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Judges Liken P2P To The Ancient Practice of Lending Books

After raids in 2005, Spanish police arrested four people and dismantled a popular file-sharing site. The case has been dragging on ever since but now has finally been closed. Three judges decided that no offense had been committed and likened file-sharing to the ancient practice of sharing books.

Following an investigation by the authorities and audiovisual rights collecting society EGEDA and Columbia Tristar, in early 2005 Spanish police embarked on an operation aimed at shutting down popular file-sharing forum CVCDGO.com.

EGEDA complained that site allowed members to download movies located on P2P networks, sometimes which had yet to have a theatrical release. Like many file-sharing sites, CVCDGO had been financed by advertising since its 2004 launch and in its short life it allegedly received more than 11 million visits.

Conducted by the country’s Intellectual Property Crime Squad, ‘Operation CVCD’ culminated later in 2005 in raids on locations in Malaga, Seville and Madrid. There police arrested the four male operators of the site who at the time were aged between 27 and 37 years old. The servers, meanwhile, remained located in San Diego in the United States,

The legal proceedings have dragged on ever since, but now the Provincial Court of Madrid has finally closed the case, finding that no offenses had been committed.

In common with every other file-sharing case coming out of the Spanish legal system recently, the Court found that since the site did not host the actual copyright files and generated no profit directly from any infringements of copyright, the presence of advertising on the site did not constitute a crime.

In their ruling, judges Ocariz, Gutierrez and Campillo said that “..since ancient times there has been the loan or sale of books, movies, music and more. The difference now is mainly on the medium used – previously it was paper or analog media and now everything is in a digital format which allows a much faster exchange of a higher quality and also with global reach through the Internet.”

The judges noted that all this takes places between many users all at once without any of them receiving any financial reward.

Lawyer Carlos Sanchez Almeida, whose law firm defended the case, said that the decision meant that the judges were sending a clear message to the government, informing Culture Minister González Sinde that there is a “red line that should not be crossed.”

“The judges have taken a stand for freedom on the Internet,” he added.

The decision cannot be appealed.

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  • x86

    I liken it to that too! Finally sane judges.

  • finally..

    common sense ftw!!

    this statement by the judge clearly illustrates the MOST valid argument for sharing. sharing has never been illegal, and never should be.

    its too bad that most judges/systems can be bought, sold, and controlled through mafiaa tactics.

    cheers to you, spaniards!!

  • BlackBeard.

    Finally a small shred of sanity in an insane world. I can scarcely believe it! I Live in the USA where practices like the ‘Patriot Act’ blatantly take away even more of our civil liberties. People ought to have the right to share files without BIG Corporate brother shoving us around, jailing us for the NON criminal act of human sharing. How very sad.

  • Snowgoon

    WIN

  • Don’t touch me there mommy

    So, when will all torrent and other P2P sites move to Spain?

  • Anonymous

    6th

  • Anonymous

    Gestapo forgot to pay the judges!

  • Mr.Afghanistan

    High Respect To The Lawyer ))))

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  • tightasa

    I say take up a collection and send these judges on a world tour!At last..A victory for logic and commonsense!!!!

  • SPAIN FTW

    spain = win

  • nobodyez

    Don’t worry, until now we have been more or less safe here in spain, but recently Mr. Obama has talked in person to president zapatero regarding the issue that file sharing is legal in Spain so long as you don’t profit. Soon thanks to the pression of the us embassy and Obama we will have our own patriot act and acta here in spain, shame but that’s the way it is and thare is no way back. Ass soon as the ‘ley de economia sostenible’ (sustainable economy law) is aproved, this sitiuation will end, file sharing will be prohibited and this country will be like another state of the us.

  • Zush

    Olé!

  • Hom3r

    “The decision cannot be appealed.”

    Not only are they smart about file sharing, they can see that there is no point in even having a case if the big media companies can just keep appealing the case until the defendant runs out of money.

  • omfg

    spain = win

  • Anonymous

    I like this judge.

