TorrentFreak

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Spain Fast Tracks P2P Site Shutdowns

The Spanish cabinet has today passed legislation that will enable the authorities to shut down file-sharing sites more rapidly. The new legislation gives in to the demands of the US and local copyright lobby, who see Spain’s lenient copyright law as a thorn in their side.

Operating a file-sharing oriented website without profiting directly from infringements falls within the boundaries of the law in Spain. In an attempt to change this situation, the Spanish Government has today passed new legislation under which sites offering links to copyright works could be taken offline within days of a complaint.

Under the new law, a newly formed Intellectual Property Commission will file complaints with a judge, who will then have to decide within four days whether or not a site should be pulled offline. The law is the result of an extensive lobby from the entertainment industries who have criticized Spain’s lenient stance towards file-sharing sites.

The Government’s plans have been met with firm opposition from the public. Critics of the new legislation are outraged and argue that it represents a violation of individual Internet users’ rights.

“Copyright should not be placed above citizens’ fundamental rights to privacy, security, presumption of innocence, effective judicial protection and freedom of expression,” wrote a group of activists recently in a response manifesto on the rights of Internet users.

Initially, the proposed legislation would allow for the closure of file-sharing sites without a warrant or judicial oversight. In the latest plans a judge does have to review the takedown request to guarantee that no fundamental rights are violated.

Although the new text has improved, there are still many critics who claim that no websites should be taken offline without going through all the judicial steps to actually confirm that they operate illegally.

Tomorrow, a group of bloggers, experts, and activists will meet in Madrid to coordinate actions to defend civil rights on the Internet. Many feel that the new legislation has been fast-tracked after pressure from the US and local entertainment industry lobbyists, without carefully reviewing the implications it has for the public.

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  • Rob

    I hope every single industry lobbyist ends up with cancer. Every single one.

  • Dude1975

    First

  • no name

    So I do. Although something that kills them faster (but not without pain) would help.

  • Tired of the stupid troll

    Get ready for a completely ignorant comment from raisin brain or one of his many other sock puppets! I think I’m going to start calling him Muffin the Mule, because he is such an ass!

    On topic:
    This just proves that all politicians are corrupt and can be bought!

  • Tired of the stupid troll

    @Dude1975
    You are a wanker!

  • Jonnara

    Just goes to show the politicians make laws for big corporates/money.

    Not for the common people they represent and voted them in office.

  • \\.neo.styles|sSG

    “Copyright should not be placed above citizens’ fundamental rights to privacy, security, presumption of innocence, effective judicial protection and freedom of expression,” wrote a group of activists recently in a response manifesto on the rights of Internet users.

    Desperate times call for deseperate measures. These days, privacy is largely used as an excuse to avoid the scrutiny of the law. If pirates weren’t so short sighted, they would have realized that continuous out of control infringement (theft) would leave the entertainment industry with little choice. It sounds alot like they are saying “You should respect our privacy rights by ignoring sights that promote rampant infringement.” Pirates forfeited their privacy when they decided that they were special and that the law didn’t apply to them.

    As with many other laws, the panicking of “people trying to protect internet rights” are simply those horrified at the idea that they might have to start paying for things. Theft is not right. Compensation is the only legal way for a reason. What are they afraid of? If the site is simply offering wallpapers up for download, then their will be no chance that it will get taken down. Only illegal sites need concern themselves with getting taken down, which is why these activists are probably worried about not being able to download copyrighted material anymore.

  • kottonface

    @4 I am in total agreement. Money makes the world go ’round. Those with the funds make the rules, as sad as that is…it’s true. :(

  • Eight

    :) lol

  • Sendaii

    This is madness. It was only a few months ago that TorrentFreak ran a story on some activists sharing files outside a Spanish government office (I think it was a government office anyway, could have been the office of a record label. They are pretty much one and the same nowadays anyway, so it doesn’t really matter) to prove that file sharing for private use is legal. It only shows that any law or legislation you want can be bought, if you have the cash.

  • IHeard

    Does Spain have a pirate party and if so where were they when all this was going on?

    If they don’t have a pirate party then I obviously had nothing to say :-)

  • Phoenix

    lol spain is just a US state ^^
    in fact all europe is

  • Anonymous

    Spain seem to have quite a few hackers…

  • Virotelisa

    Why do governments think they can just create laws that evade any rights to a legal defense before being convicted?

