Canadian Court Refuses to Ship Megaupload Servers to the US

Ernesto
January 17, 2013
158
MegaUpload
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A Canadian court has rejected a request from the United States to hand over 32 servers hosted by a local provider. Instead of simply handing over all data, which may include personal files of users, the court decided to first determine what files are stored on the machines. Megaupload lawyer Ira Rothken is pleased with the ruling and hopes the United States will be more considerate of the privacy of cloud hosting users when requesting data seizures in the future.

megacan When Megaupload was raided last year the U.S. Government seized 1,103 servers at Carpathia’s hosting facility in the United States.

However, that was not the only hardware used by the file-hosting site. Megaupload also had machines elsewhere including 32 servers at an Equinix datacenter in Canada.

Suspecting that these machines may hold crucial data for the ongoing lawsuit, the U.S. Government asked Canada to hand them over for investigation.

In their request to the court the authorities back up their claim by citing an email from Megaupload staff, stating that the Canadian servers “will serve as a database / number crunching machines.”

Megaupload protested this broad request arguing that the servers may contain a lot of information that’s simply irrelevant to the case. The company asked the court to either deny the request, or appoint an “independent forensic examiner” who can inform the court what kind of files are stored on the 32 servers.

The Ontario court agreed with this reservation, and refused to send the servers to the United States before the contents are confirmed.

“The appropriate balance of the state interest in gathering evidence and privacy interests in information can be struck by an order that the servers be brought before the court [...] so that the court can make an order refining what is to be sent,” the order reads.

This likely means that an expert will be instructed to look at the Equinix servers to see whether the United States has any interest in the data. Until then, the servers will remain where they are.

Megaupload lawyer Ira Rothken is pleased with the ruling which he says protects the interests of users.

“We are pleased that the Canadian Court has issued a ruling designed to protect the privacy rights of Megaupload users,” Rothken told TorrentFreak.

“We hope the United States going forward will take into consideration the privacy rights of cloud storage users before attempting to search and seize servers globally in criminal investigations.”

According to Rothken the public should be very careful as to what information they store on cloud hosting services. He adds that people should use encryption to make sure that their personal files don’t fall into the wrong hands.

“The Government’s aggressive conduct here makes it clear that cloud storage users should strongly consider encrypting what they store in the cloud to use technology as the ultimate guardian of privacy rights,” Rothken adds.

While the old Megaupload didn’t offer built-in encryption, it is no coincidence that the new Mega will.

Kim Dotcom previously told TorrentFreak that he hopes to turn encryption into a mass product with the new Mega, which is scheduled to launch in a few days.

“Our easy to use one-click privacy feature will turn encryption into a mass product. We believe within five years half of all Internet traffic will be encrypted with solutions born from our new API,” Dotcom said last month.

Meanwhile, the legal battles will continue.

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Xult

Indeed… read about this on reddit.
A small but very important victory.
USA courts and politicians really believe they can order foriegb countries to bow and scrape.
Sometimes it works.
But glad to see there is some sanity left in Canada :)
- US Fails Again
  
  They’re few among many that will deny the US’ request for anything… As you can see, the MAFIAA was successful in staging their real life Hollywood takendown of FatMan Kim aka Dr Evil.
  
  Important, yes…But significant? No.
  This is just another drag by the US court…They’ll drag this case for years on years. I wonder how they will try stop the new Mega.
  - Shaken not stirred
    
    ‘I wonder how they will try stop the new Mega.’
    
    Considering the lengths they went to to take down the old on. I guess we’ll be seeing simultaneous special forces raids being conducted on data centres across the world, coupled with massive cyberattacks on any country found hosting anything remotely connected with Mega. FEMA camps will be opening their doors to welcome anyone daring to encrypt anything and drones will be sent out to seek and destroy Dr Evil once and for all.
    - US Fails Again
      
      I had similar idea to that happening…Let’s wait and see.
  - Anonymous
    
    ‘ I wonder how they will try stop the new Mega.’
    
    by any means in their power, legal or not! and it will be done not only to try to please, the US entertainment industries, not only to try to screw Dotcom even further but to try to piss him off so much that he is goaded into the US! whatever way they chose, you can rest assured that there will be no arses kicked there. Biden is up to his neck in this whole fiasco and he will make sure he comes out of it squeaky clean!
  - Jack
    
    Next Thursday MEGA is history. I bet $1.000.000.
    - RAEWEA
      
      You don’t have that money and you won’t have it either.
- 0omg
  
  canada is the new freedom country !!
  - bioglass
    
    no… its not. trust me. Somewhere one of harper’s minions are making a backroom deal to get this to a judge that has his pocket lined with grease.
    - frozar
      
      That’s absurd. We all know that igloos don’t have back rooms.
- bobmail
  
  Not sure it’s really a victory, just another delaying tactic. You can cue Fat Kim a few weeks from now complaining about the slowness of discovery. It’s really funny to watch his defense alternately try to slow everything down and at the same time complain about how slow things are.
  
  Further, As far as being a victory, I think that if a Canadian investigator can find the types of data alleged, then Mega’s team is going to look like their were be obstructionist, rather than protective of anything. I sort of think that their strategy is about the same as human shields, they are sort of trying to claim that you can’t have the bad stuff because you can’t have the good stuff. The judge’s ruling is basically “we want to be sure”, but certainly not a firm no.
  - http://geekhideout.net/ The G33K
    
    No the judge is using what is called Procedural Fairness something that the USA removed decades ago whilst the Commonwealth countries still abide by this doctrine.
    
    If the forensic examiner finds specifically what is being asked for by the USA, and it needs to be highly specific then that will then be handed to the court to then determine if it meets the other requirements under Canadian law for the removal of evidence to another country (things such as privacy, national interest, conflicting statute etc come into that determination very much so). The court could then order it released under seal only or even held by the court and only used in specific circumstances and for nothing else.
    
    This is a pure victory for common sense in this specific area of heavy handedness that the USA is renowned for especially in regards to nations it classifies as friendlies (UK, NZ, Australia, Canada).
  - MadAsASnake
    
    It’s not a hindrance to discovery. What the DOJ is after is a fishing expedition. This is what happens with the US cowboy attitude of shoot first ask questions later. Had the DOJ based the decision to prosecution on cause rather the pocketing wads of Dodd’s cash, it would never have happened.
  - Anon
    
    “It’s really funny to watch his defense alternately try to slow everything down and at the same time complain about how slow things are.”
    
    ok operate a legal business and be located in hong cong and bend over for mafiaa and comply with dmca and even give them entrance to remove stuff and they ass fuck you and then you say dot com should just take it and not stand up for himself, simply so case can go faster and he can get ass ramed by mafiaa and friends or oppose their corrupt system as he was innocent as far as the law goes but they didnt care so i see what u did there. Hide a troll post amongst ok post
  - xpmule
    
    The delay tactic part is kinda dumb i think.. both sides should be doing that as much as possible its all apart of how the court systems works for both sides..
    
    I also think its fair for them to be apprehensive about handing over whole hard drives to the US govt. It was a file hosting service so anything could be on there and some of it may be private and not only that KDC was running a service and he SHOULD be defending his customers from having the data compromised by a 3rd party and worst of all people the US govt.
    If i was a user of Megaupload i would NOT want him handing over data to Americans for ANY reason court case or not.. he’s just protecting the privacy of his customers and not being an obstructionist as you stated..
    
    If someone is fishing then who is that ? Who is the one demanding computers be handed over ?
    
    I agree that this isn’t a victory though but i wonder who else would have just handed them over with no fight ?
    
    I get a kick out of how hard you tried to slant this into a KDC is a bad pirate issue lol
    talk about reaching and grasping at straws lol
    not a very good job either ololl
    - bobmail
      
      Think about it, it Mega has nothing to hide, why would they not want the stuff to be dealt with expeditiously, so they can go back to being Mega? Ever time they throw up another block, another objection, they are just making the process longer.
      
      For me, it looks like they know that if all the pieces are put together in one place, the scope of their operation will be exposed and they will lose big. So instead, they are trying to wear down the DoJ with motions, objections, and so on.
      