  • in.cog.nito

    Damn, Spain for the win on this one. It’s GREAT to see people with technology knowledge, and experience correctly taking the facts and coming to a clear decision.

    Everyone in their voting area had better be supporting these guys.

  • joejoe

    I agree with this except for the fact that when you loan a book out, you are not left with a copy of it also. This more like you xerox a book then give the copy to a friend, that is illegal.

  • theDog

    ‘It is more blessed to give than to receive.’

  • Anonymous

    So, when are we moving to Spain? Unless of course the US forces the Spanish government to introduce crazy laws in the near future. I wouldn’t be surprised! :(

  • Truther

    Another country gets logical.

    Can we get America next?

  • TerribleTony

    WHAT?! I can’t believe this! People shouldn’t be sharing books, that’s a disgrace! ;)

  • clarjon1

    WIN

  • Anonymous

    win judge

  • Mike

    Might it be interesting to see how the music/movie industry is doing in Spain? I suspect it’s quite healthy.

  • John

    25th

  • mack

    just curious, if the courts say that its legal, doesnt the government have a long way to go before they can say the courts are wrong?

  • Ninja

    Another epic win for file sharing. And obviously epic loss for MAFIAA.

    Put aside libraries, exchanging personal stuff with friends is also pretty common. Next: MAFIAA sues ordinary folks for lending their original content to others.

    Which reminds me, I got a DVD from my french school library the other day and I couldn’t run in my DVD player because it wasn’t the same region. I obviously cracked it in my computer and watched anyway. What did this freakin DRM do? Annoy a legit user and make him go illegal cause now I own a copy of the DVD without paying and I have no clue of where to find such cult french stuff for my region so I’m not bothering to pay anything for it. Cool huh?

  • toreador

    stop reading books and watching movies with your eyes: you need a license to do that (or so the media barons were thinking…)
    and Spain just proved them wrong.

  • Because You Can’t Torrent Beer

    Applause!

  • pZ

    p2p is like party of thieves not paying to the magic bridge troll, but if the magic bridge troll starves to death, no one will nor is able to maintain and repair the magic bridge, and the adventurers have to find another way across.

  • Pingback: Spagna: Magistrati equiparano il P2P all’antica pratica del prestare i libri : Movimento ScambioEtico

  • Anonymous

    @30

    “thieves” – stopped reading there.

  • illegal tree

    Dear Spain,

    Please send some of your judges to America. We need them.

  • The United Hackers Association

    diffrance is i have a million friends nd pull a star trek replictor out and copy it so they too can have it

    SO hollywood is saying that star trek sytle replicators are evil bad and create thieves

    WHAT happens when i am able to replicate food like this?

    they gonna let people starve cause were stealing the replication binaries?

  • Taylor

    This is a great win. I hope we Canadians can force back the corporate lobbyists with the new copyright bill that makes it illegal to break a digital lock. The thing is that people are daft when it comes to this, a number of us believe that when format shifting becomes legal it will be okay. They don’t realize the clause that states that format shifting is legal as long as it doesn’t have a digital lock. The problem is that everything has a digital lock.

  • LolWIN

    LOLOLOLOL
    *Wheeze*

    LOLOL

    Go Spain! :D They may have a rubbish economy, but they sure have good judges!

  • Anonymous

    some good news finaly.. freedom!

  • Aerilus

    the only sane country left

    i can just see the dialog between Spain and the mpaa

    Mpaa if you dont pay we will not give you media

    Spain you mean your not going to sell us media because we are getting it for free.

    why cant any other country reach the same conclusion the MPAA and other’s threats are baseless. god I hate being a socialist american

  • NoOneInSpecial

    Made my day…

  • lol

    @9 all fake blackmarket rip offs

  • gorehound

    That was good but do not forget the war is on still.

    1.no buying any new riaa/mpaa products
    2.buy only used stuff from these greedbags
    3.no theater going
    4.starve the bastards till they drop
    5.problem solved

  • Max

    SO there still are people who can think for themselves. EPIC WIN

  • Rabbit80

    “..since ancient times there has been the loan or sale of books, movies, music and more.”

