote]
yes we must have
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissistic_personality_disorder
if we like that crap they trying to shove down our throats[/quote]
lkhjl
whatever you say, big man… with NPD.
@21:
The day there is a music ISP fee, moviemakers, publishers and everybody else is going to jump on the new public taxation and want a slice of the pie.
Therefore, no, there will be no music ISP fee.
@21, again:
The assumption that a music ISP fee will solve the problem is based on a number of bad assumptions, of which I will pick but two:
1) Music is the most desired content on file sharing networks. I don’t know ANYBODY who cares about downloading music anymore. Music is just ubiquitous, off and on line.
2) File sharing anything larger than music is impractical from a bandwidth standpoint anyway. Well, maybe that’s true in North America, but not in places like South Korea or Sweden. Here, a movie takes 5-7 minutes to download if you get a good pipe - in fact, the bottleneck is all too frequently the local household router, which can only pump 20-30 Mbit/s. I have a 100/100 Mbit connection, and that’s not something you’d raise an eyebrow about in Sweden.
U.S.A. = 3rd world.
Their pipes are so slow it’s painful downloading…
100/100 Mbit connection
Most likely no set MB limits either.
Un Farking believable.
I get a 10GB limit per month then capped to dial-up speeds. Pathetic.
Sweden is the place to be if you want to live in a modern forward thinking country.
the next president of US would be black, after that it would be pirate
[quote comment="260188"]U.S.A. = 3rd world.
Their pipes are so slow it’s painful downloading…[/quote]
so go for a walk, play a game visit with friends enjoy life :)
The worst assumption the music ISP fee is based on is that some central authority can gauge what music is popular and distribute the money fairly. Nothing could be further from the truth.
Here’s a neat variation on the idea. Say Last.fm offers a service where you can subscribe for your choice of $5, $10, $20, or $50 a month — or the SEK equivalent or whatever ;) Half that money goes to bands/artists based on how much you listened to their tracks that month. Only tracks that Last.fm is allowed to give free downloads of (at least to subscribers) count towards this. And for subscribers, the downloads are higher quality than the current (Jan. 2007) 128k MP3s, perhaps even going to lossless for those that want it.
If Last.fm themselves won’t do this, anyone could start a competing service that does.
@43: Wouldn’t work, people would still steal.
Whether anyone likes it or not, there is going to be a music ISP fee.
Hey,
I’m an author, I want an Authors ISP fee added also.
I will fight with all other Authors for this right also. It’s not just Music that gets downloaded.!
[quote comment="260243"]@43: Wouldn’t work, people would still steal.
Whether anyone likes it or not, there is going to be a music ISP fee.[/quote]
your right it wouldn’t work, neither will the isp fee
we run the world not you we will do what we want and you cannot stop us
“People would still steal” isn’t a problem to be solved. It’s the natural consequence of being able to share information for free, and it should be celebrated for the opportunities it brings.
Brokep wrote a great summary last month of why a “music ISP fee” is unacceptable, though it seemed to go mostly ignored. Read it.
http://blog.brokep.com/2007/12/06/the-problems-with-a-flatrate-system/
Hey.. did the RIAA ever find the music that was stolen?
remove copyright laws for digital content and people cant “steal” not be pirates.
problem solved, industry adapts everyones happy except the parasites.
1) I personally don’t see an ISP fee working out, especially due to the point brought up earlier- if an ISP can do that, would they not get sued by music corporations until they get some portion of the money?
think of it this way: some mass-producing music pirates work in the same way. by making the buyer pay only a fraction of the regular cost of the original album, he earns money off someone else’s work. Would not the ISP’s be technically doing the same thing by charging people even a low rate for something they don’t have permission to sell? Unless the ISP’s suddenly sign deals with record companies for their portion of the return, I don’t see it as feasible.
2) @24, Maybe you should get yourself checked out before saying everyone else around you has some sort of mental disorder (such as NPD). It makes you sound schizophrenic. It depends on much more than that- In order for the bands to make the money they deserve, we need to help them eliminate the middleman (the RIAA, etc). They make their money touring and from dedicated fans buying their merch, and make very little from the CDs of their music that are constantly being produced. Why dont the bands make the money they deserve? because record companies have become the best way to get noticed quickly- until The Internet.