    Isn’t it plain hypocritical that European politicians debate about ethics on immigration, other countries, religion and what else while they just plainly ignore any such ethics when they are in their path?

    @11
    Who will be the first to feed this troll? He is hungry ;P

  • Anonymous

    Preemptive comment…

    @Reasoned Mind

    Obvious troll is obvious.

  • Abbernomad

    …”under which sites offering links to copyright works could be taken offline within days of a complaint.”

    That seems like a lot of misplaced power. How can we allow a big company to shut down ‘undesireable’ sites with a simple complaint letter?

    Sorry Spain, I’m from the US. Let me paint you a picture. I download all my media (movies/music/etc.) from a neighbor’s unsecured Wi-Fi. I’ve so far collected over 2 1/2 terabytes of material. We have those takedown notices. They are annoying…for my neighbors, who have no clue what’s going on. My point? Sounds to me like Spain is fast tracking to becoming a similar draconian model of the US. There are no consumer rights as of this writing. You are immediately presumed guilty. Your internet will be shut off, and to restore your service, you must write a letter of request (or call) and state that you have removed infringing material. (Isn’t that an admission of guilt? How clever of them!) Good luck, suckers!

    Get a load of this:
    Counter Notification to Claimed Copyright Infringement
    The counter notification must provide the following information:
    #2 Identification of the material that has been removed or to which access has been disabled and the location at which the material appeared before it was removed or access to it was disabled;
    #3 A statement under penalty of perjury that the subscriber has a good faith belief that the material was removed or disabled as a result of mistake or misidentification;

    SELCO will comply with the Digital Millennium Copyright Act by expeditiously removing, or disabling access to, the material that is claimed to be infringing or to be the subject of infringing activity.

    (Their method is to shut you off, and wait for you to call asking WTF!?!)

    Source: http://www.shrewsbury-ma.gov/egov/docs/1231964468767.htm

  • George

    Abbernomad, that does sound like an admission of guilt! If they shut mine off I would tell them “Ok, just cancel my service, I will take my business and my money elsewhere!”
    Enough people doing that and their bottom line dropping like a ton of bricks might change their tune!

    Another thing, why do they need ME to provide THEM with the identification of the material? Don’t they already know or are they just fishing?

  • meh

    here is a list of all the known pirate parties.
    http://twitter.com/OvernetUser/pirate-parties

  • PO

    Also in Spain, Blubster owner Pablo Soto’s trial on copyright infringement charges was set to start several months ago. Does anyone know how that case has progressed?

  • Anonymous

    Spaniard here.

    I’m sad and furious. Politicians have done what we all assumed they’d do: bent under the pressure of lobbyists. They’ve lied to us. They told us sweet lies: “Everything’s gonna be OK”, “No websites will be shut down.”

    They lied to us, my Preciousssss.

    Rage!

    Protests will immediately ensue. I’m not sure if they’ll be effective.

    :(

  • Quartz

    “Copyright should not be placed above citizens’ fundamental rights to privacy, security, presumption of innocence, effective judicial protection and freedom of expression,” wrote a group of activists recently in a response manifesto on the rights of Internet users.”

    Agreed, we can not give in to state sponsored terror and nor should we, if they want to play the facist state then we must treat them to their own medicine and deny them their human rights in any manner possible, what goes around comes around.

  • Le Fake

    I don’t understand what there is in P2P that makes legislators go all haywired.

    If such almost dictatorship like laws were passed concerning almost any other subject, there would be a massive outbreak of rage.

    Maybe it’s just that the “ordinary” citizens don’t know or give a crap about IT related stuff.

  • Ninja

    You can always work around anything. However, it’s important that you can speak and defend yourself. Trackers can be legal. File sharing may be ruled legal, even in the US we’ve seen decisions favorable to the file sharers. IT’s just a matter of being careful of how you share and operate the trackers.

    Share but buy content too. Operate the tracker but keep your finances open and don’t get huge amounts for yourself. It’s easy to be legal even being ‘illegal’.

  • found it
  • markie

    Why does every country live up the USA arse? Why doesn’t the USA just control the whole world.