    The Spanish had movies in ancient times? I learn something new every day!

  • Rabbit80

    My response is awaiting moderation? Why???

  • Whatever

    Testing….
    (Comments seem to disappear with respond)

  • Whatever

    (try again in pieces, sorry, hate it when i dont know why it doesnt work)

    Neomind must be crying now.

  • Whatever

    (if this works it must be the middle part)
    @TF
    I see a possible conflict of implied information.
    a. “dismantled a popular file-sharing site.”
    b. “The servers, meanwhile, remained located in San Diego in the United States”

    Was the site taken down or not ?

  • Whatever

    (attempt many, middle 1)
    This is something for the North European countries to be ashamed about, the judges in a country like Spain are a lot smarter (with the crisis, nobody there is going to buy any US media anyway).

  • Anonymous

    @30 too true

  • dlj

    What a great victory. However I am wondering how is acta going to affect this once it’s passed, because, as much as I don’t want it to pass most people still not interested on this issue…

  • fotbal

    Spain beats Poland!

  • Whatever

    (attempt many, middle 2)
    However, the MAFIAA is still rich so they will keep trying (other sites or other attacks) until they get just one judgement in their favor and use it for all cases to follow.

  • Whatever

    Sorry for the multitude of messages but i seem to have found the problem.

    @TF
    Changed: “a n g l e s of attack” to “other attacks” and the comment was added, whats wrong with the word “a n g l e s” (without spaces, ofcourse)?

  • Khmuprince

    Finally, we have a judge who has a working brain inside his head and made the right decision about the case. All the future hearing should follow his foot step and make the right and unbiased decision. Finally, I can breath easily knowing there is a sensible judge exists.

  • Anonymous

    Obligatory link: http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html

    (More topical than usual; an important part of that tale is about lending books.)

  • Joe

    Finally common sense prevails.

  • LOL

    Finally a Judge with common sense

  • bootytape.com

    For some reason this feels like the calm before the storm.

    I don’t know but in the next year or 2 you might hear about scandals forcing these judges to step down or sudden health problems.

    I mean to actually have people in power that think freely sharing is informative and help’s spread common cultures is rare these days.

    It’s nice that the owner’s and staff didn’t have to pay money or be imprisoned but still there freedom to share using that site was removed in the end.

  • That guy

    @30 & @ 46
    WHO CARES!! 9 out of 10 movies that come out of Hollywood are garbage anyway.

  • mack

    the problem with this, obama and our other corrupt officials gonna be like look at these backwards beaners, they must be wrong.
    in the end us americans lose lol

  • BadMan

    Spam flowers to the judge.

  • lulz

    You should totally supply us with contact information for the three judges so we can thank them for being sane and applying the fabulous common sense they have compared to others in their position.

    (And I sure hope the four that were arrested file a suit for damages and compensation of time.)

  • slashdot user justinburt

    The whole purpose of having laws is to keep the evil corporations from eating our children.

  • Grok

    Thank you, Spain, for providing a solid and smart precedent that might hopefully be followed in the future.

  • Anonymous

    kudos to the judges for hopefully starting a trend

  • orly

    Where can I find a good Spanish VPN service? May someone please recommend…?

  • loneranger

    @39

    It’s best to let them know why we are not buying their junk as well. Else, we’ll just be waging a lone war in our medialess apartments

  • Yogi

    “The Ancient Practice of Lending Books”

    LOL.

  • william shakespeare

    the one gives mercy outa be belssed than the reciever. -merchant of vennice

  • manky goes to bollywood

    Sharing books :O !!~111

    the internet is 1 big library

  • Pingback: Spanish Judges Liken File Sharing To Lending Books | JetLib News

  • open source

    Here is a open source e-book for you.
    After much research I have written “The Free Software Guide”
    Get it here: http://plunder.com/1b59e85318
    I have made this guide in order to support file-sharing.
    It covers UseNet’s on page 12 and file-sharing in general since torrents may not be the only solution.
    I would love if you could give me some feedback on it.