      Remember, a couple of weeks from now, Kim will be back complain about how long it’s taking. It’s their way of creating pressure, but really it just makes them look bad.
    - http://gene-poole.tumblr.com Gene Poole
      
      i(f) Mega has nothing to hide,
      
      http://falkvinge.net/2012/07/19/debunking-the-dangerous-nothing-to-hide-nothing-to-fear/
      
      That’s why.
    - Anyone
      
      why should they humour a fishing expedition by the DoJ?
      besides, if they waste ressources on this they have less ressources for other stuff
      
      the DoJ is just pissed that other countries are following the law, instead of just bending over backwards for them
  - http://gene-poole.tumblr.com Gene Poole
    
    The judge’s ruling is basically “we want to be sure”, but certainly not a firm no.
    
    Yes and no. They’re not saying no, but they’re also saying that after the DOJ’s lack of good faith with Kyle Goodwin that they can’t trust them to have access to all the data without a damn good reason. Canada’s about protecting Canadian interests, and Canada isn’t interested in potentially throwing Canadians to the wolves without mea culpa. Despite Vic Toew’s attempts, Canadian law still has strong privacy measures that are actually supported and reinforced, unlike their American counterparts.
Anonymous

the US is not going to stop this witch-hunt. it is going to continue to lie, cheat and deny whatever it has to to achieve it’s aim. in my opinion, that aim is to get Kim back to the US in any way it can so that the deal (if you can call it that) that Biden made with his buddies in the entertainment industries will end in the way they want. this is another case where justice is at the bottom of the pile of wants. winning is the most important, just like it was in the case that has just cost the life of a computer genius!
- TrueCrypt is your friend
  
  Agreed, it will be a huge political embarrassment for the US to either back down or lose this case. They have backed themselves into a corner on this one and it seems by fair means or foul they will continue.
  
  The message is clear enough regarding encryption, anything stored online should be encrypted lest an over zealous government decides to seize the server/servers that are hosting the files.
  - How do I encrypt my data?
    
    Hey Ernesto, how about an article explaining how to encrypt data for the uninitiated?
    - Scary_Devil_Monastery
      
      http://www.truecrypt.org/docs/
      
      Beginner’s tutorial, there you go.
      
      This encrypts static data only – if your computer is up and running, of course, anything it can access without putting in a new password, anyone can access via your computer.
      
      But without that password your hard drive might as well be a brick for any curious parties concerned.
    - http://gene-poole.tumblr.com Gene Poole
      
      Truecrypt was a fun project, I had a good time playing around with it. I ended up not doing my entire HD however, because I can’t figure out how to make a partition behind the system partition. no amount of DDGing could help me, and the forums were a wash.
    - Tom
      
      It’s easy, just use the new Mega, it gives you ‘one click’ encryption every time.
    - Whatever
      
      @ Scary_Devil_Monastery
      
      Encryption is a very good idea however it is not easy.
      
      There are a lot of issues depending on the situation. Mostly it is a fight between easy access, total security and technical possibilities.
      
      If done right in such a way that nobody accesses your data whatever someone might try, encryption becomes very “user unfriendly” (a lot of work).
      
      Would Kim Dotcom really have “the” easy solution to encryption.
    - Easy but…
      
      @Tom “It’s easy, just use the new Mega, it gives you ‘one click’ encryption every time.”
      
      @Whatever “Would Kim Dotcom really have “the” easy solution to encryption”
      
      I’m sure KDC has come up with a very easy process, but being encryption in the browser, I can’t see it will be able to prevent determined MITM attacks. Having the data encrypted before it reaches Mega’s servers seems to be about providing plausible deniability for KDC, not total security of user’s data.
      
      If I had to store something sensitive on Mega’s servers I would still be using something like PGP/GnuPG or TrueCrypt to encrypt my file/files before I had even opened my browser.
    - Wade R
      
      My Canadian internet is slow enough as it is without using encryption.
    - Anyone
      
      encryption doesn’t slow down your connection as long as you have a decent CPU
    - Scary_Devil_Monastery
      
      @Whatever
      
      “Encryption is a very good idea however it is not easy.”
      
      Actually, it is. Far easier than you’d think. The main problem lies in coming up with a password or key long enough or complex enough to withstand a brute-force attempt without simultaneously being one you yourself stand at risk of forgetting. That, in my experience, is 90% of the difficulties in encryption.
      
      And this is what leads people to full-disk encrypt their hard drives with dual-layer encryption using AES and Twofish, then choose a password a simple dictionary attack resolves in twenty second. (DRM usually works like this and the staggering stupidity is that the end user is already provided with both the encrypted data and the deciphered one in the same package – which is why DRM can always be broken easily).
      
      Whereas if they’d chosen a passphrase like “4llr1ghtth1s1smy3ncrypt3dh4rddriv33at1tl0sers” the NSA could have their data centers churning over it until the sun starts fusing helium without getting anywhere.
      
      This is static data encryption, of course. And if you insist on ensuring that the passkey can never be handled by a vulnerable application, it can be applied in any other situation as well.
      
      The main issue when planning for security is that you run the risk of exposing your key everytime you pass it through a system. And this, when running a windows environment where you know nothing about the third-party applications running with full system access, is what allows malware to lift passwords and keyrings so easily.
      
      For full security you either need full knowledge of how your system operates – or the ability to do very little with it. This is why “security” obeys the golden rule of being inversely proportional to “convenience”.
      
      And it’s why hacking can succeed at all. Very few computers can be called “secure”.
    - http://gene-poole.tumblr.com Gene Poole
      
      I thought I had read that a password such as “4llr1ghtth1s1smy3ncrypt3dh4rddriv33at1tl0sers” was actually a very poor choice. While it is very long (and of course, even D0g…………………….. is a strong password when faced with brute force due to the entropy) that supplanting 1337speak was relatively easy at this point of the game, making them basically just dictionary words.
      
      For a strong password, the best option (or so I’ve heard) is to pick words that don’t exist in any dictionary, that you have a strong affinity for, making them easy to remember.
      
      For example, words you made up as a child, with an old playmate that you can still remember (of course chances are that the truly paranoid might not trust the NSA won’t stick your kindergarten pal in an interrogation room until they give up your extended childhood history, but what are the chances they’ll place the same significance to such events as you did?), and cram as many of those together with alternating upper/lower case and special characters. So though it would look like gobbledygook to anyone else, having a password such as “bRrrrtLLk~SkReeSkRee99pOingfOng?JaBoinka42″ would give you a level of entropy of 1.17 x 1083 (at least according to grc’s haystack) and take 3.73 hundred billion trillion trillion trillion trillion centuries to crack (at least under current computing standards) as a best case scenario, and 37.27 billion trillion trillion trillion trillion trillion centuries as a worst case.
      
      Point being, the more intimately personal you can make it, so that nobody but you could ever remember it or guess it, the stronger it is*
      
      *At least until you’re exported to Guantanomo to the rubber hose room, then they’d have it in 25 minutes, with a 15 minute smoke break
    - Scary_Devil_Monastery
      
      @Gene Poole
      
      “While it is very long (and of course, even D0g…………………….. is a strong password when faced with brute force due to the entropy) that supplanting 1337speak was relatively easy at this point of the game, making them basically just dictionary words.”
      
      Although that is correct, the point is that even using just the dictionary any attack will now have to guess whether there are 3 long words, 15 short ones, or the correct number of 8-9. As well as making the assumptions on whether all vowels are in numbers or just every other one etc.
      
      Basically a password becomes unbreakable by brute force as soon as you hit three words in length. The 133t speak merely adds another layer of complexity as it now means the computer has to guess twice for every vowel.
      
      For all intents and purposes as long as you avoid direct quotes and string together three words or a 20-digit sequence of numbers with only personal (and not well known) importance, you’re safe.
      
      @Wade R
      
      “My Canadian internet is slow enough as it is without using encryption.”
      
      Generally speaking almost any transfer speed is a bottleneck as is. Even on my 100 Mbit/sec connection my computer could have three out of four cores on idle while maxing the effective bandwidth.
      
      And after your CPU has encrypted the transfer, the actual transfer itself doesn’t load your bandwidth to any noticeable extent.
    - Whatever
      
      @ Scary_Devil_Monastery
      
      It is correct that creating a password is a big problem as half the internet needs a password for the most trivial things. And never use the same password for different places. The more passwords you need the worse it gets. (With TF at least commenting is still possible with a non existing E-mail address)
      
      With only one machine, one cable connection to modem/router connected to internet using VPN and one external drive the difficulty is considerably less. But now there are tablets, phones, home-servers and Wifi which are used a lot now.
      