[quote comment="260205"]the next president of US would be black, after that it would be pirate[/quote]
LOL
awesome.
You guys are too funny, especially these last comments about the eventual music ISP fee.
Go get get ‘em boys! I’m sure the world is listening to you and really values your opinions! lol
ron paul
@54: Actually, yes, the world IS listening very intensely, but they don’t value our intentions so much as fear them.
Some politicians have started waking up to the issue as well.
You see, there is one thing that beats every wheelbarrow of lobbyists’ cash. Just one. And that’s votes in a democratic election.
When you have between 80% and 95% of the population wanting to legalize file sharing, as is the case in Sweden, that starts to matter a lot.
NPD, everywhere. So funny.
I bet you think you’re going to take over the world, don’t you? C’mon, admit it, you do.
we our taking over the world- you just can’t deal with realty. you’re big corperations can’t tell us what to do. I’ll take whatever I want, the internet is free to the world.
@56: Oh, I’ve gone on record saying that. Not me taking over, though, but the ideas and ideals of free file sharing. I said that in an interview to CNet this summer: “Sweden, Europe, and the world - in that order”.
Just today I got a request for an interview where one of the questions started “So far, your plan appears to be executing on track. What do you see…”
So while you laugh at it, I’ve spent the past two years of my life actively trying to push pieces and arrows into position.
[quote comment="260402"]@56: Oh, I’ve gone on record saying that. Not me taking over, though, but the ideas and ideals of free file sharing. I said that in an interview to CNet this summer: “Sweden, Europe, and the world - in that order”.
Just today I got a request for an interview where one of the questions started “So far, your plan appears to be executing on track. What do you see…”
So while you laugh at it, I’ve spent the past two years of my life actively trying to push pieces and arrows into position.[/quote]
Keep on pushing .. We’re all behind you.
The power is in the people, we all need our voices heard. It’s going to be a rough ride ahead but we all will win in the end.
We have something so unique here, the internet is something we all should fight for, and fight hard.
Net neutrality, freedom to speak, freedom to share and voice opinions. It’s all worth fighting for.
eh…as long as Bush is till around, I will keep blaming US of A.
Trust me artists earn a LOT from live performances..
[quote comment="260419"]Trust me artists earn a LOT from live performances..[/quote]
I would believe that. Let’s think of one example.
Here, it’s about $80 for a ticket. Thinking average price. Now, 40,000 people, also conservative. That makes $320,000 dollars.
This is conservative. So, take out all the costs, you’d still be left with a great deal of cash.
Not bad for one nights work.
File sharing is legal, why would there be a need to legalise it? If I send an email to someone I have by definition shared a file since a copy of the email ends up in my “Sent Mail”-folder. Where is the illegality in that?
/Mike
[quote comment="260426"]File sharing is legal, why would there be a need to legalise it? If I send an email to someone I have by definition shared a file since a copy of the email ends up in my “Sent Mail”-folder. Where is the illegality in that?
/Mike[/quote]
Unless you happen to send a copyrighted image in that email and you didn’t know. Then you break the law and deserve hefty fines.
What are you guys going to do when the ISP music fee takes effect and everyone is able to legally download for free?
Go back to shoplifting? LOL.
ISP music fee? WTF are you on, that’ll never happen.
If it does i might go back to breaking into houses, starting with YOURS!
Is there any way to contact the MPs and give them our support for the cause?
[quote comment="260256"]Hey.. did the RIAA ever find the music that was stolen?[/quote]
Yeah, it’s on your hard drive.
If I build a guitar in my basement, I created it. If you take it without me saying you can, you obviously have stolen it.
If I write a song in my basement, I created it. If you take it without me saying you can, you obviously have stolen it.
Who the fuck cares what Sweden thinks?
They don’t give a shit about this because Swedish stuff isn’t being stolen.