  • ito

    @SPAIN FTW

    I hope you mean on July 11th in South Africa eh?

  • ito

    @fotbal @48
    No less than 6-0. Half of the players (ok I’m exaggerating) are part of Barcelona :) or soon will be (Fabregas) :) I’ll back them up for the win in South Africa.

  • Pingback: Fildeling svarer til biblioteksudlån? « Center for Benhård Analyse

  • Anders Fogh

    Great news!

    …and we are all librarians in our spare time ;)

  • Pete

    I wonder why Hollywood wasn’t able to corrupt these people.

  • AnarchyNow

    As long as no money is involved, there should never be any problem. TPB is making money that’s why they’ve been found guilty…
    The capitalist MAFIAA can’t stand one bit of competition, and since most people don’t pay anything (except their ISP…), the MAFIAA just can’t compete, and this is basic socialism…

  • dg100

    Hi, TF. Sorry to be off-topic, but if it’s not too much trouble, can we please get some sort of guide as to what will be posted straight away and what will be placed on modwatch for 12 hours? And what’s wrong with the word “a n g l e s”?

  • Pingback: Judges Liken P2P To The Ancient Practice of Lending Books « SYSTEMA

  • Brandon

    I am glad this judge set a precedent. Other countrys should follow. I wonder if he is a younger judge? The older ones have no clue except to teach their oldskool before electricity lectures I guess. Hopefully these younger judges that come into office and aren’t easily corrupted by sleazbag goons wanting to pass stupid laws this will slow down. Meanwhile the Actual artist gets no money as it goes into the anti-groups paychecks. They are already into 6+ billion they owe the artists anyway…

  • orly

    @72 Maybe their votes matter more then $

    Let’s move to Spain and pirate til we drop :)

  • Pingback: Is piracy like lending a book?? « Ultra's Brain dump

  • Brandon

    @72 Maybe Spain doesn’t like to watch totally garbage movies. You know other countries make really good movies besides the Hollywood trash. I know, I have seen them…

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  • Alex

    These judges are stupid.

    Sharing files is like xeroxing books and giving them to all for free.

  • Michael

    Three judges decided that no offense had been committed and likened CHILD PROSTITUTION to the ancient practice of SLAVERY.

    Can you really apply ancient practices to today’s? No!! File Sharing IS WRONG, people! You think it’s insane for people to charge for their works?

    Yeah, fine, you’re sticking it to the man when it comes to the RIAA, they make tons of money and don’t share any of it with their artists, FINE.

    But don’t say that you should be able to walk to your nearest bookstore and take anything you want!! Yeah, book publishers, game publishers, record labels, they’re greedy, but they also provide the people that create content with capital so that talent can actually create things.

    I’m making my own indie video game, and I do NOT support piracy.

  • Pingback: Le P2P s'apparente au prêt de livres, selon la justice espagnole | Comprendre le Monde

  • GoGoGo

    Let’s move Spain guys. We’ll have tortillas and free internet to download. We’ll sit all day at home downloading and eating tortillas! Come on let’s go! :D

  • Grabber

    @78

    Cool, let us know when it is released so we can torrent it.

  • Bad_Mojo

    ViVa Espania

  • ke

    @78 look on the bright side m8 the more piracy the more exposure to your game

  • RoestVrijStaal

    Can some Spanish judge been imported into the Netherlands plz?

  • Hal

    Y viva España!

  • Drak

    Great result all i want is to be able to download a drm free file so i can watch/ listen to it wherever whenever i choose. i should not have to watch programs when they say glad i still have my VCR no restriction on them is there

  • Reaper

    Epic Win!!!!!

  • Pingback: Spagna: Magistrati equiparano il P2P all’antica pratica del prestito dei libri « YBlog

  • 87

    I think the Judges in Spain got it wrong. File sharing is like GIVING your book away, to thousands of people, not LENDING it to a friend and expecting it back. This phenomena mirrors the moral values of those who participate. Sad to see so many without self-respect.