      Here are some examples to consider after Truecrypt (and mega): backup, full system backup size, headless system restart after power failure, share access (smb safe?), all other netwerk traffic (external and internal). These are only just encryption issues. Try a secure FTP server setup for someone who can barely use normal FTP.
      
      @Gene Poole
      You can encrypt your entire HD with several partitions. It isn’t too difficult. The only issue is that there is no information was what happens to the MBR. You still want your system to boot afterwards. However from experience nothing bad happened (On XP). If you already have partitions filling the disk you would need to throw those away first.
      
      On the assumption that there is free space for new partitions:
      1. Make a backup if you want to be sure.
      2. Create a new primary partition from the windows disk manager. Don’t assign a letter or any other option such as choice of filesystem. The partition only needs to exist. (With extended you probably need to create another partition in the extended partition but i am not 100% sure)
      3. You can now choose it as a non system partition in Truecrypt.
      4. That’s all (you might want to auto-mount some of them).
cogg

i’m surprised the u.s. govt simply didn’t coerce csis and the rcmp into doing what it wants – physically seize the servers and abscond with them.
- xpmule
  
  I’m surprised they don’t just wait until its dark and sneak across the border in stealth choppers….
http://gene-poole.tumblr.com Gene Poole

Considering the US response to Kyle Goodwin’s request – snooping through his data – I think utilization of encryption at this point is essential. Simply using a service shouldn’t be enough to get you under the microscope, but of course the overreaching DOJ disagrees. What a fucking surprise
Guest

go Canada!
greetings from Russia
- xpmule
  
  Be glad your WAY over there and not sharing one of the longest borders with these bastards !
  
  Personally I’m a big fan of Russians ..greetings from Canada :)
  
  Many Russian web sites have the proper freedom of speech many of us in North America dream about and wish we had !
  - frozar
    
    Russia does share a pretty large border with the US
    - Guest
      
      only if you can swim. The Bering Strait is pretty large and the Russian side is a closed military zone. You land there without permission, you’re going to be arrested.
Truth

It does sound like the future of the Internet will be heavy duty encryption. Which at the end of the day will be a lot of energy being converted to heat to protect privacy which governments (and private corporations) seem to assume should not exist.
- Scary_Devil_Monastery
  
  Not so much. The extra energy consumer by encrypting data is normally negligible. From a security standpoint I welcome this as everyone gains from using more secure standards.
  
  To me this is the welcome equivalent of how we in the real world have learned to lock our doors.
  - Anuti
    
    While I like the idea, as soon as encryption becomes well known, someone will scream child porn, and that will be the end of that.
    - Whatever
      
      Like blobsnail, wannebeepirater and so on, they already scream that.
      
      Encryption will still exist but only for the DRM of approved companies.
    - ITakeAPotatoChipAndEatIt
      
      @Whatever
      
      Math/Encryption cannot be licensed as others have pointed out for various reasons in the past.
    - Scary_Devil_Monastery
      
      When encryption was first invented the US tried to scream “national security” because they realized sufficiently powerful encryption (actually rather easy to accomplish – google AES) would defeat any attempt by any national agency to decipher the data.
      
      Then they realized that even trying to ban math was futile and abandoned the attempt.
      
      Idiots paid by the MPAA/RIAA to act as lobbyists have tried to lift that idea as well – that encryption allows all manner of tomfoolery – and the response is the same. The only way you can prevent someone from communication in a way which can not be understood by certain parties is by removing the ability to communicate.
      
      In order to ban encryption there is one minimum requirement – ban math, along with computers and anything capable of performing calculations.
      
      And as there is no realistic way to tell that a transmission is encrypted without trying to open it i na few thousand formats and failing, the only way to ban encryption in practice will be to ban the internet.
      
      Further questions?
    - Whatever
      
      @ ITakeAPotatoChipAndEatIt & Scary_Devil_Monastery
      
      I think Anuti didn’t mean it will be the end because of licensing but more like the law in the UK. Give up your password or go to jail. It seems to me that he meant in future you won’t be “allowed” to use encryption (could be mistaken about this comment though)
      
      It is then to be except that for DRM purposes there will be an exemption (my reply). Nothing to do with copyrighting math/encryption, just politics. They can’t stop you using it like they can’t stop you speeding but you can convict you for it afterwards once the law changes.
      
      Going a bit further off topic here.
      
      On software/hardware level there is also a lot of effort going into that direction. A lot of newer devices are removing all user control so in future there may not be a choice. Microsoft blocks software on Win8 considered “incompatible”. Tablets depend on the “stores” for their software.
      
      Devices/software with the level of user control like arduino boards, linux, freebsd might not be available/allowed in future if the MAFIAA, terrorist and child abuse scare tactics work.
      
      How will you encrypt (without backdoor) anything without access to the required programs ?
chris_p_bacon(R.O.L.L)

gurny thispel gutty hotlink myshit getta doe bog hittlshiem fitworf dingle grubbles. now that is what i can ecryption
Ray186

I guess the Canadian Prime Minister didn’t want to have to end up publicly apologizing to Dot Com.
- bobmail
  
  What “I’m sorry your a fat f—cker who is trying to use our jurisdiction to hide your bad acts?”
  
  Yeah, that will go far.
  - Anyone
    
    that was in reference to the new zealand prime minister publicly apologizing to Dotcom
  - bobfemale
    
    You’ve got nothing have you? Not one damn thing on him. Time for you to get a new job I guess.
  - xpmule
    
    your nuts !
    
    you might as well say that about anyone..
    
    what if the court wanted to seize microsoft servers so they could read kdc’s emails ?
    
    you think its fair to expose everyone’s stuff just on a hunch and on a legal fishing expedition ?
    
    you blow me away with your consistently ridiculous garbage you post on here !
    
    Do you even read the dumb crap you post ?
    - bobmail
      
      Emails are different animals, seperate from corporate data. Yet, emails have been used plenty of times for legal action. Remember, the requirement for a warrant isn’t absolute certainty, it’s “believes” or “has a credible witness” or in this case, “has other documents that point to files on such and such a server”.
      
      You may want to study the law and learn how those things work.
    - xpmule
      
      bobmail
      
      “”different animals”"
      
      well well..
      
      different you say ?
      
      Like stealing and copying ?
      
      el oh el
    - Scary_Devil_Monastery
      
      “Remember, the requirement for a warrant isn’t absolute certainty, it’s “believes” or “has a credible witness” or in this case, “has other documents that point to files on such and such a server”.”
      
      So far the judiciary of every jurisdiction involved has come to the unanimous and in some cases very strongly worded conclusion that there is no credible witness, and no data to make it “believe” the case has enough basis to even warrant the search.
      
      And the DoJ, supposed to be on YOUR side here, are refusing steadfastly to provide any data which would back the assertion that Dotcom is a crook.
      
      So let me get this straight – what you are really saying is that the DoJ, had they presented a smidgeon of believable evidence, even circumstantial, would have been granted access as soon as they presented what evidence they have?
      
      Instead they are stalling, with every passing day making the credibility of the case drop even further, apparently having found nothing in the servers they DO possess which would make for even a makeshift excuse?
      
      “You may want to study the law and learn how those things work.”
      
      You yourself might want to do the same. You seem to have missed the fact that “because I say so” does not in itself constitute credible evidence or make for a believable witness. Meanwhile according to your criteria, we could raid any software company – or even the local Mom & Pop store – based on the bar you seem to set.
      
      Is this where you inform us you are an expert lawyer the same way you are an “expert” in IT in the same manner you so succintly “proved”?
    - http://gene-poole.tumblr.com Gene Poole
      
      having found nothing in the servers they DO possess which would make for even a makeshift excuse
      
      now hang on, they did find something.
      
      They found that Kyle Goodwin possessed mp3s that were constructed under the same conditions as some that were freely available on the pirate bay. That’s something right?
      
      Although the legality of such an investigation is a bit up in the air…isn’t there some sort of probable cause requirement in American law before they start snooping through your stuff?
    - Scary_Devil_Monastery
      
      @Gene Poole
      
      “…isn’t there some sort of probable cause requirement in American law before they start snooping through your stuff?”
      