And like their opinion is going to actually ever matter anyway. haha.
[quote comment="260453"][quote comment="260256"]Hey.. did the RIAA ever find the music that was stolen?[/quote]
Yeah, it’s on your hard drive.
If I build a guitar in my basement, I created it. If you take it without me saying you can, you obviously have stolen it.
If I write a song in my basement, I created it. If you take it without me saying you can, you obviously have stolen it.[/quote]
If I copy the song, you still have it, so it’s not stolen.
End of story, not stop the stealing bullshit, people don’t buy it anymore.
[quote comment="260456"]Who the fuck cares what Sweden thinks?
They don’t give a shit about this because Swedish stuff isn’t being stolen.
And like their opinion is going to actually ever matter anyway. haha.[/quote]
You bored at work or something?
[quote comment="260457"]If I copy the song, you still have it, so it’s not stolen.[/quote]
Nice punt.
I created it. I get to decide where goes, not you.
The latest list of Swedish things worth stealing:
.
Swedish pop bands like ABBA, Roxette, Army of Lovers, Ace of Base, A*Teens, E-Type, The Cardigans and Swedish singer Meja have had international success.
Considering the swedish population compared to the US, I think they are giving the US a run for their money.
Some of the most successful post-ABBA popular music artists from Sweden are Kent, Roxette, The Wannadies, Ace of Base, Carola Häggkvist, Helena Paparizou, Army of Lovers, Neneh and Eagle-Eye Cherry, Robyn, A*Teens, The Cardigans, Europe, Alcazar and Play. A number of renowned rock and pop-oriented artists have come out of the country in recent years, including Eskobar, Jenny Wilson, Clawfinger, The Sounds, Peter Bjorn and John, The Hives, Hardcore Superstar, Millencolin, Sahara Hotnights, Loney, Dear, The Hellacopters, The Ark, Infinite Mass, Love Is All, Mando Diao, Shout Out Louds, Looptroop, José González, Caesars and Stefan Olsdal of Placebo. The Knife and Jens Lekman have both received significant underground acclaim in recent years. Such has been the success of music abroad that clubs specializing in Swedish music have sprung up in major cities like Berlin, Barcelona and London. Swedish chart toppers Kent are also often regarded as a pop band based on the variety of sounds found on their various albums.
@73:
If you want to decide where it goes, don’t release it. Once you’ve released it, you have no more control over how people communicate it to each other, and nor should you.
[quote comment="260477"]@73:
If you want to decide where it goes, don’t release it. Once you’ve released it, you have no more control over how people communicate it to each other, and nor should you.[/quote]
I agree Rick. Although seems there are still some old thinkers out there wanting control over peoples lives.
@75: That’s only a drop in the bucket. I’m from the US and I’d say at least a strong 35% of what I listen to is Swedish. The underground pop scene is so good and there’s so many bands. Best place in the world for music right now, imo.
[quote comment="260456"]Who the fuck cares what Sweden thinks?
They don’t give a shit about this because Swedish stuff isn’t being stolen.
And like their opinion is going to actually ever matter anyway. haha.[/quote]
Are you one of those people who thinks the USA creates everything?
@66
since when does being an online pirate mean im going to go out and commit a crime?
Its not the US government thats the problem, its the corporations donating to candidates so they can get political favors.
If the world desires do download something, eventually it will become legal to download- the point we need to make is (of course) with our money. Currently, the big corporations are “donating” millions away into the US government, trying to stop piracy. just look here!
http://www.opensecrets.org/industries/indus.asp?Ind=B02
im not saying that all of that money is from the RIAA, but I can assure you that a good chunk of it is.
@76, a truly brilliant statement, for that is the truth of how things are now. with the advent of CD’s even, it got harder and harder to control the spread of information- ever since then, large corporations have of course been trying to protect “their product”. Look where its gotten them- on the verge of collapse because they cant hold back the tide of information.
[quote comment="260188"]U.S.A. = 3rd world.
Their pipes are so slow it’s painful downloading…[/quote]
USA + Canada = 3rd World.