  • anonymous

    If companies started offering extras to people who’re willing to buy, and stopped punishing the legit users, piracy has and will drop.

    Look at valve’s sucess with steam for example – not pirating the game gets you a ton of extra features, achievements, a free chat function and a social networking service amongst other benefits.

    Simpler still, offer multiplayer, users are willing to buy games to get access to password protected online features – Blizzard is raking in the cash wuith WOW with a relativly low piracy rate.

  • JohnKen

    Host your site on Spain and you are safe.Pirate Bay?

  • myself

    Let’s assume I just robbed a bank and got away with one million dollars in one dollar bills. Now, I decide to share my new-found wealth with others by giving a dollar to anyone who wants one. Everyone is quick to see the value of what is being shared, so they readily take a dollar. After the bank complains, a judge is brought in and after some deliberation decides that those who also took a dollar aren’t also stealing, they’re just “borrowing” some “light reading” material… ?

  • tightasa

    It`s all very well to moralise when you have plenty of food on the table!!!

  • tightasa

    @ 94….So……… I take it you would not have sided with Robin Hood and his merry men!!!!!!!!!

  • tightasa

    Likely …………you would have been on the side of the Sheriff of Nottingham!

  • YourSelf

    @94: What is your point here? One man decided to steal,he then decided to share. Granted the money was neither his to take,nor to distribute,but a million people get a dollar richer because that’s human nature.And ultimately ONE man stole.

  • myself

    @95 OMG where are your priorities?You’re starving and that drives you to steal movies online? Why not give up internet access and feed your kids with the money saved?

  • myself

    @98 My point is that a million people got richer KNOWING that the money was stolen. It’s called abetting and it’s illegal.

  • Pingback: * Spanish Court sends a Freedom of the Internet message to the government – Throws out illegal file sharing site case likening P2P to the Ancient Practice of Lending Books « Count Us Out

  • TerribleTony

    #82 Very well, you “do not support piracy,” not exactly what you mean by that as it is used with wide strokes.

    Nevertheless, it doesn’t matter who supports or doesn’t support “piracy,” it just has to be accepted as the way things will inevitably go.

    The business model is failing, fix the model, not the customer.

  • Jo Denny

    Finally someone in the kangaroo courts makes sense!

  • Devanite

    Yes but dangling this garbage on MTV and mainstream radio and drowning out better and more decent artists is better? I want to see a list of either all artists free of “big media” or a list of all MAFIAA produced crap, really I do!

    Granted movies you should pay for because making those things arent cheap altho theres nothing wrong with downloading a movie you have already paid for

    But the price of music at todays rate, you pay 15 dollars to a company which has no reason to exist anymore (despite thier claims otherwise) they give 1-2 dollars of that CD’s purchase to the actual artist/s and keep the rest for themselves.

    Business doesnt exist for the sole purpose of having a business, business exists to serve its customers, its not our fault they turn customers away, treat them like total crap and think the US is the only place that wants new products (I live in Canada and yet it takes them a while just to get the same stuff up here, puh lease)

    Big media doesnt want to offer thier products to many places in the world and then they whine and moan about it cause we will gladly show them what they have been missing (and if you think getting a TV is supposed to be the solution to that problem, watching 20 minutes of commercials… yea your not missing anything except 20 minutes of your life)

    Despite the copyplight protectorate’s claims otherwise, piracy has been my introduction to new music for many years now (until they kill off Limewire, then I wont have anywhere to listen to something new, oh well back to MTV and Britney Spears for me)

    the entire platform of distribution has changed, it has changed for the past DECADE, and while abbetting is illegal, forcing people with laws to live in the past and support business merely for the sake of its existence is absolutely retarded, if business doesnt want to change, adapt, and give reasonable and competitive service to its customers.

    Next bailout, the horse and buggy business to revitalize THAT sector because apparently democracy is dead!

  • Adi

    Ok people, lets get real. Sending someone a file is NOT the same as lending them a book. If you can’t see the difference then you’d possibly make a great attorney for file sharing rights.