      There is indeed. The very second the DoJ brought those servers onto US soil US rules of “search-and-seizure” applied.
      
      Meaning that should any US judge decide the evidence was obtained unlawfully, Dotcom could have a movie of himself sending terrorist plans carved on the skin of freshly murdered infants on those servers and it would be inadmissible in court.
      
      There are, as bobmail alludes to, legislation which will allow a legal case with evidence obtained in a manner normally considered unlawful. That, however, means the DoJ has to try Dotcom as an enemy combatant under the Patriot Act. Before a closed-court military tribunal.
      
      In Sweden it wouldn’t have mattered by which means the evidence was obtained, as the only thing that matters is whether the evidence itself is credible. In the US, very different rules apply.
      
      I’m thinking bobmail can not be a US citizen for him to miss such a fundamental (and commonly known) fact of US law.
      
      That means the best chance of nailing dotcom might be through a civil procedure – as with OJ simpson. Though that carries a potentially explosive backlash as that would mean Dotcom could countersue.
- Guest
  
  Not to mention he doesn’t want the Privacy Commissioner ripping him a new one and then the opposition having a go at him in Parliament.
T H J

http://oi49.tinypic.com/34shrhx.jpg
dondilly

When you consider the main servers (carpathia) are already down, you have to wonder what the DOJ hopes to achieve going after the canadian servers.

At least on the surface, it looks like the DOJ in a blind panic. Any data from nz raids has been ruled illegally obtained and should be inadmissable, even within the corrupt american legal system.

Even in the unlikely event they found something to tie mega to illegal activity, the DOJ see their USA data slipping through their fingers with the increasing likelyhood all their warrants are ruled illegal.

The feds right from the start assumed the extradition a formality and that they could then bully a plea to reduce the trumped up charges and avoid court with the added insurance that were the extradition to fail they could keep the assets in limbo but the wheels are coming off their too, leaving the DOJ with egg on their faces.
- Anon
  
  Even if every single thing you suggest actually turns out to be true and this case fails, don, it will simply prove to be a test case for future legislation to close the loopholes for the next case. This is the slow grinding forward of due process under the current state of the law. When did law fail to adapt over time to institutionalized malfeasance?
  
  An internet free-for-all with no purchase required of any digital product is the most unlikely future for this whole sad, lawless endeavour.
  - icec0ld
    
    “Even if every single thing you suggest actually turns out to be true and this case fails, don, it will simply prove to be a test case for future legislation to close the loopholes for the next case. This is the slow grinding forward of due process under the current state of the law. When did law fail to adapt over time to institutionalized malfeasance?”
    
    It’s likely that the US and DoJ will ever enter a quagmire like this ever again.
    
    “An internet free-for-all with no purchase required of any digital product is the most unlikely future for this whole sad, lawless endeavour.”
    
    In any market, there is no mandatory purchase of any product or service. Why would the internet be any different?
    - Anyone
      
      “In any market, there is no mandatory purchase of any product or service.”
      this is something none of the trolls seem to understand
      if I don’t want to buy your product there is nothing you can do to force me
    - bobmail
      
      “In any market, there is no mandatory purchase of any product or service. Why would the internet be any different?”
      
      In any market, these is not a manditory right to the product without paying. Why should the internet by any different?
      
      Nobody is trying to force mandatory purchases. Where do you get this shit from? The most you post, the more you look like an idiot.
    - Anyone
      
      @bobmail
      if I cut my own hair I don’t owe the barber shop any money
      if I cook my own dinner I don’t owe the local restaurant any money
      if I make a copy of the latest Lady Gaga song I don’t owe Lady Gaga any money
      
      is that really so hard to understand?
    - Guest
      
      @bobmail
      
      You’re joking, right? Your heroic executives loudly and proudly proclaimed that getting up to use the bathroom during television commercials is STEALING.
      
      How’s that campaign for Evan Stone working out?
    - icec0ld
      
      @Bobmail
      
      “In any market, these is not a mandatory right to the product without paying. Why should the internet by any different?”
      
      Because I’m not getting a product that has any market value?
      
      “The most you post, the more you look like an idiot.”
      
      Maybe you should get that checked out.
      
      Glass houses?
    - bobmail
      
      @anyone:
      
      “if I cut my own hair I don’t owe the barber shop any money
      if I cook my own dinner I don’t owe the local restaurant any money
      if I make a copy of the latest Lady Gaga song I don’t owe Lady Gaga any money”
      
      You were fine until the last one. Simple difference: The first you did it yourself. The last one you took someone else’s work without permission.
      
      If you go to the barber shop and use their tools to cut your hair, will they be mad?
      If you go to a restaurant and cook your dinner there, will the be mad?
      
      If you want music, make it yourself. Then it would be a compatible concept.
      
      How has is that to understand?
      
      “if I don’t want to buy your product there is nothing you can do to force me”
      
      You are correct, but it’s a simple problem: If you don’t pay for it, you don’t have the rights to it. You cannot have things all your own way, without respect for anyone else.
      
      It’s moronic and self-centered to think like that.
    - http://gene-poole.tumblr.com Gene Poole
      
      Ah, but if I paid for it, I (should) have the right to give a free copy away to my good buddy @Anyone. I paid for it, why can’t I do so?
      
      I’ve got some Australian friends. I really have no interest in it, but now I want to get them to upload some copies of The Great Gatsby for me to download. Just out of fucking spite.
    - Anyone
      
      @bobmail
      I also did the last one by myself
      I used my computer, my hard disk (that I paid a levy to the local MAFIAA for just this kind of scenario) and my internet connection to make my own copy
      
      true, someone else was nice enough to share the original with me for free. since noone is charging me for anything, why should I pay?
      
      now, if I found a way to download for free from itunes, you’d have a point
      they don’t offer their service for free (unlike the helpful friend from the other scenario), so in that case I would owe them money
      
      musicians are free to try and sell copies, and if they are not total assholes about it that will also work, see Trent Reznor as an example (he gave away his album for free, yet people still paid up to $300 for a copy of it)
      what they can’t do is dictate how I use my property or feel like they are entitled to my money
    - icec0ld
      
      @Bobmail
      
      “If you go to the barber shop and use their tools to cut your hair, will they be mad?”
      
      I believe he owns his own tools. Unnecessary.
      
      “If you go to a restaurant and cook your dinner there, will the be mad?”
      
      I believe he owns his own kitchen, Unnecessary.
      
      “If you want music, make it yourself. Then it would be a compatible concept.”
      
      That’s what he kinda does with the computer he owns, the sum of the parts of it and the data that comes to it and on it all at zero cost and without taking a penny from artists any where.
      
      Is cooking at home stealing money from our hard working restaurant? Is cutting your own hair robbing your barbers of their income? No. No more than downloading anything off the internet.
    - Scary_Devil_Monastery
      
      @bobmail
      
      “You were fine until the last one. Simple difference: The first you did it yourself. The last one you took someone else’s work without permission.
      
      If you go to the barber shop and use their tools to cut your hair, will they be mad?
      If you go to a restaurant and cook your dinner there, will the be mad?
      
      If you want music, make it yourself. Then it would be a compatible concept.”
      
      In all of the cases given above, the person in question uses his own tools but may be using a pattern he obtained by copying the result.
      
      And so it’s exactly the same situation.
      Though the barber and chef may have designed the recipe and developed the specific haircut they too have no complaints coming. Even if someone invents a machine which will, in the smallest detail, emulate the chef’s cooking, the barber’s haircut or the musicians song.
      
      Oh, dear, we’re talking about a computer, aren’t we? Possibly with a peripheral such as a DVD burner, a cooking machine, or an automated haircutter.
  - MadAsASnake
    
    Are you are saying that after all this the DOJ can’t actually find Mega guilty of any evidence of wrongdoing at all then the law should be changed so that something would be? What loophole do you see? I don’t see any.
    