Our pipes are pathetic. (50-150 kB/s anyone?)
[quote comment="260461"][quote comment="260457"]If I copy the song, you still have it, so it’s not stolen.[/quote]
Nice punt.
I created it. I get to decide where goes, not you.[/quote]
Not really. If your song becomes part of mainstream media the public ultimately decides where it goes. If all goes well it will become part of a society’s culture and end up in the public domain. Future artists may draw on it for inspiration to create new works. This enriches the world. This is written into the constitution of the united States. Because of what we call the ‘Bono Act’ a law on October 27, 1998, amends the copyright laws by extending the duration of copyright protection. In general, copyright terms were extended for an additional 20 years. Hollywood lobbied congress to pass un fair laws like this that hurt everyone. Let me give a brief example here: the Sonny Bono Copyright Term Extension Act of 1998—so named in honor of the late Rep. Bono, and not because it extended his copyright terms—was constitutional. Prior to the Bono Act, an individually owned work was protected for the creator’s life plus 50 more years; corporate-owned copyrights lasted a flat 75 years. The law extended both timespans by two decades, prompting a legal challenge from Eric Eldred, a bibliophile in New Hampshire who wanted to put digitized editions of old books online.
When the Court ruled against Eldred, the Disney Corporation issued a collective sigh of relief. Before the Bono Act passed, Mickey Mouse was set to enter the public domain in 2004, with his best-known animated pals following shortly afterward. One reason Disney put its weight behind the 1998 legislation was to keep Mickey and the gang on the plantation; Eldred’s backers subsequently adopted Free the Mouse as an unofficial slogan.
Mickey’s own reaction to the decision was less enthusiastic. Telling his keepers that he was going on an “ice run for the boss,” the mouse made his way to a dive bar a few miles outside Disneyland, where he gave reason an exclusive interview.
Q: How does it feel to have your sentence extended by two decades?
A: How do you think it feels? For almost 70 years, I’ve only been allowed to do what the Disney people say I can do. Sometimes someone comes up with a new idea, and I think to myself, “Great! Here’s a chance to stretch myself!” But of course they won’t let me leave the reservation. If I do, they send out their lawyers to bring me home.
In 1971, for instance, Dan O’Neill got me a part in something called Air Pirates Funnies. It was great: I got to have sex, I got to use drugs, I got to explore the whole underground comix scene. It was liberating.
[quote comment="259694"]Why is it you guys blame all this on America?
I think it’s stupid to say that.
…
Never mind that person behind the curtain. It’s just George Bush whipping his A$$ on more religious belief’s.
He’ll be out of office soon.
…
[/quote]
What is up with blaming Bush for anti-filesharing? Its a BIG government over there, folks! Its not like one guy controls, or even knows about, every little thing that’s going on. I mean, to us p2p is big, but when you have to deal with national defense, healthcare, education, agriculture, transportation, immigration, arts and science funding, etc. etc. etc. for over 300 million people plus keep an eye on international affairs with every country on the planet, then p2p amoungst 60 million or so of your citizens makes a pretty damn small blip on your radar!
Whether you picture him as an honest guy splitting his time between his national responsibilities and his family, or a greedy dumbass *wad trying to take over the planet and steal everyone’s stuff, clamping down on music sharing is, I would think, pretty low on his list of priorities.
PS - that’s not to say there are no lower-level factions in his government which take bribes from the mafIAA and do everything in their power to clamp down on p2p.
Mr. Anonymous poster. you may work in the music industry but you haven’t PROVED it. you haven’t sourced anything. I can claim I’m in the band nickleback and not source myself to look cool too bro. seriously if the musicians take to the online market via Amazon or Itunes then maybe we won’t be in this mess. its the record industry being too blind to see the future. they want us to spend 20 bucks on a frickin cover instead of just the CD.
I blame Bush and his family for everything.
Bush should be in Jail. He is a war criminal.
USA out of Canada NOW!