  • Abbernomad

    Ammendment to #15: Selco holds a monopoly service over the town. There are no alternative services.

    Also…Spaniards made good pirates a few hundred years back. How fare ye now, Matey?

  • prodigydancer

    No kind of legislation can stop us anyway. :-)

    And, by the way, I think we need to respond to this with MORE sharing.

  • Anonymous

    One way to deal with this is to carpet bomb the few entertainment parasites friendly music distribution web sites such as iTune with complaints.

    If one do a good job at it we will flood the system and very quickly the “law” will become inapplicable.

    Then they will put a law against abusive complaints and then we will respond with complaints against abusive complaints.

  • Bobby Montan

    No way are you kidding me this is crazy

    Jesseee

  • bork

    ok … i too am tired of the Anonymous / Reasoned Mind payrolled samefagging … bye bye TF :(

  • lastbastard

    It is not a law but a proposal of law. It will have not an easy travel through Spanish parliament.

    I am Spaniard.

  • FOI

    Good. End the commercialism. End the control.

    “It is good to strike the serpent’s head with your enemy’s hand.”

  • Anonymous

    @7

    Obvious troll is obvious.

  • TerribleTony

    Bah, it’s just fluff, if the Spanish gov are foolish enough to cripple their own IT industry, then be it on their own heads.

    I hear the world economy is down the pan at the moment.

  • Donkey Pirate

    Remember to tell everyone you know about how the mafiaa.org has corrupted the whole world. We have seen it through the years on great blogs like tf.

  • hmmm

    As Chomsky ironically said in several lectures, free market laws are only for peasants (us). The big companies do lobbying just so they don’t have to take any risk.

    This is another attempt, if not demonstration, that all interests them is complete control of distribution.

    Their agenda is simple, and in the “culture industry”, it’s :
    1: kill the free solution and buy or lead to bankrupcy websites they can’t control (understand : the ones that don’t want to charge 1$ or 1€ per track)
    2: ???
    3: profit

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  • FOI

    Good. End the commercialism. End the control.

    “It is good to strike the serpent’s head with your enemy’s hand.”

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  • ha ha ha

    I love this.

    Slowly the screws are turning on you leeches.

  • America

    America FUCK YEAH!

    Seriously these guys give us a bad name… We’re not all corporate whores.

  • Cordelia

    Sad to hear that the Spanish government can’t stand up to a bit of whinging from the US.

    At least wait until the US threatens trade embargo like it did with Sweden.

    How long are we Europeans going to have the US tell us how to run our countries?

    We even have 200,000 US soldiers on European soil right now.. Why?

    There is something rotten in the state of… Europe…
    As Hamlet would have said.

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  • Anonymous

    @Reasoned Mind
    “they would have realized that continuous out of control infringement (theft)”

    “infringement (theft)”?

    Infringement and theft are two entirely different legal issues, you amazing master of law. They aren’t two seperate names for the same thing, as you seem to be under the delusional impression they are. You might as well be saying “cat (dog)”.

    @Reasoned Mind
    “Theft is not right.”

    You know what isn’t right?

    Lying.

    Yet you relentlessly tell the lie that filesharing is theft. You can’t plead ignorance considering how many times it’s been explained to you that the meaning of theft is to deprive another person of their property by taking it away from them without their consent, while filesharing leaves the property being shared in the possession of its owner and therefore is not theft, as it fails to meet the criteria for being theft.

    So it’s not like you just don’t know any better. You do know better, it’s just that you’re consciously lying.

    That makes your preaching about right and wrong pretty funny. Gee, should I take moral lessons from the hypocritical liar?

    Hmm, that’s a tough one…

    @Reasoned Mind
    “Only illegal sites need concern themselves with getting taken down”

    What is and isn’t illegal is decided at the whim of lawmakers, who are often bribed by lobbyists to tilt the law in the favour of wealthy special interests. Like the entertainment industry.

    If you honestly think without any variables or shades of grey that illegal automatically equals wrong, then I have to wonder how old you are. Three? Maybe four?

    Your idea that “only lawbreakers need to concern themselves with being taken down” is a favourite defense of various despot regimes and oppressive governments throughout history when outlawing the privacy and human rights of their citizens is called into question.

    Oh, do you have a problem with our Great and Exalted President For Life because he made free speech illegal? Well, only a criminal would concern themselves with what is illegal, so you must be a criminal! Off to the gulag with you!