    If media companies want to sell things, then they should get their products to market in a sensible and timely manner. What worked 30 years ago doesn’t work today – note in the UK, HMV, Jessops and Comet have all gone to the wall because they wouldn’t adapt.
  - Scary_Devil_Monastery
    
    “Even if every single thing you suggest actually turns out to be true…”
    
    Because so far, even the fact that the NZ prime minister publicly apologized for the unauthorized spying on Dotcom means the case is going forward to your satisfaction?
    Or that every news from NZ or the DoJ so far seems to indicate yet another nail in that case’s coffin?
    
    “… it will simply prove to be a test case for future legislation to close the loopholes for the next case.”
    
    You mean that a failure to prosecute a man without having any evidence of that man’s wrongdoing will turn into a test case on how to successfully prosecute a man without having any evidence of wrongdoing?
    
    Because that is what this “loophole” consists of.
    
    Anon simply wants to overturn burden of proof. Again. Why am I not surprised?
    
    That said I’m intrigued by the way our dear old Baghdad bob here keeps failing to notice just to which extent this case has presented an embarrassment for the DoJ. Before you can even get someone to embark on another Voyage Of Doom such as the case against Megaupload, you’d have to swap out the entire senior management of the DoJ. Right now those people all have eggs on their faces and are being asked hard questions.
    
    “An internet free-for-all with no purchase required of any digital product is the most unlikely future for this whole sad, lawless endeavour.”
    
    Actually, it’s not only a likely future but the only possible future while there still exists such a thing as the internet. Good one, Baghdad Bob. Saddam wholeheartedly applauds and will get around to sending your paycheck any day now. As soon as you get that M-1 Abrams off his lawn.
    
    [EDIT] Typo fixed.
    - True Evil
      
      “Right now those people all have eggs on their faces”
      
      And Aaron Swartz’s blood on their hands.
      Rot in hell Carmen Ortiz. Rot in hell.
    - http://gene-poole.tumblr.com Gene Poole
      
      Saddam wholeheartedly applauds and will get around to sending your paycheck any day now.
      
      So did they only kill his lookalike then? Or is he hanging with Tupac and Elvis?
    - Scary_Devil_Monastery
      
      @Gene Poole
      
      Ask “Anon”. I’m sure he thinks Elvis is in person hanging around, demanding a paycheck for the latest rips of his to appear on TPB.
      
      Actually Anon as a phenomenon would make sense if it turned out he was a spiritualist whose world view all came from channeling 16th-century catholic priests.
    - http://gene-poole.tumblr.com Gene Poole
      
      Henry the VIII was the man.
      
      I mean, apart from, you know, actually being “the man”, he had the balls to start his own church just so he could divorce his wife. I love it. When the letter he sends to the only authority higher than himself, the papacy, ends with “…and the horse you rode in on”, you have to give the man credit. That was JFK-grade sack right there.
    - Scary_Devil_Monastery
      
      @Gene Poole
      
      “When the letter he sends to the only authority higher than himself, the papacy, ends with “…and the horse you rode in on”, you have to give the man credit. That was JFK-grade sack right there.”
      
      True enough.
      
      Comparing to kings though, Anon does take the cake with his “George III” impression.
    - http://gene-poole.tumblr.com Gene Poole
      
      @Scary_Devil_Monastery
      impression is certainly the right word. I don’t for a second think Anon actually believes any of the shite he totes, which means he’s far from insane, so much as contrary. Poor guy just doesn’t get much attention and never learned the difference between positive and negative feedback.
  - Guest
    
    Seeing the words “due process” from your mouth is the funniest thing I will come across all day. It took a great deal of restraint to avoid laughing out loud in public.
    
    And speaking of, SOPA/PIPA was supposed to be that “future legislation” that removed pesky things like due process. How did that work out again?
  - Who
    
    “This is the slow grinding forward of due process under the current state of the law. An internet free-for-all with no purchase required of any digital product is the most unlikely future for this whole sad, lawless endeavour.”
    
    YEP you DON’T READ what the LAW actually says. you have made it clear that you are ONLY for the UNLAWFUL practices of the entertainment industries.
  - Anon
    
    “An internet free-for-all with no purchase required of any digital product is the most unlikely future for this whole sad, lawless endeavour.”
    
    nice try, it may not be as easily accessable but it will still be around. The only way to eliminate piracy is to get rid of electronics but then it would go to physical piracy more, and that percentage is even higher than online piracy, which peaks at 3% or less worldwide for broadband. The phisical piracy worldwide is 30-35% so u are saying that you do not care about the phicical piracy as much bc u dumb mafiaa shithieads spend tons of money attackign the internet from all angles, which only make more people not like you. I think you mafiaa people have shit for brains.
  - ThumbsUpThumbsDown
    
    What future legislation?
    
    Think you’re going back for PIPA, ACTA, SOPA, CISPA, and TPP?
    
    The Political Hacks have been warned NOT to come back with replacements for the Constitution.
    
    The News is out!!
    
    Efforts to revivify those disgraces are exactly what will trigger a general reassessment on A) Revocation of Corporate Charters for malfeasance; B) Break-up of non-manufacturing monopolies, C) Abolition of Perpetual Copyright; and, D) Revision of Corporate Standing to provide EXPLICITLY that Corporations are NOT People and have NONE of the Constitutional Rights of Human Beings.
    
    Those Revisions WILL come invariably; but, they will come MUCH quicker if these Corporate Monopolies make another sustained assault on Constitutional Rights.
  - xpmule
    
    sell any digital products you want..
    
    keep your hands out of my pocket though and
    what i do with file sharing is none of your business !
    
    we will be fighting for a free internet forever regardless so you point / comment is load of bullshit ..again
    
    wanna make money then go ahead but don’t make up fake lost revenue claims and parade them around as fact and then use that to terrorize and extort money from people !
    
    the future is spank you pretty hard.. THAT is what is gonna happen sweet heart ;)
- bobmail
  
  “At least on the surface, it looks like the DOJ in a blind panic. Any data from nz raids has been ruled illegally obtained and should be inadmissable, even within the corrupt american legal system.”
  
  That really isn’t the case.
  
  See, there is a simple issue here: The raids were not illegal under US law, ie no US laws were broken to do the raids, and the information once provided to the US law enforcement from third party sources is “in” generally.
  
  There is plenty of ways to argue, such as inevitable discovery, that even without the gonzo style raids that it’s likely that computers would have been seized, and so on.
  
  It may or may not be legal in NZ, but it really isn’t hurting the case in the US.
  - MadAsASnake
    
    And you think NZ will grant extradition where the only (if any) evidence was stolen from NZ court custody?
    
    True, it’s not hurting the case at all. There is no case to hurt.
  - icec0ld
    
    As pointed out already, stolen evidence from NZ after explicit court orders not do so.
    
    A refusal to hand over evidence as required by NZ fair trial laws
    
    Constant delays of the case.
    
    They have painted themselves as the worst kind of prosecution and as such, NZ is unlikely to hand Kim Dotcom over to the US with them acting with such reckless regard for NZ citizens and their property.
  - Guest
    
    “The raids were not illegal under US law”
    
    Uh, no. Raiding a fully legal business under full DMCA safe harbor protection, with no evidence of wrong-doing, is in fact all kinds of illegal under U.S. law.
    
    Okay, so neither you nor the DoJ give the slightest shit about that, but it’s still true.
    - bobmail
      
      You assume they have no evidence of wrongdoing. I can see what Fat Kim was doing, and there is plenty of evidence of copyright violation, willfully igorance toward infringing files when informed (only removing links to a common file for the reported page, but leaving the copyright file up), and laundering money by paying his own companies through a commission scheme intended to make the money look legit.
      
      Of course, you can ignore all that….
    - http://gene-poole.tumblr.com Gene Poole
      
      only removing links to a common file for the reported page, but leaving the copyright file up
      
      As you’ve been told before, this is how file lockers work . There is nothing suspicious of that. If I upload a copy of the independant film I’ve made to dropbox, and someone uploads it to pirate bay, and I ask for it to be taken down, I don’t want them deleting my copy, that I have full rights to, from their servers.
      