Freaking Amerikkkans, can’t even read.
lol sweden
get a job
[quote comment="260477"]@73: Once you’ve released it, you have no more control over how people communicate it to each other, and nor should you.[/quote]
OIC, you get to decide how the world should work and live, huh? I like your thinking. I’ve decided you need to share your girlfriend with me. Tell her to get her stinky ass over here right now, and get ready for long afternoon of blowing me.
You see, you’re all very, very ill. Classic NPD.
Very entertaining comments. Sweden blames America for copyright infringement pressure on an American technology (aka Internet). That makes sense…I guess? Meanwhile, Canada is like wtf?^^
[quote comment="260692"]OIC, you get to decide how the world should work and live, huh? I like your thinking. I’ve decided you need to share your girlfriend with me. Tell her to get her stinky ass over here right now, and get ready for long afternoon of blowing me.[/quote]
I think it’s pretty obvious he doesn’t have a girlfriend.
Stop bashing the U.S.! ya the RIAA and MPAA are the problems and sure the people except for a few are stupid as hell but it’s still a danm good country hell I live in it!
[quote comment="260692"][quote comment="260477"]@73: Once you’ve released it, you have no more control over how people communicate it to each other, and nor should you.[/quote]
OIC, you get to decide how the world should work and live, huh? I like your thinking. I’ve decided you need to share your girlfriend with me. Tell her to get her stinky ass over here right now, and get ready for long afternoon of blowing me.
You see, you’re all very, very ill. Classic NPD.[/quote]
Good point !
Although, should change girlfriend to car (Porshe whatever), thereby bypassing any human rights issues yet staying right on topic.
I love analogies! Keep’em up, guys!
Unfortunately copyright laws will stop you from making a copy of his car, even though you should have the right to.
I believe it is still legal to make a copy of his girlfriend though, if you can find a good way to do it.
[quote]Although, should change girlfriend to car (Porshe whatever), thereby bypassing any human rights issues yet staying right on topic.[/quote]
The proper analogy would be “I’ve decided I like your car, I should be able to see it/a picture of it/whatever”. You viewing his car doesn’t affect his possession of his car in the least, nor does replicating the image of it (via a photo). He still has his car.
BABABOOEY!
The only thing that’s changed is now you can copy what you couldn’t before.
That doesn’t change the law, or the owners right to distribute their work in a way they decide.
They get to decide that, not you.
Unless they say you can take it, you’re stealing.
It’s not stealing. Give it a rest, people don’t buy that argument anymore. It’s over.
Change with the times. If you can’t handle the future, change your job.
LOL. Sorry, but it’s stealing.
Show me where the law changed.
It didn’t. You’re stealing.
The bible is the most pervasive thing, it is written by corrupt men who sought to corrupt the mindsofmany and they have done a splendid job
I’m the savior you guysorgals have been looking for since ancient time
I’m a virgin, i am aloner, i am in touch with nature, and have done much to help everyone since my birth.
I know all, see all, hear all, and a perfectionist. I am never satisfied until perfect.
believing is seeing
I am here to offer my help to humanity who are on the path to destruction
I am the the solution to world peace
I will bring world peace through love, co-operation, and understanding of the world we live in.
[quote comment="260979"]LOL. Sorry, but it’s stealing.
Show me where the law changed.
It didn’t. You’re stealing.[/quote]
LAW? Who gives a flying fark what the law says, the laws will change due to popular opinion, and that is, it’s not stealing.
ok.. now i’m off to get me some music that people are sharing.
ROFLMAO. Sorry, but it’s not stealing.
Here’s where the law was stated: USSC Dowling v United States, 1985. Blackmun J: “(copyright infringement) does not easily equate with theft, conversion, or fraud… The infringer invades a statutorily defined province guaranteed to the copyright holder alone. But he does not assume physical control over copyright; nor does he wholly deprive its owner of its use.”
… and it has not since changed, despite the frantic efforts of the RIAA/MPAA and their various trolls (ie, you) to conflate copyright infringement and stealing in the minds of the public.
Maybe you’d like to try for … hmm … “overtaking against the lane markers” or something. “Copyright is overtaking against the lane markers! You’re overtaking! See the double-yellow line? See? The law says there’s a double-yellow line there, and when you download a movie, you are overtaking!”