  • Cujo

    and before u know it ,, the whole thing will be behind a vpn ;)

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  • Dia

    Why are they *meeting* to talk about the *internet*. Use irc, forums, etc.

  • Rob in Madrid

    I’m a bit confused by this. It says the government can shutdown file sharing sites, but I assume only those that are in Spain. the simple answer would be move else where much like TPB did and other sites have done, is that not correct. Even as a not techy computer user I’ve found ways to avoid leaving trails, it’s pretty simple.

  • Reasoned Mind

    My nick has been changed from Reasoned Mind to “Sodomize Me” From now on please call me by that name

  • Realist

    @25 it does! ,before you know it well all have restrictions in place , and well be running darknets!. they failed at isp level now theyre going after the govs. who will bend over and take it!. Fuck the Corporations! and the Governments what we need is a revolution. before you know it our air will be taxed!

  • qwer

    I even wonder, as a European, what the US has actually contributed to a better world since WW2. Nuclear bombs on Japan, wars in Korea, Nam, Iraq etc pp.

    I know really lots of people over here, which really are anti-american, and Obama has not changed this that much.

    Whatever will hapen to p2p in the future: I vote for not buying from the corporations, boycott hollywood and all their celebrity-crap, Microsoft and Google and GM and allthese investmentbanks and…

  • well.ok

    ReasonedMind/Anonymous troll/anti-troll samefagging IS obvious — probably TF staff member — LOL losers.

  • Angry Spaniard

    @42 True, the government can’t shutdown sites which are outside Spain, but they’ll force ISP to block access to those “offending sites”. Did anybody said China?

  • Yarrr I Be a Doctor

    unless we could host a site in international waters? , you would need some hardware!

  • Anonymous

    @39

    I’ve seen your efforts in other threads to tear Reasoned Mind apart. While I applaud you, I also have to say that you’re basically wasting your time. Reasoned Mind is nothing but a troll, and is not affected by even the keenest and most obvious corrections.

    Also, did you post in the wrong thread? I don’t see a response by him in here.

    TorrentFreak needs to crack down on the trolls, tho…

  • Anonymous

    I found something better and is legal LoL

    I don’t use their crap I use services that enforce liberal copyright licenses.

    Just like you are told to look at the labels of food you should look for licenses that give you what you want.

    Magnatune and Jamendo for music are great alternatives.

    Now stop buying crap from those people.

    Encrypt everything(your privacy) if you put it in the open it gets abused and part of that responsability if from people who don’t use encryption, more people should start teaching other how to encrypt everything (emails, IMs, web surfing and etc).

    If you can’t live without your fix of media from the parasites at least be smart about it, dump bittorrent for a client that is anonymous and encrypted.

    Now when everything starts being encrypted and anonymous I would like to see them stop anything.

    But really people need to start changing their behaviour, stop using things from those people and they will come back begging for your attention but by them it will be to late a new form of culture will be born a free one.

  • ET

    i just want to make a few points that have been made on here before but seem relivant.

    1: 1700′s free trade was the big NO NO because the very same thing happend, watched makers in in europe made watches better than in the UK and CHEAPER… now its a given and part of being in a free labour society.

    2: copying isnt stealing… its copying… copyright used to protect the artist from other artist copying them… its all got wrong

    3: its the failure of the music industry FAT OLD MEN who refused to see the future thats got them in the mess. Its happening in my favourite sport F1: tv money is going to disappear (free to air will exisit but FREE for the broadcaster – PAY will still existing but need to UP THERE GAME!!)… and the money is only going to be made from people turning up at the venue. like the music industyr – to download should be free (you only get a copy of the music), to buy a CD will remain (you get something for your money) but the real money will be made at the VENUES by seeing the artist and with buying tshirt etc etc…

    its not the end of people buy cd’s… its just less importants- its CHANGE!

    bob dylan said it. times they are a changing.

    http://www.epictorrents.com

  • lilars

    @#2 Dude, lol,time to hang up your pistol…you’re way to slow on the draw.But then you will probably try again.

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  • lilars

    File sharing does not hurt a good product that comes from the entertainment industry.It even allows for the crap to get wide distributorship.