      To avoid redundancy, file lockers check the hash or files uploaded. If they’re duplicates to files already existing on their servers, instead of keeping multiple copies, they just link to the existing copy. Maybe the technology needs to be changed (and file lockers would get much more expensive were that so, as space would then become a premium commodity) but MegaUpload certainly can’t be faulted for operating their business in line with the rest of the industry. Unless you’re either a retard or deliberately obtuse, You should know this.
    - Anyone
      
      @bobmail
      all the facts so far point towards them having no evidence whatsoever
      the prosecution was the only party that has been sentenced so far, sadly without much effect
      
      also, you are disregarding fair use
      how should MegaUpload know if a file on their server is breaking copyright law? sure, if they share the link to that file with people they are probably breaking it, that’s why they get a DMCA notice, but other people might have different reasons to have that file on Megaupload, personal backup of their bought files, for example, why should they be deleted as well?
    - icec0ld
      
      “You assume they have no evidence of wrongdoing”
      
      Funny. You seem to think they do.
      
      ” I can see what Fat Kim was doing, and there is plenty of evidence of copyright violation, willfully igorance toward infringing files when informed ”
      
      You mean being told by the FBI not touch evidence and then having said evidence be named as evidence against them not touching files? That’s called bad faith and planting evidence.
      
      “only removing links to a common file for the reported page, but leaving the copyright file up”
      
      That is what the DMC is for. To notify hosters that infringing content/links are on their site and take action. Megaupload did infact respond to DMCs regularly.
      
      Saying “only when asked” is bullshit. Youtube only pulls infringing content when asked. This is because it has been put at the feet of content holders to seek their content and regulate it themselves through the use of the DMC.
      
      “Laundering money by paying his own companies through a commission scheme intended to make the money look legit”
      
      Based on what? The US as of yet has only provided allegations but no proof of this.
    - Scary_Devil_Monastery
      
      @bobmail
      
      “You assume they have no evidence of wrongdoing.”
      
      If they did, no court in the western world would refuse to hand over the data belonging to Dotcom.
      
      And yet both Canada and the NZ are doing so.
      
      “I can see what Fat Kim was doing, and there is plenty of evidence of copyright violation, willfully igorance toward infringing files…”
      
      Well, unfortunately what you personally think is wrong is not necessarily wrong in the eyes of the law. If the DoJ shared even a tenth of your views they would have had no trouble at all extracting data and cooperation from other western nations.
      
      “…only removing links to a common file for the reported page, but leaving the copyright file up…”
      
      This is how the DMCA works. Or are you saying that person A points a finger, makes a random accusation, and without presentation of proof, agency B deletes the actual property of person C?
      
      Do you also claim that your landlord, being informed that people have been pilfering the storage rooms, decides to junk whatever is in those rooms?
      
      “…and laundering money by paying his own companies through a commission scheme intended to make the money look legit.”
      
      Sounds like “Hollywood accounting” then. Apparently a fully legal way of maneuvering money. Or, for that matter, like a bank or lottery.
      If your beef is with half of how the economy moves and that ordinary finance should not be legal, then that is another story.
      
      But right now you are pointing fingers at full DMCA compliance and legal fiscal maneuvers. And trying to claim that the DMCA enables a copyright holder to order the property of another to be destroyed.
  - http://gene-poole.tumblr.com Gene Poole
    
    Assuming everything you’re saying is accurate, that won’t mean a god damned thing if the extradition doesn’t go through. You can try and convict someone for any crime you want in absentia, but enforcing it is another thing entirely. Just as Geneva can’t get ahold of Bush, when the extradition debate is finished the US won’t be able to do a thing about Kim. Unless they pull a Zero Dark Thirty on him, which, let’s be honest, I can totally see the DOJ doing. Apparently the US no longer understands the concept of proportionality, just look at Aaron Swartz.
  - Scary_Devil_Monastery
    
    “See, there is a simple issue here: The raids were not illegal under US law, ie no US laws were broken to do the raids, and the information once provided to the US law enforcement from third party sources is “in” generally.”
    
    And the US, then having access to vast parts of Megaupload, now can not or will not show any evidence sufficiently powerful to warrant Canadian authorities handing over servers.
    
    Now why on earth would a prosecutor go fishing for more evidence while refusing to give any good reason as to cause?
    
    The answer is, of course, that no sane prosecutor would, if that prosecutor had anything at all he could show to get his hands on remaining evidence.
    
    Meanwhile the DoJ sits in stony silence, apparently scrambling madly for anything they could nail Dotcom on which wouldn’t sound completely ridiculous.
    
    [EDIT] Oh, and while at it, if Dotcom can claim the seizures were illegal under US law – which is not unlikely at all, given the lack of evidence presented by the DoJ, then the exclusionary rule applies.
    
    So the DoJ has, at this time, a very urgent need to actually present both reasons for their investigation and evidence.
    
    I’m not sure what makes you claim US law doesn’t apply when seizing foreign property. There is ample precedence to say that it does.
Logan B

BRING ON SATURDAY/SUNDAY!!!
MadAsASnake

You have to ask what they think they will find. If they don’t know (pretty sure they don’t) then it is simply a fishing expedition. There are very few companies in the world that would survive an attack like this.However, it’s looking more and more like a “WMD moment” for Biden.
Hogspace

The Canuks can be quite useful on occasion. They are no respecters of US hegemony either.
markh

Interesting that no trol has replied to this. Perhaps they only talk when the law is on their side
- US Fails Again
  
  Or when they feel like expressing their opinion that the outdated system they use (CDs) is the way forward and censorship is a must in order to pay their bills. Booofuckinhooo
  - MadAsASnake
    
    HMV just folded. Didn’t adapt. Died.
    - bobmail
      
      Yeah, bastards couldn’t figure out how to adapt to the vast majority of their past customers turning to digital shoplifting.
      
      Sucks to be them. Another example perhaps of how piracy hurts real people. 4000+ people are going to be looking for jobs.
    - http://gene-poole.tumblr.com Gene Poole
      
      In other news, gramaphone factories are all out of business. I blame the filthy fucking pirates.
    - Anyone
      
      how can you commit digital shoplifting?
      hacking itunes and deleting their “master files”?
    - MadAsASnake
      
      @bobmail
      
      And what do you base that on? I think you will find 3 culprits ahead of “Piracy”
      1 iTunes (and other digital shops)
      2 spotify (and other streaming services)
      3 amazon (and other online shops)
      
      … or do you want all those sales channels criminalised and banned too?
    - xpmule
      
      “Yeah, bastards couldn’t figure out how to adapt to the vast majority of their past customers turning to digital shoplifting.
      
      Sucks to be them. Another example perhaps of how piracy hurts real people. 4000+ people are going to be looking for jobs.”
      
      you say BOBMAIL ???
      
      do you have a mental disability ?
      are you missing the fact that these companies could be going out of business simply because of technology advancement ?
      i was watching an old rerun episode of The King Of Queens and in season 7 episode 19 Carrie gives Arthur a portable CD Player and he says “great another one of your obsolete hand me downs”
      Some how i guess that translates directly into the fact that pirates killed the cd player and the industry and killed peoples jobs etc
      
      Bob
      say more dumb crap so i can embarrass you publicly ..AGAIN
    - Tactical Nuclear Penguin
      
      @ bobmail
      Perhaps you would like to read these biased stories from the BBC
      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-21028803
      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-21021073
      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-21030442
      Whilst downloading music is mentioned, piracy or filesharing doesn’t rate much of a mention.
      The commentators all appear to agree that HMV didn’t adapt to online sales where apparently half the market is now, they couldn’t compete with the supermarkets on price and they expanded into other areas of sales which were detrimental to their core business of selling physical music. It just so happens that they were the last of the major record stores to close, after many other famous names such as Virgin shut their doors.
      Sadly for the legacy music industry the demise of another legacy retailer such as HMV won’t be missed by most of the public. Not too many people miss the vinyl records of yesteryear, and as were go into the future the same will happen with CD’s.
      Who knows what technology the grandchildren of todays MP3 youth will be using, Wi-Fi connected brain implants? that those youth will think of MP3′s as so oldfashioned.
    - Pinocchio’s Grandma
      
      @bobmail
      ” 4000+ people are going to be looking for jobs.”
      