I am here to offer my help to humanity who are on the path to destruction
I am the the solution to world peace
I will bring world peace through love, co-operation, and understanding of the world we live in.
Bloody well get on with it then.
@100:
LOL.
Yeah, all those judgments being handed down against music thieves are just a figment of my imagination.
[quote comment="261049"]@100:
LOL.
Yeah, all those judgments being handed down against music thieves are just a figment of my imagination.[/quote]
What judgments?
Oh.. the paid arguments you mean?
Well.. we all know who the real thieves are don’t we.
Tell us what it’s like to have NPD.
LOL.
ROFLCOPTER. AFAIK. PBKAC. TLA.
Your ability to write “LOL” before every comment impresses no-one, douchebag. Come up with some new schtick.
Yeah, all those judgments being handed down against music thieves are just a figment of my imagination.
Judgements for what? Not stealing. Hell, not even for assault. OMGZORS, guess what? Those judgements aren’t for jaywalking either! Those people were only ever charged with, or sued for, infringement of copyright.
Which. Isn’t. Stealing.
hmmm, thinking you’re the one that decides what the definition of stealing is…
yeah, you’ve got NPD.
[quote comment="261068"]hmmm, thinking you’re the one that decides what the definition of stealing is…
yeah, you’ve got NPD.[/quote]
And who should decide the definition? You?
I think you have a serious mental issue. Seriously, to get so upset over this, you should talk to someone.
Come up with some name, “Anonymous”, otherwise I will have to assume that anything stupid people say is said by you.
The definitions of stealing, and copyright infringements, is decided by legislatures and courts. In different nations, at different times, these definitions have changed. The current US definition, by the US Supreme Court, of copyright infringement is quoted above.
I can’t imagine why any private individual might want unelected, unaccountable, money-grubbing corporations to decide social morality. The idea is ridiculous.
[quote comment="261075"]I can’t imagine why any private individual might want unelected, unaccountable, money-grubbing corporations to decide social morality. The idea is ridiculous.[/quote]
Problem is, no one cares what you think.
Millions of dollars have been lost from illegal downloading. The ISP fee is the remedy. Now stop whining, bitch.
Just have to stop feeding this troll until he talks to someone to help him.
Gotta feel sorry for him though really, to be so desperate.
Please talk to a professional, then come back into the community when you’re better.
Millions of dollars have been lost from illegal downloading.
Er, no. Not lost. Gained. You really don’t know any economics, do you, you dumbass troll? Anyone who uses the word “lost” in that context betrays themselves as a fuckwit, a stooge, or as in your case, both.
If I give a copy of a CD to a friend, my friend is up $20, that he will spend elsewhere in the economy. The record industry isn’t down $20, no-one is. If I was unable to give my friend the copy, he wouldn’t have bothered buying it. So now, he has a CD, and $20 worth of petrol or a shirt or whatever-the-fuck as well as the CD. He has gained.
I notice you’re still too dumb to figure out how to allocate yourself a name …
first, for that anonymous prick who has his/her tongue deep in the asses of the RIAA and alike: no one cares what YOU think! they only see some lifeless asshole bragging bullshit. they DO care about what ASH wrote as they are thinking the same.
second: file sharing is not stealing. it’s spreading of information, culture and knowledge.
if you say i’m a criminal then i will act like one and beat the shit out of you when i ever get a chance.
third: on the “making a living out of touring” topic: yes, music performers can make a living out of touring if they are good anf worth listening to. of course they should tour regularly not only once-twice a year. by us (hungary) the really good performers, bands do this and they do make a good living out of it. they don’t mind filesharing as it is the way they get new fans, who then go to concerts and buy merch. only the untalented, bad, “worthless” ones are bragging about filesharing, and of course the ones who are too lasy to tour and they expect a constant high-grade living from record sales (and they do have it, but they always want more and more and more…). britney spears and alike aren’t going to starve to death because of filesharing, they will only earn 10 milloin $-s instead of 15 million a year (or something like that). oh, how bad for them… :P
fourth: ever thought of people who can’t afford to buy records at those ridiculous prices? like a college student who, after paying the costs of education, barely can afford even food? or a 12-16 year old kid who gets about 5$ a week? these people hardly could by the records of their loved bands. and what about exploring new bands, music? imagine somebody gathering his little money for a month and then buying a CD wich turns out to be crap.