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  • Black Swan

    ET whether you dl or buy a CD – it’s the music you (should) be buying. The CD is only a data container, worth about 2p. You don’t pay £4.99 for the CD, you py for a licence to play the music as you don’t owe it.

    You had to pay for your hard drive. That holds the data. Please try to explain better why Music should be free.

    IN that case as electricity companies get their electons back and then pour them into earth at the generating end, electricity should be free and you should only pays for the wires to your house!

    Broadband should be free, it’s just data like 1s & 0s on a CD a, you should just pay for the telephone cable?

  • Black Swan

    @Anonymous
    Obviously enraged by RM is obvious
    LOL

    You want to read your own posts mate

    Opinion is the right to disagree in free speech countries.

    You accuse RM of wanting to stop free speech and then want to stop his free spech.

    You ever thought of being a stand up comedian?

    You’d be better at that than trying to be an anti troll-troll (obvious anti troll is obvious troll)

    RM does’t put his arguments well but surely as an avid “I have a right to fileshare and free (content) campaigner, he should be free to put his point.
    Otherwise you are doing exactly what you so forcibly complain he is doing. You are just the same really

    Obvious hypocrite is obvious

    He doesn’t want you to exercise your (dubious) right to share.
    You don’t wish him to put a counterpoint argument.
    hate to see your dictatorship state too.

  • Duke

    @11 Spain does have a Pirate Party (http://www.partidopirata.es) but according to my sources, they are waiting for an official draft of the law to be released on Monday before commenting. The details in the press at the moment are mainly speculation (which can often be misleading, as we saw in the UK with the Digital Economy Bill).

    Apparently the news so far has just been that the cabinet have discussed this and have agreed to move to a consultation stage in the process. It seems that this measure was added at the last minute to a much larger “Sustainable Economy Law” – the plan seems to be to sneak this in on the end of an important bill.

    As for Partido Pirata’s actions so far, they have released some press releases and been on national radio, but the storm over this issue is just getting started; hopefully we will hear a lot more from them over the next few weeks.

  • a US citizen

    @qwer and any other euro hater!

    The MPAA, RIAA, BREIN, IFPI do not represent the will of the U.S. Government or it’s citizens. They represent the will and interests of huge multinational corporations not wholly owned by people from the U.S., but by rich investors worldwide. Sony (Japan), Sony BMG (Japan and Germany), Vivendi Universal (France), and EMI (Britain), are not U.S. Companies at all!

    So take your hate shove it up your ass!

  • Anonymous

    @53 Jan 09, 2010 at 18:32 by Black Swan:

    Music should be free because there is no way to enforce a ridiculous ownership or rights against people who listen to it and there is no way to rationalize it to make sense either.

    Radio didn’t kill musicians income and filesharing will not too.

    But if for no other reason here is one very compelling. Do not treat your customers like thiefs or you shall find yourself begging at the streets sooner then later. I will never buy anything from a big label again, I will never “buy”(rent more like it) anything that has a copyright sign on it.

    I’m one and everyday one more joins me.

    Piracy is the last problem of copytards the competition from different ideas will creates a different ecosystem eventually that will force those people to change whether they like it or not.

    Alternatives are being created because of this feuld and it will be free eventually and legal.

    Piracy was the symptom of a problem not the cause and it will evolve and turn copytards everywhere into dodo’s.

    There is just so much that society will bear. This is the last call, change or be changed either way with piracy or no piracy things will change.

  • Anonymous

    Why would anyone “buy”(rent is the correct term) anything from copytards is beyond me.

    You can’t share it, you can’t use it so what is the point in renting anything from this people?

    People are serious about hurting the copytards?

    Do your own stuff and make it GPL, Copyleft or CC 3.0(sharealike).

    Turn your backs to the bullies and see how different the attitude will be.

    Those people are having record profits and is being paid by you people.

    Don’t go to concerts of copyrighted artists, don’t buy CDs don’t buy merch from them and more importantly don’t use that crap. It is crap and doesn’t have any value if it cannot be used and shared and by not using it you are stating very clearly what YOU value most your RIGHTS this is war people be aware of what you consume.

    Copyright is poison don’t drink from it.