  • Pingback: * Spanish Court sends a Freedom of the Internet message to the government – Throws out illegal file sharing case: Judges likening P2P to the Ancient Practice of Lending Books « Count Us Out

  • Michael

    The most disturbing part is all the people who are saying this is “common sense”, when clearly you’ve got tons of responses that are against this ruling.

    Common sense would most likely mean a majority opinion, in this case it is not. Duh.

  • me

    Sweden used to have sane laws as well, until they got corrupted and fubar’d by MAFIAA’s bribes. Spain is next in the crosshairs of Big Content. Just a matter of time until they fall in line to the New World Order too.

    Still, great to see that some common sense remains here and there. It won’t last though. Let’s not get overly optimistic: we still need strong anonymous, encrypted, and decentralized P2P.

  • BlackBeard..

    Years ago we used reel to reel tapes to record songs off of the radio. Then I would share cassette copies with friends. Stealing? NO. It was COMMERCIALLY available media. Same as broadcast TV with paid advertising. I still use a VCR to record TV shows, have one on my satellite dish. I record shows & share them online. Does this make me a thief? I don’t think so. Sharing is a natural human thing to do. I don’t care how many politicians are paid off to create insane laws to stop sharing. They are greedy & simply want to milk as much money out of us as possible. They call stealing and I call it sharing. Hollywood made record profits in 2009. If anything P2P is free advertising for them.

  • Lee

    This ruling in Spain is only temporary the 26 EU nations are going to make the law on this subject that will be the law in all 26,ie the same law will apply througout the EU.Who knows they may make a law that echos the Spanish verdict.

  • StopTheMadness

    To the Spanish judge:

    Kudos to you, sir. Seeing someone use the brain instead of sucking up to the Big Media greed machine, gives me some hope for the future. Respect. \m/

    Now where do I send this cigar? ;)

  • TheMAXX

    Sharing is Caring Y’all! Sharing raises sales according to actual large studies made by several different governments, no surprise to anyone with half a brain. People who spend their own time and money to share stuff with others aren’t greedy, they are generous. Generous people are generous, who’d have thunk it.

  • TheMAXX

    #108, These kinds of laws are individual to each country while the countries are still protected from trade pressure by being in the union. My folks in Sweden are telling me that many political parties are adopting the pirate party’s stance on intellectual rights so at least that country is moving towards sanity. I would guess that things will get better as file-sharing becomes more common and the older folks who don’t understand die off.

  • Turtle

    I love all the comments that file sharing is such a horrid bad thing.

    I really don’t feel pity for the movie industry since it seems every time there is a movie release the papers say “Whatever Movie just hit a new box office record!!!!!!!!” Yes, they really seem to be in dire straits.

    Also, when people who own several giant houses all over the world are whining about losing money, it really makes me wonder. Not to mention the fact that for good bands the concerts are always sold out.

    The big recording and movie industries are just scared because technology is slowly making them obsolete.

    Also, the way they rip people off is just a bad business model. If you bought a vhs tape for $30, you can’t get a dvd replacement for free despite the fact that you already paid for the movie. I’m pretty sure most people who file share have already paid the companies that hold the copyright several times over.

    Technology is changing the world. The industry needs to change with it.Make movies people will watch in the theater. Make songs people want to listen to in concert.

  • lol

    Win.

  • Whatever

    This would be a nice one for the appeal in the FTD trial.

    MAFIAA lawyer/previous judge: UK precedent.
    FTD: Spanish precedent.

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  • Wallis

    Pirates aren’t the small minority damaging movies and music as an art form, if you wanna look to the small minority ruining movies and music look no further than hack musicians, actors, directors and producers who pump out valueless movies and plagarized songs, expect huge cuts of the box-office all to themselves and then when it doesn’t go well blame pirates.

  • Anonymous

    @94

    Since filesharing involves no robbery, your “robbing a bank” analogy fails. Hard.

    Try again.