and that leads us to the fifth: without filesharing, you could hardly explore new bands. you would only listen to the ones on the radios’ top 40 or top 100 charts and that’s all. britney spears and madonna and alike for a lifetime… . this goes especially for people who have different tastes than the mainstream pop music. i’m one of them. without filesharing i wouldn’t even know the 90% of my loved bands because you CAN’T get them here. this goes even for a lot of well known bands. imagine how it is for some other more underground, not so mainstream performers (and i do listen to a lot of them)and music genres. not everybody wants to listen to pop, rap and disco. the fact is that in a lot of countries you can’t get non mainstream music from legal ways if the band/performer lives in an other country. the hungarian anti-piracy organisations are bragging about us filesharers, though we download stuff they haven’t even heard of (so they don’t even sell it). i simply CAN’T buy them. and even if i could, as i’m one of the above already mentioned poor students, i couldn’t pay the prices of the recordings, not to mention the shipping costs between countries, continents.
these are some very good reasons for letting people share files.
for the topic about monitoring internet activity and ban filesharers: that fucking bitch is nuts. somebody should kill her with a car-bomb as she is a threat to humanity. i pay for the isp-s for internet acces. without restrictions, without monitoring. i have a right to privacy, and that goes for my internet activity to. as police can’t come and search through my house without evidence and court order, nobody should monitor my activity on the net for the same reasons. nor the police, nor some other authority, and especially not some wanna-be-god, self proclaimed “copiright defender”, profit hunting organisations made up from a bunch of worthless wanna-be-god assholes who couldn’t find themself a real job, so they decided to suck other peoples blood.
they want to take away our rights and freedom and turn the world in to a police state in order to suck the blood of musicians and their fans. they think that they are somekind of ubermensch , that they can push around governments and change laws. they think they can tell the rest (99,99%) of the world what to do and what not. such people should die. or at least get a good beating a few times.
if they ever manage to take away my rights and my freedom i will place a huge bomb in their building and blow it up when the most of them are inside. then i will grab a rifle, track down and execute the rest of them.
it is our right to share files for non commercial purpose. better said: it is our DUTY to spread culture and knowledge and to fight for our rights.
and for that above mentioned anonymous prick: i would love to have 10 minutes alone with you in a room, without any questions.
Hey Ash (re #100),
I find it amusing that you cited a U.S. Supreme Court decision to disprove an obvious troll. That’s like killing a spider with a shotgun! ;) Seriously, great work.
To the troll: stick around, you’re fun. A lot of people actually think the flatrate system is a good idea, and your posting has elicited a number of solid reasons why not. Sometimes it helps to have someone who brings out these answers.
wow, you don’t get it, do you? NOBODY CARES what you think about the upcoming ISP fees! NOBODY. You’re a scourge of society, like the nutjob threatening people with bombs.
The ISP fee is going to work, and very easily. Bands will be paid based on how many times their songs or albums are downloaded. The playing field will be leveled; bands will get paid whether they’re on a major label or an independent artist.
[quote comment="261203"]wow, you don’t get it, do you? NOBODY CARES what you think about the upcoming ISP fees! NOBODY. You’re a scourge of society, like the nutjob threatening people with bombs.
The ISP fee is going to work, and very easily. Bands will be paid based on how many times their songs or albums are downloaded. The playing field will be leveled; bands will get paid whether they’re on a major label or an independent artist.[/quote]
Dude.. You still didn’t answer my question..
What about Authors?
I’m writing a book, and I want all isp’s to give me money too. So i can sit back and do nothing but count the money, like the RIAA.
How can I get into this tax, or is this so called music fee only for the elite few?