  • cwrw

    Franco is back at last

  • BlueBeard

    I’m Laughing at all the trolls that come in here and lecture about copyright laws and intellectual property! Since when does US copyright law apply to other countries? It really shouldn’t. Big Wigs in Hollywood simply payoff politicians in Spain to adopt their laws, which shouldn’t apply to another country period! Totally absurd. Hopefully the people of Spain will realize this and have their own french revolution. As long as people are simply sharing with one another its not stealing. Besides, US copyright law should not be imposed on other countries.

  • Anonymous

    @48

    Reasoned Mind isn’t a regular troll.

    He’s one of these guys:
    http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/issues/issue_62/363-Im-Evil

    Except where “Jack” only shills products, one of Reasond Mind’s clients is the copyright industry, so his job includes posting anti-P2P drivel on the internet.

    Not replying to him is the worst thing to do, ’cause that just makes it easier for him. His mission here is basically to “win hearts and minds” for the copyright industry. Not our’s, though. The hearts and minds of the fencesitters, the technologically clueless, and the uninitiated.

    The masses, in otherwords.

    Before you say it’s crazy to think a person can reach the masses through Torrent Freak, go to Google and search for p2p, or p2p torrent, or p2p bittorrent, or the pirate bay, or filesharing news. Torrent Freak is on first page of hits.

    Every day this site must be visited by an absolute buttload of curious bystanders who want to know more about filesharing, and Reasoned Mind’s given task is to turn their opinions against it. Or at least try to.

    For that to happen, the most important thing he needs to do is appear credible. So first, he needs people to not rip his comments to shreds. That’s why he always runs away if you clobber him good enough, but why he sticks around if the only arguments against are just weak insults. Second, he needs people to agree with him. That’s why he writes comments under a couple of different names(neostyles is one of them). Third, he needs some way of wearing down people who argue with him so they’ll eventually give up and quit. That’s why he says the same things* over, and over, and over, and over, and over, and over again… So that at some point his opponent will hopefully realize they’re just going around in circles and quit in frustration.

    As for why I reply to him, I hate hired plants and get more pleasure than I probably should out of stomping them. :D

    *A comprehensive list of every comment that ever was and ever will be made by Reasoned Mind:
    1. Filesharing is stealing. Admit it!
    2. Filesharers only do it because they like free stuff. Admit it!
    3. It’s not Hollywood’s fault that they’re trying to turn the internet into a virtual police state, it’s filesharers’ fault.
    4. Jammie Thomas got what she had coming.
    5. The Pirate Bay generates millions of dollars in profits every month… For its RACIST ARYAN MASTERS!!
    6. You’re only attacking me because I have a dissenting opinion.
    7. The end of filesharing is nigh!

    @Black Swan

    I don’t want to sound insulting… But you need to take some more English language classes, man. I don’t think you understand enough to join an argument in it yet.

    But hey, seriously, don’t feel bad. You’re probably waaaaaaaay better at English than I am at your native language. ;)

  • Duke

    @60 – the prevalence of US copyright law is particularly ironic given that they didn’t even ratify the Berne Convention (the first big international copyright treaty) until 1989, over 100 years after it was set up. In fact, much of the motivation behind it was that the US was ignoring international copyright for their own gain.

    Unfortunately, since the 1880s, the US corporations have realised that copyright (originally set up to protect the content creators from the middle-men industries; then the publishing industry) could be manipulated and distorted to their gain. Copyright itself is quite a nice idea in itself (although it should be considered a “privilege” rather than a “right”) it just needs to be returned to something even vaguely resembling the original law.

  • ok

    @45 Hmmmmm. The quantity – and indeed quality – of tl;dr troll/anti-troll posts *is* suspiciously high. Could TF be practicing a kind of boosterism?

  • ok

    HA! TF, you’re moderating based on IP! And why? well ‘caause i rumbled you’re rm/anon samefagging and won’t shut-up about! losers!!!

  • alienjoe

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  • Reasoned Mind

    @7 \\.neo.styles|sSG = by Reasoned Mind

    “Desperate times call for deseperate measures.”

    You are right and this is why we are eradicating the entertainment corporate parasites right now as we speak. These piece of shit are not needed, not wanted and WE the customer decide who got our money and who don’t.

    Soon they will be nothing left of these corporate terrorists and you will lose your job.

    We have to protect our societies and our countries.