  • Pingback: Anonymous

  • Rob

    The problem with the analogy is that when you share a book, you temporarily give up physical possession of it. You can’t use it because you now don’t have it. The whole scenario involves one and the same instance of the book. But with file sharing it’s like you’re instantly making new copies of the book and distributing these. You’re not sharing your book. You have made perfect “xerox” copies and gave to others who now do not need to purchase their own original copies.

  • illegal tree

    Ok then, compare it to the ancient practice of copying books, which they did all the time. In particular, note the well-known story of the city of Alexandria, who required all visitors to submit their books so they could be copied. They were, of course, returned to their owners afterward. So you see, originally, it was a crime NOT to have your books copied. It was most important that information be shared.

  • Pingback: Spanish court: File sharing is like loaning out a book | MyCE – My Consumer Electronics

  • Huh?

    P2P is like lending a book and keeping it at all at once. If you lend a book, you cannot read it. If you P2P a book to 5000 people, all 5000 people can read it. Lending books still leaves an incentive to buy another copy of the book. P2Ping a book does not.

  • jb danvers

    Of course sharing is just… sharing. Prove where a defendant profits directly from the commercial resale of copyrighted material, and even us file sharers will cheer to see the scum going down for their greed.

  • Hurp Derp

    @122,

    Exposure of any kind for free pretty much demolishes any incentive to buy said item. I’m not buying a movie I already saw, a book I already read or a game I’ve already played. I already have a copy stored away safely in my long-term memory and feel no need to part with my cabbage for something I have already experienced.

    Other than the rare cases of reference material, there is no reason to buy something when I can borrow it. By the same extension, why borrow something when I can download it…

  • Freak111

    So 124, you are pretty much against libraries then.

    We will continue to share our culture. That is fact. Come to terms with this reality.

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  • Anonymous

    @122 “If you lend a book, you cannot read it.”

    Wrong I can still read it by making a copy for myself before I lend it

  • Anonymous

    @124

    You don’t need incentives for books, art or science. Jonas Salk, the man who discovered the polio vaccine (the disease that was crippling millions of people), when he was asked in a televised interview who owned the patent to the vaccine, Salk replied: “There is no patent. Could you patent the sun?”

    You can’t patent information. There is no such thing as intelectual property. Its like saying you own electrons inside brains, that exchange information (culture).

  • Recton Kracke

    @122 huh?

    Oh come on now. I lend and borrow a lot of physical books. I’ve never lent out a book I haven’t read already. So much for being deprived of it. I never really want them back either. In my peer group we are always buying different books, reading and then lending them in a big circle. Should this be illegal?

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  • dingdong63632

    Joinhttp://www.clotheshops.usyou will find everything you wish here.

  • Hassan

    Create something of value and it will always sell no matter what.

    Good movies do Good at theaters no matter whether there is file sharing or no file sharing.
    Removing file sharing might affect a small % of sales, but it’s not even close to what they depict.

    I’ve seen over 8 movies at the theaters in the past 2 months. And I’ve seen over 18 torrented movies as well.
    If I wasn’t able to get those 18 movies torrented, it doesnt mean I will go to the cinema and watch them.

    I just won’t watch them.

    Release something of value, and I grantee that people will see it.

  • BF America

    Finally, common sense…BUT…. How many of you out there use iTunes? To me they are the absolute worst at limiting use of content..I refuse to use ANY iSTUFF !! No iphone, no itunes, no ipod no I nothing..I have NEVER been able to transfer ANYTHING purchased from iXXXXXX to ANY other hardware..THAT SUCKS and so does Ieverything…
    I know a little off topic BUT it is the same use issue!

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  • Sc0rp

    And then TPB moved to Spain.

  • Jen

    Wow this is crazy.
    http://www.k2incenseblend.com

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  • SOE

    victoire!

  • Jean Claude

    There is a powerful lobby controlled by the media industry here in Spain, who controls the goverment. Repressive laws are going to be approved this summer. From now on judges won’t be able to decide if a website is closed, but the goverment does. Does that sound crazy? Spain sucks.