      4000+ MAFIAA shills/copyright gangsters/lobbyists/lawyers out of a job? OH NOES
    - MadAsASnake
      
      @Tactical Nuclear Penguin
      
      I miss the old LP’s. Unfortunately the music industry settled with CD’s which in some important respects are not as good. It is a shame that given the ubiquity of high density data support around today, that genuine high quality digital remains something of a niche. The the music industry innovated rather than harping on about the old days, they might actually find new products that people want.
    - Tactical Nuclear Penguin
      
      @MadAsASnake
      “I miss the old LP’s. Unfortunately the music industry settled with CD’s which in some important respects are not as good. ”
      And so say the CD lovers when they talk about the MP3 format. Who will no doubt complain when CD’s are removed from sale in the future.
    - MadAsASnake
      
      @Tactical Nuclear Penguin
      
      I don’t miss the big delicate 12 inchers themselves. CD’s do not sound as good (to me – thats a whole different debate), and MP3′s aren’t even in the ballpark.
      
      What I want is:
      - the sound stage and reality of vinyl
      - + the non-comressed notion of CD’s
      - + the data file format of MP3′s
      
      Give me that and I’ll be happy. You can always down-rip for iPod’s and such, but you can’t go up. DVD-A could have got close, but that got little support from the industry, and add way to much DRM.
      
      All this bandwidth and we get MP3…. arrrgh.
    - Scary_Devil_Monastery
      
      @bobmail
      
      “Sucks to be them. Another example perhaps of how piracy hurts real people. 4000+ people are going to be looking for jobs.”
      
      News flash. With the advent of the automobile, every coach line driver grumbling over how the filthy things are stealing the bread from their mouths.
      
      In France a new turn on the industrial revolution. Textile workers throwing their clogs in the delicate machinery of the spinning machines. Seamstresses in tears because the automation is removing the need for their services.
      
      As one major bank after another crashes in the great depression and brokers fall like gentle rain from skyscraper windows, this journalist got hold on a surviving banker, climbing out of his window with a poleaxed expression “It’s just not fair – everyone still wants money but there’s only one job left in a thousand in this industry”.
      
      Presidents, prime ministers and other assorted heads of state really need to stop this “progress” thing.
    - SoundnuoS
      
      @MadAsASnake
      
      We got Mp3 because it was easy to pirate and you can fit a sh*tload on an Mp3-player. DVD-audio and SA-cd never got off the ground because the buying public appreciated the convenience factor and pirateability of Mp3 more, fidelity be damned.
      Goes to show that technology doesn’t always progress…
    - http://gene-poole.tumblr.com Gene Poole
      
      Betamax was the video cassette format with the highest quality, but unfortunately Sony’s revenue demands were too high (sound familiar?) and they were undercut by JVC’s VHS format. Then VHS came out with longer tapes, which was what the public wanted, since they could fit more on a tape and, when video rentals became more commonplace, it was cheaper to rent one 2 hour VHS tape than to rent two 1 hour Betamax tapes. then of course the porn industry got behind VHS and it was a done deal.
      
      Just goes to show you that giving the customer what they want sets the industry standard. technological advances are just one piece of the puzzle.
      
      And it’s not always piracy, either. in videogames in the 80s and 90s Nintendo’s NES held its own against the superior SEGA Genesis console for years, simply because Nintendo maintained superior quality in their finished product. Due to the proprietary format of their cartridges it was virtually impossible to pirate anything for their system at the time. It (again) all came down to customer demand. Ironically Nintendo failed in the later 90s when Sony brought the Playstation to market with studio quality sound and superior graphics, while Nintendo had to stick with the inferior cartridge format. The public wanted better quality, so the Playstation became the dominant system.
      
      It’s ALWAYS about giving the consumers what they want. Piracy only occurs when you fail to sell to the consumers what they want at a price they’re willing to pay.
      
      As far as mp3 goes, do your research if you were too young to remember. mp3 players came along well after the format was accepted by the public. It was accepted due to the size of hard drives at the time, to save on drive space. mp3 players became popular because they didn’t skip like a cd player did, because before mp3 players people were burning mp3s to blank CDs
    - SoundnuoS
      
      @Gene Poole
      
      Just pointing out that the superior format won’t automatically triumph. And sometimes the reason is piracy.
      I’m not too young to remember when mp3 became mainstream. Without piracy it would never have taken off the way it did.
- Anon
  
  There was a silly comment yesterday to the effect that the Canadian Court had refused to cooperate. That’s a mischaracterization. The article simply states “an expert” will review the data first for pertinence to the trial. What’s unreasonable about that?
  
  Any bets that the pertinent data is eventually turned over to the US DOJ? Of course it will be. The US would pass evidence it held to Canada in a Canadian criminal case, too, naturally. This is all so much pirate crowing about nothing.
  
  Think of it as less parsing work for the US DOJ. The “expert” will do all the sorting for them first!
  - icec0ld
    
    “Any bets that the pertinent data is eventually turned over to the US DOJ? Of course it will be. The US would pass evidence it held to Canada in a Canadian criminal case, too, naturally. This is all so much pirate crowing about nothing”
    
    They will be required btw to disclose this evidence to NZ courts to continue his extradition case. That is of course if they want to obtain it.
    
    Canada is most likely going to attempt to keep from playing any significant role in the Mega-upload case, after all if the seizure of evidence was illegal in NZ, what is to say it wasn’t any where else.
    
    “There was a silly comment yesterday to the effect that the Canadian Court had refused to cooperate. That’s a mischaracterization. The article simply states “an expert” will review the data first for pertinence to the trial. What’s unreasonable about that?”
    
    He’ll likely notice it’s largely irrelevant to anything the US courts are interested in and likely see through this transparent attempt at the invasion of privacy of the data of millions users world wide.
    
    With any luck they’ll flat out refuse to hand over more of Megauploads property without more reason
    
    This whole case with Megaupload has been one big Mega joke on the USs case and their conduct thus far.
  - MadAsASnake
    
    It’s like this
    – DOJ: we need info on x (where x is very tightly defined)
    – Can: we found this / no doc relevant
    Anything else is a fishing expedition
  - Guest
    
    “There was a silly comment yesterday to the effect that the Canadian Court had refused to cooperate.”
    
    You mean this comment “Canadian Court Rejects U.S. Government Demand for Full Access to Megaupload Servers Seized in Canada: http://www.michaelgeist.ca/con…” to which you replied “That’s a false headline, gets your facts straight. The Canadian Court asked for a more refined request for access to the data on the servers. They didn’t “reject” anything.” To which was replied “They Canadian Court REJECTED the US demand for FULL access request but then the Canadian Court asked for a more refined request. So the Canadian Court DID REJECT the US government demand for FULL access as per stated in the headline. It is you that should get your facts right Anon!”
    
    The headline was right with stating that the Canadian Court rejected the US demand for Full access request. The Canadian Court did REJECT full access but then decided that the 2 parties should negotiate as to what should be handed over and if not then it will go back before the judge to decide.
    
    The headline was correct but you of course throw your toys out of the pram at anything that shows the US government to be failing with regards to Megaupload.
    
    As for saying the comment was silly then being as the headline and comment was correct then your comments you make on here must be really silly and stupid, No wonder you get a lot of unpleasant comments on here.
  - Anon Im Your Biggest Fan
    
    Anon I have been watching you and following your posts. I have to admit I agree with what you say and am a big fan and admire your words of wisdom you write to these neanderthals and unintellectual people and uninformed people that we have here. like pearls before swine. your superrior wisdom is far greater than these ingrates deserve but you pity them and that is good. Let me ask you how do I become like you? How do I get to learn to become so cold hearted and selfish and so self centered over greed that I lose the sight of sharing and helping others and kindness to all? I want to learn! Teach Me O great one! Your servant is listening to the becon of your call! Pour out thy wisdom So I might Learn!
    - Scary_Devil_Monastery
      
      Unfortunately Anon’s ears redirect to 127.0.0.1 so he’s unlikely to hear your fervent pleas for help.
      
      However, you are in luck. In order to become just like Anon, only two steps need to be taken.
      
      1) Put head between large hammer and anvil.
      2) Drop hammer.
    - Jimmy671
      
      SARCASM…..I hope
Guest

MAFIAA: What!? The Canadian courts are obeying due process!? Goddamnit, I’m gonna get Obama on the phone and order him to bomb Canada this instant!
- ken147
  
  We’ll bomb them with freedom.
RoestVrijStaal

I wish Canada good luck. Equinix is an USA corporation with headquarters in DMCAland.