    As far as privacy is concerned we have the tools and the will to remain private regardless the corporation of parasites, like it or not.

    And stop using multiple names. You sound stupid.

  • Spaniard

    No pasarán

  • Duplicator

    @56: are you effing retarded? You pay for the hard drive, the storage DEVICE, not for the DATA, what the hell were you implying?

    Last time I checked, people still have to pay for CD-ROMs and the CD itself (but it’s cheap), just like they have to pay for hard drives.

    You pay for hard-drive, yes. If I put $1000 worth of data on it doesn’t mean I paid $1000 for the hard drive…

  • Obedient

    I have only one thing to say: Get all you can NOW! Because tomorrow it all might end.
    My home pc is working nonstop nowadays, day and night, downloading and seeding. As far as “theft” is concerned, how about our governments robbing us blind thru their “TAX” system?! When are they going to stop THAT???!!

  • Anonymoose

    @64 Anonymous

    “Reasoned Mind isn’t a regular troll.”
    Agreed! I have been tracking his FUD all over the web and I am compiling a complete set of all his posts to better combat his BS. People that are less net savvy do need to see that what he posts is pure rubbish and without merit or without any backing links or data. Many times when I have cornered him on one subject or another he just vanishes to reappear on some other post and ignores any attempt to answer the earlier questions.

    I posted a comment here the other day listing but a few of his posts. The links post did not show up until the next day because of the hated “post being moderated” crap! I do have to question why the mods at TF continue to allow his posts when he is a known troll/shill, whatever? Free speech is one thing but he adds nothing of value to the comment stream.

    As far as “Black Swan” goes, he may just be another of RMs many sock puppets. Pay attention to his line of “reasoning”.

  • Long John Silver hates copy right infringment loylists

    neo.styles when you go to the libary and borrow a book is that not stealing to that was or is someones intrlectual property you did not give any publisher money for the book mmmmm or when you watch free tv at home or in the pub mmmm so i now call for all libarys that condone person to person (P2P)book leanding to also include films music. So why can a book be borrowed and a film or music not be borrowed for free so your telling me i have to spend my money on an album or film i have only seen or herd a bit of that media and if i dont like it iv lost my money and thats that so your telling me i dont have the right to try before i buy thank you for that insight nopenis.styles and what copyright agency do you work for styles? is it MPAA, CRIA, RIAA or IFPI or are you a dumb musician who has had a pay cut from your record company and they blamed it on the downloader rather than the fact your a crapy musician and no one likes your music long live P2P file sharing

    PS. listen to Dan Bull music all about file sharing his 2 best songs just now are dear Lily and dear Mandy all on youtube listen to them hes the man he proves music does not have to cost a lot to produce good quality music he is the futer of file sharing long live the futer Dan Bulls of the world

    I love the smell of a revalusion in the morning yummy

  • StarForce

    I’m Spanish and downloads won’t stop here. For sure.

  • Yatti420

    Good ol Spain.. Now hopefully they can get rid of the lobbyists while still refusing to allow their cases to go to court..

  • ET

    @Black Swan
    i understand the electrical thing you said… but you can get energy for free ie not from a company buy getting Photovoltaec cells etc… they actually pay you for the electricity.

    I’ll make my point crystal clear. the industry has moved on. no longer is the commodity of ‘music’ anymore. its change because of the internet. (like record msuic has changed….) now the commodity for music is the live gigs. the music is the advertisment for the gig!! and cd in the shop is the half way house of the adveristment of the gig!!!
    do you understand it now. now long is buy its just what it should be a rental of the music. to advertise going to the gig to see the kings of leon!!
    i would never have brought there album… but i am now going to see them live… do yo uunderstand @Black Swan

    - and another thing music labels are dead. i predicit myspace will become the first internet record label – it started years ago and its moving towards that at a fast pass. where anyone can signed etc… but the A&R guy who is really in trouble because bands can find themselves.. and get people to there gigs to earn money. No longer will be the day when ‘to get signed by EMi or BMG’ was the holly grail.
    it will become the number of people you have at gigs to get you more gigs and interent popularity!! get it@Black Swan

    oh and one more thing @Black Swan you dont own the music you pay for so why buy itit you owned it… then they would have a point = if you whne you paid for its just an advertisement for the band!
    i lost all my itunes downloadsefore christmas… i dont get that back even though i paid for it…

    http://www.epictorrents.com

  • ET

    ps sorry for the typos etc i am tired and the dyslexia is kicking in. apologise everyone

    http://www.epictorrents.com

  • Reasoned Mind

    Clone me not ???(?_?)???