  • Sarah Duvane

    So, let’s go down the list…When Led Zepplin II came out I was nine. I took my lawn mowing money and purchased the vinyl. When I turned 16 and bought a car with babysitting money I purchased the 8 track (no snickering)When it was pointed out that cassettes were better, I purchased the cassette. During this time I also made cassette mix tapes for my friends with blank media provided by the media industry such as SONY, Maxell, TDK, etc… Where were the trials for piracy then? Oh, wait, could it be that a percentage of the purchase of blank media went to the labels and not the artists I was recording have anything to do with this oversight? Surely I was not the only one doing this.
    Obviously, I went on to purchase the CD of an album that I have now purchased four separate times. It seems through all the format changes we, the consumer, have been burned over the years.

    Now that the record button on my cassette deck has been replaced by a click and a faster more efficient way of distributing my enormous collection of music that I have purchased 4 separate times (I have 10,000 vinyl records and 25,000+ CD’s) to a life long cost of nearly $300,000.00 they are now freaking out. People will always pay for quality! The media industries produce a large amount of crap, and radio, tv and what is left of print play and promote the crap because they are getting paid to do so. Without FS or P2P we would never find what is actually worth purchasing.

    I do not agree with the judges analogy, but I do agree with his ruling.

    How many people test drive cars or, try on clothes before we buy? P2P allows me to test drive the music before I buy, but now that the cover art, liner notes and such are also dying, why buy? I am actually getting less for my money.

    Also, this argument that iTunes saves the consumer money makes me laugh!
    A. 0.99 per track + 13 tracks on a CD is $12.87
    B. Led Zepplin II=9tracks for $13.15 from a label, but $4.68 on Amazon http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B000002J03/ref=dp_olp_new?ie=UTF8&qid=1276292477&sr=1-3&condition=new

    With iTunes you get a file then pay extra for art, liner notes whatever. RIP OFF!

    I feel I have given THESE PIRATES (the labels) enough of my hard earned money on faith that their product is worth the expense. I have no more faith in their taste. I am test driving everything from now on!

    Now, with the business model failing why would the Labels allow iTunes to sell their product? It seems all the money the industry has paid out to try and stop pirating could be used to launch a store for each label cutting Mr. Jobs out therefore realizing a higher profit margin for both the label and the artist with even a lower cost to the consumer.

    Did I really just type all of this drivel? To PIRATE a phrase;
    That is just my opinion, I could be wrong.

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  • Anonymous

    NO ONE EXPECTS THE SPANISH LEGAL SYSTEM!

    Damn, I’m proud of you, Spain!

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  • DM

    “But don’t say that you should be able to walk to your nearest bookstore and take anything you want”

    yes you can, there called libraries

  • SwissPir8

    Downloading *anything* is 100% legal too in Switzerland. Same goes for posession: e.g. police find you with 30’000 MP3 files on your laptop? No problem _AT ALL_.

    For you to get into troubles they’d have to produce evidence that you were uploading that stuff. And they usually can’t. They don’t even care.

    There was a recent case in Switzerland where a 18 years old girl was found guilty of having shared 4200 songs and 270 movies. Her punishment: a fine of CHF 400.– and two years of probation. Only if she gets caught again during those two years she might have to do 30 days of jail time (Swiss jails are like luxury hotels in other countries …).

    And that ruling was heavily criticised here in Switzerland for being “too harsh”. :-)

    4470 counts of copyright infringement. A fine of about CHF 0.08948 per infringement if you get caught uploading that stuff …

    Hey, that’s a good price :)

    Getting caught downloading stuff here is a total non-issue because as I said it’s 100% legal. Swiss ISP’s even use this for advertisements, e.g. “Your downloads will be faster with our network! Get your Cable modem here!”, even the government-owned Swisscom does that. :-)

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  • Anonymous

    <3 "likened file-sharing to the ancient practice of sharing books."

    Ner..ner….nerdgasm.

  • monster

    <3 "likened file-sharing to the ancient practice of sharing books."

    Ner..ner….nerdgasm.

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