Protip: Stay away from webhosting companies, (virtual) server renters, Domain sellers/registars and ISPs which have ties with USA companies, because Patriot Act.
- http://profile.typepad.com/6p0120a5509de8970c ミッコ
  
  Stay away from the cloud owned by microsoft, apple, google, amazon, …
imaginaryGHOST

Well, seeing as how our Cuntservative Prime Minister recently passed a new copyright law bill that allows for copyright lawsuits (and we in fact have a mass lawsuit brewing right now w/ Voltage and TechSavvy), I wouldn’t get so happy about Canada just yet.
- ThumbsUpThumbsDown
  
  Hard to believe this guy was really elected….
- Jerry Levinbloomstein
  
  The tories are more left-wing than most other countries left-wing parties.
  
  Cameron is a tool.
  - imaginaryGHOST
    
    No, the tories are just as right wing here as the GOP in the States. The only difference is that our courts still abide by our bill of rights, and so the cons can’t really do everything they want to yet. But the’ve already gutted out environmental policies (Canada is almost dead-last compared to the world in enviro-health), raised retirement age, are looking into cutting pensions, gutted refugee health protections, introduced massive tough-on-crime bullshit bills to populate the privatized prisons they are “looking into,” are approving massive Chinese takeovers of our resources, are relaxing gun controls, doing secret behind closed doors deals, such as FIPA and TPP…. the list goes on and on.
    
    I didn’t even go into all the conflict of interest, voter intimidation/misinformation and corruption charges that have been repeatedly laid against our gov’t. Fuck Harper and his Cons, they are ruining this once-beautiful country.
    
    I have to confess that my knowledge of British politics is laughably inadequate. Can you enlighten me as to why the UK cons, and Cameron, are so evil?
MadAsASnake

DOJ aren’t doing well in front of judges are they?
Dondotcom

How many times do you need told to stop reporting on organised crime – file sharing – and Don Dotcom are not the same fucking thing! FFS you lower the moral high ground with this shit. HOW MANY FUCKING TIMES!!!!!

While I respect the Don for building a crime empire and fucking with the USA I do not think he gives a shit about anything but cash like any mafia boss. He is happy to get all the authorities wound up to fuck and thus cause file sharing hurt in the process.

YOU KNOW WHAT HAPPENS TO DONS IN THE MOVIES RIGHT?
- ThumbsUpThumbsDown
  
  Are you sure you’re not Anon in disguise?
- Just a pawn
  
  The enemy of my enemy is my friend…
  - More than a prawn
    
    More accurately, the enemy of my enemy is my temporary ally in this particular case.
- EveryonesACritic
  
  I totally agree with you dondotcom in everything you have said except for these paragraphs.
  ————————————————————————————————————–
  How many times do you need told to stop reporting on organised crime – file sharing – and Don Dotcom are not the same fucking thing! FFS you lower the moral high ground with this shit. HOW MANY FUCKING TIMES!!!!!
  
  While I respect the Don for building a crime empire and fucking with the USA I do not think he gives a shit about anything but cash like any mafia boss. He is happy to get all the authorities wound up to fuck and thus cause file sharing hurt in the process.
  
  YOU KNOW WHAT HAPPENS TO DONS IN THE MOVIES RIGHT?
  ——————————————————————————————————————–
  
  You seem to know alot about mobster movies but did you forget that when you are fighting corrupt governments it helps to have a little bit of dough stashed away? Just take a look at google. nothing messes around with you when you are loaded with cash. so I have to disagree in a way. I would talk longer about Kim speeches he has made in his videos about his beliefs but im still questioning the legitimacy of your post and its motives. So I end my post here. (This post is protected by a Fire Extinguisher if necessary)
Who

I don’t understand Y every one is praising Canada as its clear that there justice department is similar to the US as they have already allowed one of there corporations to sue US universities for copyright infringement and many other things that is similar. or did you all forget about all that stuff?

http://torrentfreak.com/search/canada
MadAsASnake

Jailtime if they do. Especially McBride, if there is any justice.
Violated0

This MegaUpload case is a good time for any county’s Count system to show what a good Justice system they have to the entire World, when the USA is always doing badly in this case, just by slapping their bad acts back.

Naturally the USA’s own Justice system needs to take a stand and to point out that the US Administration can’t just do anything they want when they need to follow the rules of law.

This is a case of the end does not justify the means in that you can’t catch bad people by being bad yourself.
Guest

NZ has ordered the US to return all the data it copied and took out of NZ after it was declared that the warrants were illegal when it seized the data in the raid of Dotcoms home and then when it is returned back to NZ it is to be sorted through by soneone to decide what is relevant to the case or not.

Germany rejected the request of the US to allow them access to the servers there.

Canada has now rejected the full access request of the US to the servers there but has told the US to negotiate with Megaupload for what is relevant or not.

Not so big now are you US.
ObamaSuxasPOTUS

And of course they don’t ask for the servers of Youtube even though Youtube is responsible for more downloads of music than any other pirate site in existence.
foff

This whole thing is bullshit from hell! What did megaupload do that all the other cyberlockers don’t do? They store files and allow files to be shared period. None of them purposely solicit any specific file nor do they advertise any specific file is available nor do they index any files. Will all of you mafiaa fuck trolls try to tell us exactly what is crimminal about this.

Hey you mafiaa turds your specious arguments about facilitating copyright infringement are just plain not true. As I have said before a cyberlocker needs to make money on sharing or people who use the service and do not store data as you cannot have a viable business just storing data. There is nothing wrong or illegal with offering incentives to uploaders that bring you business. There is no basis to declare this whole model crimminal. After all this is how the industry makes money. They encourage artists to make recordings then take almost all the revenue. Why is this not illegal?

The reason for the new mega encryption is so they don’t have to hassle with the ridiculous take down bullshit orders.
- xpmule
  
  i think it was because he flaunted his cash which got the US govt’s attention.. then they assumed he was doing something wrong to get the money and went on to prove it after the fact. Guilty until proven innocent !
Rekrul

Of course, if the servers ARE given to the US, it will probably cherry pick what it wants off of them, and then have them destroyed, along with all the data on them.
- MadAsASnake
  
  Funny thing is … they want to trash those
  - Violated0
    
    That is more correctly they used to want the data destroyed. However due public condemnation they backed down and no longer want the data destroyed when they now see the same objective can met simply by denying people from ever see their data again.
    
    In this road block plan they then make flawed claims like the files held on these servers are not actually your property when they belong to the hosting company which is a bizarre claim to make seeing how the whole case is about copyright ownership and enforcement,
    
    One rule for the MPAA/RIAA and one rule for everyone else it seems.
    - MadAsASnake
      
      They won’t destroy it due to the public condemnation, but they clearly don’t want it seeing the light of day. I suspect that the main concern is to deny KDC support for his defense and that they couldn’t care less who owns them.
      
      MPAA/RIAA and many of the other copyright maximalists want “special” status for their concerns but totally disregard even simple existing rights for others. And they wonder why more people are treating their arguments with contempt
KiRE

watch out ‘nuks, don’t think for a minute that the us wont come and make you change your bacon !!
- xpmule
  
  I’ll be eating “Freedom” Bacon soon enough I’m sure..
USA_ARE_TERRORISTS

USA seriously needs a SH!T TON of sanctions against them. Let’s all help to put the final nail in the collapse of the land of the terrorists once and for all.
- xpmule
  
  unrealistic..
  
  we need to be patient as much as possible with the American population until they can get a leash on their government.. like an owner not taking care to control their dog they need to tighten up the leash and give Obama & crew a slap on the nose with a rolled up news paper for peeing on the carpet of the world.
Asashii

Public websites are a bitch arent they!!!
Bobywillis

O Canada!
Our home and native land!
True patriot love in all thy system IO commands.
With glowing hearts we see thee rise,
The True North strong and free!
From far and wide,
O Canada, we stand on guard for thee protecting your privacy.
God keep our land glorious and free!
O Canada, we stand on guard for thee against the American Greed.
O Canada, we stand on guard for thee.
Numnutz

GOD DOES EXIST, HIS NAME IS KIM DOTCOM.
jishubuhao

http://ur1.ca/c4ee0
Go Canada

Today I’m proud to be Canadian :)

TorrentFreak

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Canadian Court Refuses to Ship Megaupload Servers to the US

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