  • me

    Not surprised. Not at all. There’s a master plan by the European Commission to wage war against us file sharers, and every EU country MUST implement this plan. It doesn’t matter how unpopular it is locally, it WILL be ratified everywhere. That’s the way democracy is supposed to work in the EU.

    Those who thought Spain would be an exception and would resist such tendencies have been proven wrong. In the Copyright Wars, we have not a single state on our side… yet.

    So, we file sharers will act in self-defense against those abusive monopolistic laws (copyright is nothing more than state-enforced monopolies on distribution, think of it!), and switch over to even more distributed, anonymous technologies.

    Let’em forbid us breathing air, we’ll still do anyway. They’ll have to kill all of us to stop us. ;)

  • Bella

    they are not forbidding you breathing air and are not killing you off… such dramatic statements LOL

    they are just putting some regulations into place to deter you from stealing that which you are enjoying for free whilst having complete disregard and disrespect for the creator of your stolen goods! THE ARTIST

    so now I guess I will be called a troll for having a different opinion to the majority here.

  • hmmm @81

    You’re not a troll, you’re just a simple minded propaganda eater.

    Repeating falsehoods a million times, until it becomes truth ?

    In that case, your “truth” might free us from the “culture industry”.

    “Artists” who have problems earning money in big labels, maybe they are just “has beens” ? The same rules should apply to them, as to us.
    If you can’t make a living out of your job, consider doing something else.

    But it’s easier to yell for more money until it comes, than to actually earn it honestly.

    That’s one of the main features of capitalism.

  • Anonymous

    “Repeating falsehoods a million times, until it becomes truth ?”

    Insanity is doing the same thing over and over, expecting different results.

  • Recton Kracke

    @ # 80 Me

    The trolls and naysayers here on TF have been desperately trying to convince us that the ‘copyright wars’ as you put it are still going on. It’s over. We won a decade ago.

    “What most people don’t dare realize is that it is no longer relevant to even ask the question of wether free downloads are right or not. No matter what people think about file sharing, one must understand that the moral and legal rights are no longer applicable. The battle is over. The filesharing communities won’t budge. Now Pirate Bay has more visitors every week than London or New York have inhabitants.

    How can anyone seriously believe that those tens of millions of people will just simply dissapear? By now everyone must realize that any adjustments by the rights- holders will be immediatley countered by the file sharers.”

    Stolen from the Rednex essay, cause I couldn’t have said it better myself.

    regards RC

  • \\neo.styles|sSG

    Desperate times call for deseperate measures. These days, privacy is largely used as an excuse to avoid the scrutiny of the law.
    I really don’t see why we should need search warrants for house or living quarter searches.
    Actually I don’t understand why we even have trials.
    Back in the day when I was still working an honest day’s job in the SS, we just shot people in the back of the head if we felt like it.

    Oh, how I miss those days.

    God damn those jews and filesharers, they steal all our hard earned money!

  • userabuser

    Fuk the Spanish kow-tow politicos, Franco would be proud.

    As to the internet users of Spain, I suggest you dump the dot.coms for downloads, filesharing is moving to private invited user sites these days anyway, what you see on tpb etc trickles down from there and newsgroups. I doubt you´ll find a politician that understands Usenet….so use it.

  • Stand up for yourselves

    Europeans in power like Sweden and Spanish talk about rights and the people talk big game, but they’re too much of cowards to step up for their civil rights when they have to.

    Congrats Europe on allowing American Corporations to change your laws.

  • userabuser

    [q]cowards[/q] so you haven´t seen the streets in Greece lately…

    Anyway, when are you ever gonna get people to riot over webstites? The general populations could care less/don´t even understand.

  • jaime ross

    The Current government will lose the support of the young-adult target & lose the next general election.

    They will then remember this…

  • scarlettJacob

    Oh! No that’s such a ridiculous news…It has spoiled all my plans.
    Mio Navman M450D

  • BTGuard - BitTorrent Anonymously

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