I’m going to name you, anonymous troll, since you still have not named yourself. I dub you Quisling. (As per World War Z, not WW2. You’re nobody’s national leader.)
wow, you don’t get it, do you? NOBODY CARES what you think about the upcoming ISP fees! NOBODY.
But you apparently care, Quisling. You’re very invested, it seems, in having us watch you gloating and giggling to yourself and rubbing your little hands together with glee. You want to demonstrate some kind of superior understanding or morality or something over us, little Quisling. I detect that eagerness in you.
What do you want, Quisling? Why are you gleefully, if prematurely, celebrating the prospect of the public (that include you) getting a worse deal? Have you let yourself imagine that you’re not like us, one of the public?
Tell us, Quisling. We’re all so very curious about you now, you frothing little tool. Tell us what your interest in this matter is, Quisling. I wonder what a pro-RIAA member of the public might be like. Podunk RIAA under-lawyer? Coke-head music industry promotional shill? Garage-dwelling emo band boy? Freeper/slashdotter, Ron Paul-bot?
What’s your beef, Quisling? Why are you here?
nah, I just troll here to kill time and torment the stupid.
It’s really very easy, as all of you have proved.
And since I’m unemployed and have so much time on my hands, I thought i’d just be silly.
Sorry, but I can’t help it sometimes.
I think someone is mentaly ill..
Sad to see a potentially great discussion topic get ruined by some idiot..
the troll isnt even good at it…
Please, be more polite!
I read this topic to see arguments and not to read about thinking someones mental deseases.
@112 is very interesting.
This is a very good view, the problem is, people in Europe (Euopean Community) got a real great portion of not to be free: if you are using the internet, ALL YOUR ACTIVITIES will be recorded and stored at leas for 6 months.
So, again, for better understanding: AT LEAST FOR 6 MONTHS.
That’s 13 MP’s from the “corporate greed is our livelyhood” party.
The majority of Swedens population vote for the Social Democrats each and every election. You’ll see that number increasing once the left has power again.
[quote comment="261312"]nah, I just troll here to kill time and torment the stupid.
It’s really very easy, as all of you have proved.[/quote]
*facepalms* look you idiot you obviously don’t understand the future of file-sharing like the general public does. obviously you have the intelligence of a gnat if you honestly think what the RIAA and the MPAA are doing the right thing. I’ll give you something to chew on. Sony BMG one of the biggest names in the industry. the LAST ONE to hold out on putting their music up for sale on Amazon and getting rid of the Digital Rights Management. if you read all of the studies they show that COMPACT DISK SALES ARE DOWN! NOT DIGITAL MEDIA!
@73 -
You can still decide what to do with it. If I take a copy of that song, you still have your copy of the song, and you still can choose do anything you want with your song.
[quote comment="261203"]
The ISP fee is going to work, and very easily. Bands will be paid based on how many times their songs or albums are downloaded. The playing field will be leveled; bands will get paid whether they’re on a major label or an independent artist.[/quote]
Ever work with horses? Sometimes they’re persnickety, just to _be_ persnickety.
In the cat and mouse battle between DPI and P2P, DPI may be able to detect P2P traffic; it may even be able to tell the type of traffic;
but if it can ever _read_ fully encrypted traffic? Then online commerce is dead.
Either it is publicly possible to send data streams of completely unreadable information across the internet, or else every account number, login, password - every deail - of every online transaction is comprised. Not might be compromised. IS compromised.
So it seems reasonable to assume that it will always be possible to create completely unreadable data streams on the internet.
And as for DPI’ing your way through these, to figure out what song goes where, and allocating the money accordingly? Good luck; you may be able to tell our traffic is encrypted, but you won’t be able to find out its contents. Ergo, you won’t be able to determine how to divy up the money, or at least prove you did it legitimately. And, finally, ergo if I were an artist being paid (or not) by this system, I think I’d be pretty pissed off at being assigned my dues on an arbitrary basis!
And believe you me, we are persnickety; make this DPI intra/transnational, and we can / I will go to full scale encryption: just because :)
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